Would it be easier than the i3 though? This thread is comparing the two. Even with rhe range extender you'd be stopping every hour for gas. The i3 probably does make a better European city car due to the smaller size as mentioned.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Would it be easier than the i3 though? This thread is comparing the two. Even with rhe range extender you'd be stopping every hour for gas. The i3 probably does make a better European city car due to the smaller size as mentioned.
I must care, as I use it every day. It's perfect in stop/go CITY driving, for which it was designed. The i3 can smoothly bring itself to a complete stop. It's like having a tractor beam tied to the car in front. The European version can even steer by itself in traffic...the US version removes that ability.
Mario Kadastik
Active Member
Cruise control? Wouldn't that keep the car going at a nice steady speed and use regen to get the perfect amount of power back that is available? I would actually prefer Tesla's regen to be even stronger if possible as you can fine tune it with the amount you release the pedal. And actually the simulated regen is a good idea and should be mentioned to Tesla because one of the things I hate right now about the range charge or cold weather is the fact that the car coasts instead of breaking and therefore I have to adjust my driving style to the temperature/battery level. If the car gave me the same kind of braking power no matter the conditions, then that'd be nice.
kevincwelch
Active Member
Don't be surprised.
Every Internet forum needs to have its fanboys and fangirls.
The main thing (for me) killing other "EVs" like the i3 and Volt is it only seats 4. I looked at the i3, Volt and even Plug in Panamera ONLY 4 seats!!! If the Volt could hold 5 I probably would have have gone with it because I would have gotten a quicker ROI. But I still didn't want to use gas. Instead I got a MS60 and LOVE it.
I'm 6'4" and I'm okay (just) in the back seat of the Tesla. I'd definitely get the pano roof, though, as it adds significant rear seat headroom.
You must have sat in the back of an S with the pano roof. In my S with no pano at 6'2" I cannot sit up straight in the rear seats. I would not want to sit in the back of my car for very long. Fortunately I am always in the drivers seat.
HyperMiler
Member
i3 likes and limitations
The i3 is quite a zippy drive, compared to the Leaf, which is already good at starting from the red light. Suspension seems soft at first, but because of the low center of gravity, that is not a limitation. The light weight makes directional changes fun. In addition it is a rear wheel drive vehicle, under load in corners can give you a hint of oversteer.
Great fun on country roads. The hybrid synchronous reluctance electric motor is quite a cool design, probably the best principle used in any BEV currently. The front seat passenger position is very comfortable and variable. Extremely easy to park, shorter than a Mini.
That said, the design issues tend to overshadow its usefulness sometimes. In narrow spaces, the rear doors can not be opened, and never separately from the front doors. Trunk space is rather limited, and the (baby) frunk is not very effectively shielded from the elements. It is more of a regional transport 2+2 seater, and a bit expensive for that. But quite an achievement for an ICEmaker!
The Model S is in a completely different, higher, class, in value, speed, size, range, reputation. A better car, altogether.
Great fun on country roads. The hybrid synchronous reluctance electric motor is quite a cool design, probably the best principle used in any BEV currently. The front seat passenger position is very comfortable and variable. Extremely easy to park, shorter than a Mini.That said, the design issues tend to overshadow its usefulness sometimes. In narrow spaces, the rear doors can not be opened, and never separately from the front doors. Trunk space is rather limited, and the (baby) frunk is not very effectively shielded from the elements. It is more of a regional transport 2+2 seater, and a bit expensive for that. But quite an achievement for an ICEmaker!
The Model S is in a completely different, higher, class, in value, speed, size, range, reputation. A better car, altogether.
So if Tesla raised the price of Model S to $250,000 you would still buy it? This is only a plausible argument if you assume that all can afford a Model S and everything else is equal. That is not the case. Implying to folks that they are putting their family's lives at risk by driving something other than a Model S is not productive and isn't going to sell more Teslas.
- - - Updated - - -
So buy it as a personal car, take the credit, and then sell it on paper to your business for continued deductions.
- - - Updated - - -
If a Model S can't get you there, an i3 or Leaf is even farther behind. Yes?
- - - Updated - - -
The end result being that drivers forget how to drive and pay even less attention to the road than they are paying now. Why bother braking when the car does it for you automatically? Except, when the car doesn't.
William13
Active Member
I have not driven the i3. It looks funky, not exactly the same as ugly. (ie it's looks could grow on me.). If I did not have the money for a Tesla, I would hope to buy the i3 which is compromised but built from the ground up as an electric car. This is where/why I give BMW credit.
I wrote (regarding the i3's adaptive cruise control):
AmpedRealtor responded:
An old argument, but let's explore and see where it leads.
I've forgotten how to send morse code. Used to know back when I was a lad, but now I can just use Twitter. But, one day the 'net won't work, and then how will I communicate?
I've forgotten how to milk a cow. I just get on the 'net and have Peapod deliver nice fresh milk every week. Don't have to get cozy with Bessie at 5 AM anymore. But, one day Peapod won't come and then whatever will I do?
I've forgotten how to change the ink on a typewriter. I've forgotten how to code in FORTRAN. I've forgotten how to thread a movie projector, how to develop black and white photographic film, how to use the Dewey Decimal system, how to change the oil in my Chevy. These were all skills I had back in High School that are now atrophied or forgotten because technology has advanced so I don't have to do them anymore. So I've forgotten how, and my kids will NEVER know how. Technology makes things easier. The old skills grow rusty and forgotten. All due to progress. (*)
Adaptive Cruise is but one small step on the path to fully autonomous driving, and I'm quite tickled by it. I'm looking forward to the day when those who don't want to pay attention to driving don't have to. And, perhaps one day, I'll forget how to drive and just let the machines do it for me. Just like the way I'm letting the machines publish this copy for me, and aren't using my old morse key.
(*) Then again, perhaps it's just senility...
woof said:
AmpedRealtor responded:
An old argument, but let's explore and see where it leads.
I've forgotten how to send morse code. Used to know back when I was a lad, but now I can just use Twitter. But, one day the 'net won't work, and then how will I communicate?
I've forgotten how to milk a cow. I just get on the 'net and have Peapod deliver nice fresh milk every week. Don't have to get cozy with Bessie at 5 AM anymore. But, one day Peapod won't come and then whatever will I do?
I've forgotten how to change the ink on a typewriter. I've forgotten how to code in FORTRAN. I've forgotten how to thread a movie projector, how to develop black and white photographic film, how to use the Dewey Decimal system, how to change the oil in my Chevy. These were all skills I had back in High School that are now atrophied or forgotten because technology has advanced so I don't have to do them anymore. So I've forgotten how, and my kids will NEVER know how. Technology makes things easier. The old skills grow rusty and forgotten. All due to progress. (*)
Adaptive Cruise is but one small step on the path to fully autonomous driving, and I'm quite tickled by it. I'm looking forward to the day when those who don't want to pay attention to driving don't have to. And, perhaps one day, I'll forget how to drive and just let the machines do it for me. Just like the way I'm letting the machines publish this copy for me, and aren't using my old morse key.
(*) Then again, perhaps it's just senility...
Adaptive cruise might work but with stop and go traffic the regular cruise probably would not. MB has an interesting option with some sort of laser system that will scan for slowing traffic a automatically start to brake.
With Tesla pursuing "auto-pilot" functionality in collaboration with Mobileye, I expect we'll see ACC on the Model S in a few years. Features like this are places where the incumbents have a competitive advantage over Tesla, which has to invent or buy technology that BMW/MB/Audi have on the shelf.
Nothing you said above applies or is relevant other than to divert the subject to something else. ACC is a safety feature, it is not intended to be used as a replacement for you paying attention and using the brake pedal in stop and go traffic. That was my point. You stated that you use it in stop and go traffic so that you don't have to worry about braking. ACC is not a substitute for paying attention. It's designed to protect you from hitting someone IF you fail to take appropriate action first.
Read any book about driving or attend any safe driving course. You will learn that you are not supposed to use cruise control in stop and go traffic. ACC or not. I also question your statement that ACC was developed specifically for stop and go traffic. Really?
If you're expecting to seat people over 6' in the back seat, they will thank you to order the panoramic roof, which adds noticeable headroom (at a guess, 1-2", 3-4cm).
At that heights though, I find the Model S' headrests to be pretty useless
I wish Tesla could address that with adjustable rear headrests - they are too low for tall people.
If you're expecting to seat people over 6' in the back seat, they will thank you to order the panoramic roof, which adds noticeable headroom (at a guess, 1-2", 3-4cm).
At that heights though, I find the Model S' headrests to be pretty useless
As an Asian with short legs but taller torso, I find the back height cramped and I'm far shorter than 6'. My son, who's just under 6', really can't fit in the back seat. Even with the panoramic roof (which we regret not getting), the cross beam in the back is the issue if one wants to rest against the headrest.
In any case, I did recently test drive an i3. Things to watch for:
1) Glass distortion. I found the windscreen glass distortion to be really bothersome.
2) Poor regen level. The regen is not adjustable and I found it very weak, much harder to do one pedal driving in traffic.
3) Inferior interior. I found the interior to be much worse than Tesla's. Maybe to some people, arrays of plastic buttons looks upscale to them. It doesn't to me. The unfinished hemp body panels also look... well, unfinished. The UI interface design of their infotainment/control systems is like working with Symbian from the 90's. The expanse of space in front before the windscreen is very Dodge Intrepid-like and I didn't like it. The doors seem fussy. The luggage space is minuscule, although anything is better than Tesla's cup holder and rear storage situation.
4) Driving was unspectacular in every way. Nothing particularly wrong, nothing particularly right, at least not in the short ~10 mile circuit I had to try it on.
5) Ugly. I was hoping it would look better in person. It doesn't in most angles. I'm actually ok with the look in the first picture (more of a side picture), and the look from the rear/rear quarters is ok. Front quarters (as one goes further towards the front from the first pic) to front look is pretty much as ugly as I had feared.
It is likely I need to buy a urban/short distance commuter car before Tesla's Gen 3 so I went in genuinely shopping. I'm not sure I'm willing to buy this car, but the other choices aren't very good either. I'm hoping I feel better about the Mercedes B-class, even though it isn't offered in my state this year.
Yes, really:
BMW Technology Guide : Active Cruise Control with Stop&Go function
[emphasis mine]BMW said:
Guess it's time to re-write those books.
I have to agree with the findings if Insureit1 on the i3 I recently stopped by the BMW dealer and while they got the test drive i3 up front I was able to look over the car in the showroom.
1) Shockingly NO power seats. worse no froward/backward movement it is one position.
2) The top of the dashboard looks awful cheap. Uncovered fiberboard like.
3) Ride I did notice the choppiness felt like a wheel bounced off the road several times.
4) Range may be an issue!!! maybe Rex for me. Perish the thought I want 100% EV
5) Three year lease was $687 a bit steep for a $50,000 car.
I do have a Drive the Future appointment on June 21 will stick to it and see if I could tolerate an i3 extremely doubt it.
I should have bought the 40KwH Model S it met all my needs.
1) Shockingly NO power seats. worse no froward/backward movement it is one position.
2) The top of the dashboard looks awful cheap. Uncovered fiberboard like.
3) Ride I did notice the choppiness felt like a wheel bounced off the road several times.
4) Range may be an issue!!! maybe Rex for me. Perish the thought I want 100% EV
5) Three year lease was $687 a bit steep for a $50,000 car.
I do have a Drive the Future appointment on June 21 will stick to it and see if I could tolerate an i3 extremely doubt it.
I should have bought the 40KwH Model S it met all my needs.
Similar threads
