Blog Tesla Will Move HQ Out of California After Fight Against Health Order

wws · May 9, 2020

ItsNotAboutTheMoney said:
According to Elon Musk, a pandemic is only serious if lots of young, healthy people are dying.

How many elderly people in assisted living work in automotive factories?

MyMai · May 9, 2020

my dad was one of engineers that relocated to Austin with big company like Apple, Samsung back in 2017, because of they offered very generous relocation package. Along with him was a long list of engineers in all fields. They decide to take the offer to have a quality life in Texas. but beside of lower spending on housing and grocery, there is not much to advance in careers. no competition, no interest project and nearly impossible to find a new company to jump over. After first year, most of development team relocated back to Bayarea; second year, half of engineers either retired, or resigned to move back. They were unable to find good candidates to hire to make up for talent engineers they lost. Tesla may get better incentive, However, innovation will die without talent people and challenge. Manufacturer move out of California is expected. but move out HQ and entire operations? I bet other tech companies in the bay is lol and preparing offer for Tesla engineers as of now.

Bucfan11 · May 9, 2020

MyMai said:
my dad was one of engineers that relocated to Austin with big company like Apple, Samsung back in 2017, because of they offered very generous relocation package. Along with him was a long list of engineers in all fields. They decide to take the offer to have a quality life in Texas. but beside of lower spending on housing and grocery, there is not much to advance in careers. no competition, no interest project and nearly impossible to find a new company to jump over. After first year, most of development team relocated back to Bayarea; second year, half of engineers either retired, or resigned to move back. They were unable to find good candidates to hire to make up for talent engineers they lost. Tesla may get better incentive, However, innovation will die without talent people and challenge. Manufacturer move out of California is expected. but move out HQ and entire operations? I bet other tech companies in the bay is lol and preparing offer for Tesla engineers as of now.

Dont flatter yourself.

Bucfan11 · May 9, 2020

uujjj said:
Tesla has 15000 employees in the Bay Area. Tesla's secret sauce is in the minds of those 15000 workers, not in Elon's inflated ego. If Tesla really does leave (which is less likely than Elon makes it sound), there's going to be a bonanza for new automotive and greentech startups in California.

There is a reason automotive plants are being built in the red states.

MXLRplus · May 9, 2020

IIRC, Ford, Chrysler, GM, and Toyota abandoned California operations.

California's #1 export is mfr'g businesses, closely followed by stolen tech exported to China.

lynnpt2001 · May 9, 2020

glide said:
Good. Now they can deliver vehicles with decent paint jobs.

Likely better if in another state, but both my cars have paint jobs that are better than Chrysler, Gm. and the Acura MDX/Honda I had.

glide · May 9, 2020

lynnpt2001 said:
Likely better if in another state, but both my cars have paint jobs that are better than Chrysler, Gm. and the Acura MDX/Honda I had.

Don’t take this as an affront but I don’t think any of those are $100K+ vehicles.

I have never owned a vehicle with a worse paint job than my P85D

GoEV · May 9, 2020

dmode said:
Elon is so mad at regulations in California that he will be opening a factory in China - paragon of freedom, and one in Germany - a paragon of corporate welfare. Makes sense

Germany - a paragon of corporate welfare? LOL. Germany has FAR stricter (environmental, worker) regulations than California. They even have GASP socialized medicine! German corporations even frequently (always?) have a worker on the board!

Elon has done some great things, but he's also acts like a spoiled rotten rich person who won't doesn't play well w/ others.

He wants to colonize Mars w/ humans (same species that's screwed things up here) in a place that is far deadlier than Earth is ever likely to be. How does this make any sense? (I'm all for space exploration though I think the focus should be using robots almost exclusively.) Spend the money that would be required to colonize Mars on Earth where there are billions of people who are struggling to survive in a place that's far more hospitable to life than Mars.

When I worked in high tech I had the option of moving out of California. No thanks! I'll take the earthquakes and droughts to bugs, tornadoes, droughts, blazing hot temps, a lack of regulations that put $ over people's health, huge numbers of rednecks, etc. I also wish the red states would quit there welfare ways and stop taking so much blue state tax money.

Can't imagine how the sane members of the board put up w/ his temper tantrums.

Love my M3 and what the amazing employees of Tesla have built!

linux-works · May 9, 2020

uujjj said:
Tesla has 15000 employees in the Bay Area. Tesla's secret sauce is in the minds of those 15000 workers, not in Elon's inflated ego. If Tesla really does leave (which is less likely than Elon makes it sound), there's going to be a bonanza for new automotive and greentech startups in California.

100% this.

the value of the bay area is in the people that are here and attracted to be here.

there are more tech jobs here than anywhere else in the US; and more 'new school' car companies than anywhere in the US. its for a reason, its not a random thing.

if tesla thinks the progressive employees who choose to live in the bay area are going to put up with a so-called 'business friendly' state (which means, good luck to you if you want fair treatment as an employee) - he doesn't know his labor force. you'll get some to move, but I assure you, it won't be the ones that add real value and innovation. those won't leave the bay area, not even for double their salary (the smart ones realize they need more choices to fall back on, and going to a one-horse town and moving your whole life there is just not smart, long-term).

MXLRplus · May 9, 2020

vladd said:
Germany - a paragon of corporate welfare? LOL. Germany has FAR stricter (environmental, worker) regulations than California. They even have GASP socialized medicine! German corporations even frequently (always?) have a worker on the board!

Elon has done some great things, but he's also acts like a spoiled rotten rich person who won't doesn't play well w/ others.

He wants to colonize Mars w/ humans (same species that's screwed things up here) in a place that is far deadlier than Earth is ever likely to be. How does this make any sense? (I'm all for space exploration though I think the focus should be using robots almost exclusively.) Spend the money that would be required to colonize Mars on Earth where there are billions of people who are struggling to survive in a place that's far more hospitable to life than Mars.

When I worked in high tech I had the option of moving out of California. No thanks! I'll take the earthquakes and droughts to bugs, tornadoes, droughts, blazing hot temps, a lack of regulations that put $ over people's health, huge numbers of rednecks, etc. I also wish the red states would quit there welfare ways and stop taking so much blue state tax money.

Can't imagine how the sane members of the board put up w/ his temper tantrums.

Love my M3 and what the amazing employees of Tesla have built!

You are so far in left field it's crazy. They burn brown coal in Germany. There aren't warning signs in lumber yards saying wood can give you cancer. They can paint cars with real paint instead of watercolors we use in CA. We ban certain battery chargers because there is a soldered joint inside. I'll bet Germany never even tried to ban black cars. Do they have drinking straws in Germany? How about leaf blowers?

Does Germany require your small aircompressors to be registered and taxed by the State?

MXLRplus · May 9, 2020

All these experts about automaking in California, and I doubt many of them know how many tires are on a car. Or what the California business laws are.

Do you think it's cheap to move your entire business? Then why are so many still doing it. The company that custom makes my MC seats just moved to Utah after 40 years. ~4/5 of my California-based customers I had in 2000 have relocated their MFR'g. They still send me work, it just increases the turn a couple days.

linux-works · May 9, 2020

MXLRplus said:
All these experts about automaking in California, and I doubt many of them know how many tires are on a car. Or what the California business laws are.

Do you think it's cheap to move your entire business? Then why are so many still doing it. The company that custom makes my MC seats just moved to Utah after 40 years. ~4/5 of my California-based customers I had in 2000 have relocated their MFR'g. They still send me work, it just increases the turn a couple days.

I work in this field, in software, for electric cars.

NO ONE I know wants to move out of the bay area.

sorry, but you are not connected to reality, my friend. manufacturing - blue collar style - that's not what california's strong point is. and that's NOT the value of tesla. tesla's value is entirely in the IP, not the sheet metal and assembly plants. yes, assembly can be done anywhere and much cheaper than the bay area. no argument there.

but to think that you can just find the calibre of person who can add value to tesla's design teams - those people want to be able to change jobs and ALL the electric car jobs are in the bay area, with very few exceptions.

only college hires and freshers would move to a non-bay area company for tesla. and if that's all tesla can get, good luck even maintaining the code base they have now. experienced people simply will not do it.

MXLRplus · May 9, 2020

linux-works said:
I work in this field, in software, for electric cars.

NO ONE I know wants to move out of the bay area.

sorry, but you are not connected to reality, my friend. manufacturing - blue collar style - that's not what california's strong point is. and that's NOT the value of tesla. tesla's value is entirely in the IP, not the sheet metal and assembly plants. yes, assembly can be done anywhere and much cheaper than the bay area. no argument there.

but to think that you can just find the calibre of person who can add value to tesla's design teams - those people want to be able to change jobs and ALL the electric car jobs are in the bay area, with very few exceptions.

only college hires and freshers would move to a non-bay area company for tesla. and if that's all tesla can get, good luck even maintaining the code base they have now. experienced people simply will not do it.

I've been in mfr'g since 1976. What do you want to know? Just ask. I've programmed computers using Hollerith cards and toggle switches. I've been tampering with digital engine controls for about 25 years.

SilverString · May 9, 2020

In Texas:
Lower Corporate Taxes
Easy to start a business
More new business startups than most any other state
No State Income Tax
Properly Funded Public Schools
Lower Cost of living
Higher standard of Living
People can still be prosecuted for committing the same crimes over and over
Right to Work - unions have no power to stranglehold
There are engineers here too...
SPACEX
FSD Chip manufactured in Texas
STATE BUDGET OPERATES IN THE BLACK
If you are from California you will likely meet some of your old neighbors

In California:
Beautiful Big trees
Nice beaches if you can use them
Good Wine

Somebody doesn't think engineers will follow to Texas? They already have by the tens of thousands.

hndmountains · May 9, 2020

linux-works said:
I work in this field, in software, for electric cars.

NO ONE I know wants to move out of the bay area.

Like spending close to 2 million to live in a small house?
(Yes, I live in the bay area and have a house too)

dmode · May 9, 2020

vladd said:
Germany - a paragon of corporate welfare? LOL. Germany has FAR stricter (environmental, worker) regulations than California. They even have GASP socialized medicine! German corporations even frequently (always?) have a worker on the board!

Elon has done some great things, but he's also acts like a spoiled rotten rich person who won't doesn't play well w/ others.

He wants to colonize Mars w/ humans (same species that's screwed things up here) in a place that is far deadlier than Earth is ever likely to be. How does this make any sense? (I'm all for space exploration though I think the focus should be using robots almost exclusively.) Spend the money that would be required to colonize Mars on Earth where there are billions of people who are struggling to survive in a place that's far more hospitable to life than Mars.

When I worked in high tech I had the option of moving out of California. No thanks! I'll take the earthquakes and droughts to bugs, tornadoes, droughts, blazing hot temps, a lack of regulations that put $ over people's health, huge numbers of rednecks, etc. I also wish the red states would quit there welfare ways and stop taking so much blue state tax money.

Can't imagine how the sane members of the board put up w/ his temper tantrums.

Love my M3 and what the amazing employees of Tesla have built!

You and I are on the same page. I have worked extensively with a German company and know all about it. I am waiting for Elon’s head to explode when worker’s council tells him that he cannot abuse workers there. I was pointing out the blatant hypocrisy

GoEV · May 9, 2020

MXLRplus said:
You are so far in left field it's crazy.

They burn brown coal in Germany. [WRITING IN CAPS TO MAKE IT EASIER TO SEE MY RESPONSES--NOT YELLING.] TRUE, BUT THEY'RE PHASING IT AND NUCLEAR, OUT. THEIR RENEWABLE ENERGY MIX IS 46% VS. 33% FOR CALIFORNIA SO THEY ARE MORE REGULATED AND CLEANER THAN CALIFORNIA.

There aren't warning signs in lumber yards saying wood can give you cancer. PERHAPS THE SIGNAGE IS OVERDONE. IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE A HUGE EXPENSE IN ANY EVENT AND I'VE BEEN A SMALL BUSINESS OWNER IN CALIFORNIA FOR 20 YEARS.

They can paint cars with real paint instead of watercolors we use in CA. PLEASE PROVIDE DATA.

We ban certain battery chargers because there is a soldered joint inside. PLEASE ID THE EXTENT OF THIS PROBLEM AND ITS COSTS TO THE ECONOMY. DOESN'T SEEM TO HAVE HURT TESLA SUPERCHARGERS, OR CHARGEPOINT, OR ____ EV CHARGERS.

I'll bet Germany never even tried to ban black cars. "...As the San Jose Mercury News reported, the CARB never actually considered banning black cars, and all of the discussion about reflective paint requirements was merely part of a draft proposal which the ARB ultimately decided against as not cost-effective."

Do they have drinking straws in Germany? YES. HOWEVER, "From 2021 onwards, plastic straws, plates, cutlery, trays and other disposable 'single-use' plastics are to be subject to a Europe-wide ban."

How about leaf blowers? YES, HOWEVER, "The German government has warned against the use of leaf blowers over concerns for insects and the environment. ... Leaf blowers should not be used unless they are "indispensable", the ministry said. However, the ministry said it was not planning to ban the devices."

Does Germany require your small aircompressors to be registered and taxed by the State? NOT SURE.

THEY HAVE A ***LOT*** OF REGULATIONS AND DON'T FORGET WHAT ALL CONSERVATIVES SAY ABOUT THOSE "EVIL" SOCIALIST COUNTRIES LIKE GERMANY--THEY PAY ***HIGH*** TAXES.

PRETTY SURE YOU'D REALLY HATE GERMANY GIVEN YOUR HATRED OF CALIFORNIA.

WE HAVE 40 MILLION PEOPLE IN CALIFORNIA AND WE ALL NEED TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO LIVE TOGETHER THAT IS HEALTHY AND FAIR FOR ALL. THE HARD PART FOR SO MANY IS THAT INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM IS INVERSELY PROPORTIONAL TO POPULATION GROWTH. EXAMPLE: ONE PERSON IN A HOME CAN PRETTY MUCH EXERCISE TOTAL FREEDOM. (OF COURSE TOTAL DOES NOT MEAN DOING THINGS THAT DISRUPT THE NEIGHBORHOOD LIKE LOUD MUSIC AFTER 10PM, SHOOTING GUNS, ETC.) THE MORE PEOPLE THAT ARE SQUEEZED INTO THE SAME HOME, THE MORE INDIVIDUALS FIND THEMSELVES LIMITED IN WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE TO ALL.

SilverString · May 9, 2020

vladd said:
PRETTY SURE YOU'D REALLY HATE GERMANY GIVEN YOUR HATRED OF CALIFORNIA.

WE HAVE 40 MILLION PEOPLE IN CALIFORNIA AND WE ALL NEED TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO LIVE TOGETHER THAT IS HEALTHY AND FAIR FOR ALL. THE HARD PART FOR SO MANY IS THAT INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM IS INVERSELY PROPORTIONAL TO POPULATION GROWTH. EXAMPLE: ONE PERSON IN A HOME CAN PRETTY MUCH EXERCISE TOTAL FREEDOM. (OF COURSE TOTAL DOES NOT MEAN DOING THINGS THAT DISRUPT THE NEIGHBORHOOD LIKE LOUD MUSIC AFTER 10PM, SHOOTING GUNS, ETC.) THE MORE PEOPLE THAT ARE SQUEEZED INTO THE SAME HOME, THE MORE INDIVIDUALS FIND THEMSELVES LIMITED IN WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE TO ALL.

linux-works said:
I work in this field, in software, for electric cars.

NO ONE I know wants to move out of the bay area.

sorry, but you are not connected to reality, my friend. manufacturing - blue collar style - that's not what california's strong point is. and that's NOT the value of tesla. tesla's value is entirely in the IP, not the sheet metal and assembly plants. yes, assembly can be done anywhere and much cheaper than the bay area. no argument there.

but to think that you can just find the calibre of person who can add value to tesla's design teams - those people want to be able to change jobs and ALL the electric car jobs are in the bay area, with very few exceptions.

only college hires and freshers would move to a non-bay area company for tesla. and if that's all tesla can get, good luck even maintaining the code base they have now. experienced people simply will not do it.

Oh there are no good engineers that do not want to live in the Bay Area?

No one I know wants to stay IN California. If everybody want to stay in the Bay Area why are they fleeing like rats from a sinking ship? They all seem to come here too. I know a lot of people who wish you were right, and reading your posts I can see why.

dmode · May 9, 2020

SilverString said:
In Texas:
Lower Corporate Taxes
Easy to start a business
More new business startups than most any other state
No State Income Tax
Properly Funded Public Schools
Lower Cost of living
Higher standard of Living
People can still be prosecuted for committing the same crimes over and over
Right to Work - unions have no power to stranglehold
There are engineers here too...
SPACEX
FSD Chip manufactured in Texas
STATE BUDGET OPERATES IN THE BLACK
If you are from California you will likely meet some of your old neighbors

In California:
Beautiful Big trees
Nice beaches if you can use them
Good Wine

Somebody doesn't think engineers will follow to Texas? They already have by the tens of thousands.

Hilariously wrong. Higher quality of life ? I mean just looking at Tesla ownership can tell you where people have a higher quality of life. Not to speak of the unlimited job opportunities and pay raises in CA. And I didn’t even mention access to unbelievable nature, or the best food scene, or wines etc etc. And if Texas is so business friendly, why does it lag 100x behind CA when it comes to venture funding ? Uber, Lyft, Pinterest, Airbnb, Slack, a bunch of EV automakers, food innovation, energy, health care, every meaningful startup is here. I believe CA companies received $350bn in VC capital in last 10 years and 50% of VC investments. Texas is doesn’t even make the top 5 list and <$10bn invested

SilverString · May 9, 2020

dmode said:
Hilariously wrong. Higher quality of life ? I mean just looking at Tesla ownership can tell you where people have a higher quality of life. Not to speak of the unlimited job opportunities and pay raises in CA. And I didn’t even mention access to unbelievable nature, or the best food scene, or wines etc etc. And if Texas is so business friendly, why does it lag 100x behind CA when it comes to venture funding ? Uber, Lyft, Pinterest, Airbnb, Slack, a bunch of EV automakers, food innovation, energy, health care, every meaningful startup is here. I believe CA companies received $350bn in VC capital in last 10 years and 50% of VC investments. Texas is doesn’t even make the top 5 list and <$10bn invested

Its all changing, I wish they would stay there, but no. California is going to have to elect better politicians to regain their greatness.

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