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Tesla will no longer accept Bitcoin as payment - I made a deposit for a Model Y last week in Bitcoin and hoping to pay in Bitcoin

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Clearly you don't know how the crypto world works.

No, I understand how the crypto world works. Again, what's the real difference between paying with BTC (one click) and converting BTC to USD and then paying with EFT/ACH (two clicks)? (besides one additional 'click')

I'd posit that this is part of a tax avoidance scheme to avoid selling BTC for USD and paying taxes on the gains. But that's just a guess. :)
 
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No, I understand how the crypto world works. Again, what's the real difference between paying with BTC (one click) and converting BTC to USD and then paying with EFT/ACH (two clicks)? (besides one additional 'click')

I'd posit that this is part of a tax avoidance scheme to avoid selling BTC for USD and paying taxes on the gains. But that's just a guess. :)
lol, tax avoidance. i wish. it's hard to hide a car that you drive everyday registered in your name, insured, blah blah blah... taxes are not an issue to pay. i pay a crap ton in taxes, a tesla is a drop in the bucket.

if i were to guess, this is about whether banks will need to be involved in everyday transactions for large purchases like cars. i speculate that the energy issue is the problem. banks are huge polluters in the grand scheme of things. Their drive ups are filled with lines of engines idling every business day passing papers through plastic tubes.
 
banks are huge polluters in the grand scheme of things. Their drive ups are filled with lines of engines idling every business day passing papers through plastic tubes.
Let's see. I've bought 4 Teslas since 2016 and the last time I was in or at a physical bank was in about 2012. But let's say that I did need to go to a bank each time I bought one, and I idled for 15 minutes.

The average car uses 1/2 gallon per hour idling. So 4 Teslas is a gallon of gas. That's ~30kWh of energy.

ONE bitcoin transaction takes 1000+ kWh of energy (One MEGAWATT). That's the equivalent of 30 gallons of gas or idling at the bank for 60 hours for every BTC transaction. Visa uses 148kWh per 100k transactions. .000004 gallons per transaction.

Bitcoin is up to 117 TWh per year. This is 3.6 BILLION gallons of fuel a year. There's only 1 billion cars on the planet.

Silly "whatabout" arguments from the BTC crowd just let us know that you know how awful the environmental impact is.
 
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Let's see. I've bought 4 Teslas since 2016 and the last time I was in or at a physical bank was in about 2012. But let's say that I did need to go to a bank each time I bought one, and I idled for 15 minutes.

The average car uses 1/2 gallon per hour idling. So 4 Teslas is a gallon of gas. That's ~30kWh of energy.

ONE bitcoin transaction takes 1000+ kWh of energy (One MEGAWATT). That's the equivalent of 30 gallons of gas or idling at the bank for 60 hours for every BTC transaction. Visa uses 148kWh per 100k transactions. .000004 gallons per transaction.

Bitcoin is up to 117 TWh per year. This is 3.6 BILLION gallons of fuel a year. There's only 1 billion cars on the planet.

Silly "whatabout" arguments from the BTC crowd just let us know that you know how awful the environmental impact is.
Because of online banking, there have been about 12 thousand -net- bank branch closures over the last 10 years, and that trend is accelerating.
 
In my experience, most car dealers take a check. You need to register the car, and all sorts of other stuff. It's not a good thing to buy with a bad check, and cashiers checks are easy to forge too. In the modern world they can process your check ACH anyway.

Doesn't BTC take hours to clear sometimes too?
It took 10 minutes for mine to clear when I purchased my Model YP. Can't do that with a cashiers check.
 
It's not about hiding the car, it's about hiding the conversion from BTC to USD.
Do you guys think the people who bought a car with BTC think they can hide the transaction from the IRS? Do you think Tesla doesn't have to report that transaction? I bought a car with BTC. I fully expect to have to pay capital gains tax, already planning on it. I'm just curious on the mechanism that Tesla will use to document it to the buyer, 1099?
 
Do you guys think the people who bought a car with BTC think they can hide the transaction from the IRS? Do you think Tesla doesn't have to report that transaction? I bought a car with BTC. I fully expect to have to pay capital gains tax, already planning on it. I'm just curious on the mechanism that Tesla will use to document it to the buyer, 1099?

No, there's absolutely no reason for Tesla to report selling you a car to the IRS. They don't report that for any other cash/USD buyers. They didn't pay you anything (i.e. "nonemployee compensation") so there's no reason to send you a 1099. They simply gave you a car for an agreed upon amount of BTC. Now Tesla has to convert that to USD (or more likely, just keep it in their BTC wallet). So there are absolutely no transactions here that would trigger any reporting to the IRS. Of course, Tesla would include the value of the BTC transaction in USD in their financial statements, earnings, and tax returns, but at that point, you are out of the picture.

OTOH, if you convert BTC to USD in an exchange like Coinbase, that would be reported to the IRS, and it would be up to you to pay taxes on any gain that transaction entailed. Now I would suppose it's possible for an exchange like Coinbase to report all like-kind BTC transfers to the IRS (I'm not sure they do that), but if you hold your BTC in your own wallet and not an exchange (and therefor do not have to convert to USD first), and you just xfer BTC to Tesla, that transaction is anonymous and also not reported to the IRS.
 
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One additional comment: If someone is audited and the IRS asks "where did you get this new car because we don't see you buying that with assets from your bank accounts?", you'd have to tell them it was a BTC transaction and then they'd dig deeper and you might have to pay tax at that point (on any BTC capital gains, that is). But that's only if you're audited.
 
No, there's absolutely no reason for Tesla to report selling you a car to the IRS. They don't report that for any other cash/USD buyers. They didn't pay you anything (i.e. "nonemployee compensation") so there's no reason to send you a 1099. They simply gave you a car for an agreed upon amount of BTC. Now Tesla has to convert that to USD (or more likely, just keep it in their BTC wallet). So there are absolutely no transactions here that would trigger any reporting to the IRS. Of course, Tesla would include the value of the BTC transaction in USD in their financial statements, earnings, and tax returns, but at that point, you are out of the picture.

OTOH, if you convert BTC to USD in an exchange like Coinbase, that would be reported to the IRS, and it would be up to you to pay taxes on any gain that transaction entailed. Now I would suppose it's possible for an exchange like Coinbase to report all like-kind BTC transfers to the IRS (I'm not sure they do that), but if you hold your BTC in your own wallet and not an exchange (and therefor do not have to convert to USD first), and you just xfer BTC to Tesla, that transaction is anonymous and also not reported to the IRS.
Auto dealers must report cash transactions over $10,000 even if the payments are split. This has been in place a long time and applies to BTC.
 
A few years ago a client asked about his (adult) kids taxes. I said id take a look at them and refer to someone. Basic return, except he had pages upon pages of crypto transactions for coffee, lunch, etc. It basically looked like a yearlong credit card statement, except in the form of securities transacted.
Coffee: $5 Basis: $2. Shares: .001234567
I told the kid to buy stuff with 5 bucks, don't trade a 5 dollar piece of appreciated gold for it.
He is probably wealthy anyway.
 
Do you guys think the people who bought a car with BTC think they can hide the transaction from the IRS? Do you think Tesla doesn't have to report that transaction? I bought a car with BTC. I fully expect to have to pay capital gains tax, already planning on it. I'm just curious on the mechanism that Tesla will use to document it to the buyer, 1099?
I think there are a lot of sore losers in this forum, which is fascinating. Their comments show that they have no idea what they are talking about when it comes to crypto.

SHIB
 
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