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The situation in Iceland

Discussion in 'Iceland' started by Premium, Dec 12, 2013.

  1. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Well-Known Member

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    You're repeating your own fallacy that there are more Superchargers in low-density areas because the low density makes it more important. That's not the case. Outside of the city Superchargers, they are mainly built to complete paths that Tesla believes its customers need or want to travel. Consider what's happened in Nebraska last year and what's happening in Wyoming this year. Tesla's is building out western I-80. Nebraska Superchargers weren't added for Nebraska. They were added to connect ot Denver (requiring 1 new Supercharger in Colorado). The new Wyoming Superchargers aren't being added for Wyoming. They are being added to connect from the Midwest to Salt Lake City and the Pacific North West.

    It just makes more sense to me that Tesla ramps Model 3 to high volume, address key large markets and then makes a single large effort in smaller markets. So for Iceland, add sales and a service center, and add however many Superchargers are needed to cover the island (which will be more than 3).
     
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  2. LargeHamCollider

    LargeHamCollider Battery cells != scalable

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    I met with an Icelandic Tesla owner in Iceland in 2014 and we discussed Tesla's future in Iceland briefly. Electricity is dirt cheap in Iceland, 3 cents per kWh if I recall, and gas is very expensive. These factors in combination with the fact that you'd only need superchargers on the Ring Road (which I drove, it was a very beautiful drive) means Iceland is a pretty ideal place for electric cars.

    But the population is so low I don't expect Tesla to set up shop there until about a year after M3 makes it to Europe. Maybe sooner if grass roots groups make it verrrry easy for Tesla.
     
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  3. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Bingo.

    Now, how does the ratio of "population" to "important paths" change as population density declines?

    Exactly. And as I've pointed out, two of Wyoming's three interstates which Tesla has built superchargers on are no more heavily trafficked than the Ring Road. How heavily trafficked a road is being how much of an "important path" it is (if it was more important, there would be more people on it).

    Drivers whose numbers are reflected in the road traffic figures.
     
  4. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Indeed, that's my hope. I'm hoping that while we missed this latest round of expansion, that they'll get us with the next one (if not.... ugggghhh...). As a side note, I unintentionally convinced two different people to reserve a Model 3 today :) It wasn't the plan. I just happened to mention that I was getting one, they started asking questions.... one thing led to the next and now they're planning to put down reservations.

    The Model 3 is going to be such a huge hit in places with high gas prices like Iceland.
     
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  5. reynirb

    reynirb Member

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    Agree for the most part. Although, currently, there is only charging station travel from Reykjavik to Akureyri, the ring road charging infrastructure is not completed yet.

    Although many people rent cars, the cost during peak season is already pretty high, between $80 to $100 per day. Renting a long range EV could boost that further, so not sure how much price tolerance is left in the already steep rental car rates.

    I believe #8 was sourced from Wikipedia, which sourced it from althingi.is

    The exact text is: "Tollstjóra er heimilt við tollafgreiðslu að fella niður virðisaukaskatt af rafmagns- eða vetnisbifreið að hámarki 1.530.000 kr. og af tengiltvinnbifreið að hámarki 1.020.000 kr.

    Við skattskylda sölu bifreiðar er skattaðila heimilt að undanþiggja frá skattskyldri veltu fjárhæð að hámarki 6.000.000 kr. vegna rafmagns- eða vetnisbifreiðar og að hámarki 4.000.000 kr. vegna tengiltvinnbifreiðar."

    So that is probably where I got the $13500.

    And as far as your last question. Já, sekur um að vera Íslendingur á staðnum.:)

    As far as car rentals. Not aware of any car rentals that have Tesla's available. But I did see a ton of Tesla Taxi's in the Netherlands last month. And I did see few Tesla's in Iceland last month also.
     
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  6. killhate

    killhate Member

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    Nice encounter today <3
    [​IMG]
     

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  7. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    There's an S that sometimes parks across the street from me. We're supposedly at over 80 Teslas in the country now. Not a huge number, but I'm sure it's going to take off with the 3, since S and X don't get the full VSK deduction.
     
  8. Chuq

    Chuq Active Member

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    For those who may not be aware, there's a bit of discussion about Iceland in the general Supercharger thread here: Tesla Supercharger network

    I'll continue the discussion here: I notice there are no destination chargers in Iceland? Is there a reason for this? Do they refuse to supply them?

    I assume you use the same 220-240V supply as mainland Europe?
     
  9. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Not available in Iceland, last I checked into it. And yes, we're 230V with single or three phase feeds to the breaker box (depending on demand) and with normal sockets being 230V / 10/13/16A (usually 16) single phase / schuko.
     
  10. Model 3

    Model 3 Active Member

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    So it is the same IT system as is most used here in Norway (three phase 230V), or is it the TN system of rest of Europe with 400V three phase? (Still 230V single phase)
     
  11. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    According to Samorka in "Tæknilegar tengiskilmálar raforkudreifingar - TTR - 2009" ("Technical connection requirments for electricity distribution"), "mælt er með að rafkerfi neysluveitna séu byggð upp sem TN-S kerfi (5-víra kerfi)." (roughly "it's recommended that electrical systems of the consumption-end wiring** are built up as a TN-S system (5-wire system). Further googling finds other pages backing this up - that TN-S is not a requirement, but is recommended.

    ** not really sure what to call "neysluveita" in English!
     
  12. Model 3

    Model 3 Active Member

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    Ok, it so it is the European TN system. So you can even charge a Renault Zoe without a transformer ;)

    My guess is that the "-S" part is just recommended, but the TN part is a requirement.

    TN-nett – Wikipedia
    Sorry, not available in English or Icelandic...

    According to Google Translate it is "providing consumption".
    "mælt er með að rafkerfi neysluveitna séu byggð upp sem TN-S kerfi (5-víra kerfi)" -> "It is recommended that the consumer electronics system be built as a TN-S system (5-wire system)"
    (I have no idea of how precise this translation is... :p )
     
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  13. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Veita (as a noun) means a system for distributing / giving out something... generally more on the end-user side than the backbone side (dreifing / distribution). Neysla means consumption. So it's pretty clear what's being talked about... but there's no English word that I know for it. I guess this is a bit offtopic ;)

    Hey, I can read about 2/3rds of the words in there ;)
     
  14. transpondster

    transpondster Member

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  15. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    #95 KarenRei, Oct 5, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2017
    So, following an amazing August where we nearly matched Italy (398 EVs - 294 PHEV, 104 BEV vs. 1413 ICEs = 22,0% penetration), our September numbers are in, and they're a bit lacklustre. A total of 290 EVs were sold - 191 PHEV, 99 BEV. However, ICE numbers fell as well - 1048 - so market penetration remains roughly the same, 21,6%, and the EV sales decline was largely just a symptom of the normal seasonal sales decline (we tend to have a May-June peak and a November-December low).

    The positive news is that despite the total vehicle sales decline, our decline was almost exclusively in PHEVs - BEV numbers held nearly steady. That said, until we have a proper fast charging network, there should be no expectation that BEV numbers will pass PHEV numbers. The latest news on our "semi-fast" charging infrastructure is the opening of two new CHAdeMO / CCS chargers, one in Hvolsvöllur and one in Vík; now half of the Ring Road is serviced by such chargers. No sign of Tesla, of course.

    I can't wait to see our EV numbers at the May-June peak, that's going to be amazing. The peak is normally 3-4 times our August sales numbers; we might break a thousand EVs per month then (2/3rds of the July numbers out of France and 2 1/2 times the numbers out of Italy, according to EAFO) :)

    October registrations are starting to show up... it's only been a few days, and there's always some lag, but we're already at 26 PHEV and 14 BEV vs. 126 ICEs. I'm liking those numbers - that's 24,1% penetration.
     
  16. Chuq

    Chuq Active Member

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    That's really odd... it's a very cheap way for them to get more Tesla infrastructure out there. Have they given a reason?
     
  17. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    They're not involved in Iceland in any way. I can check and see if anything has changed, though....
     
  18. KarenRei

    KarenRei ᴉǝɹuǝɹɐʞ

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    Ed: I've been working to resolve a contradiction between the Orkusetur, Samgöngustofa and EAFO data for Iceland, and after talking with various people, I think I have all of the discrepancies worked out. It affects the penetration, but not (materially) the total sales figures.

    Samgöngustofa presents very detailed breakdowns, but only on a monthly basis.
    Orkusetur apparently leaves out hybrids and diesel PHEVs from its graphs. It also combines new and used sales.
    EAFO presents (old) monthly data. It apparently also combines new and used sales; one presumes they're doing this for all countries on their list.

    As a result, EVs go up slightly (due to the addition of diesel PHEVs), but non-EVs go up much more by the addition of non-PHEV hybrids. So we retain our ranking relative to other countries in Europe, but our August and September market penetrations drop to 15,4% and 16,2%, respectively. So we're not as close to catching up with Norway's market penetration as Orkusetur made it look, but we're still huge leaps over any other country in terms of market penetration.

    I'm liking the detail at Samgöngustofa, but I wish it was more frequent than monthly. You can even see the (very small) percent of our EV sales that are Teslas - those brave souls who import an EV on their own which to service requires sending it across the Atlantic ;) Maybe I can get access to their database; that would be great if I could make some daily-updating graphs.
     
  19. Chuq

    Chuq Active Member

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    @KarenRei , were you involved in making this video? :)

     
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  20. BuildingCap

    BuildingCap If you build it, they will come.

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    Regarding using Tesla's as rentals in Iceland, I agree with @reynirb'd doubts and will add a few other serious drawbacks: Those $100/day rentals in the high season are for cars that would be priced around $10-20k in the US. I'd imagine a M3 would go for ~$200/day and an S/X would be well over $400/day. That does not include extra insurances/liabilities.The roads are very rough any place off the ring road, and gravel damage is an extra insurance there. There is another separate insurance for sandstorms and if you decline it, you have to sign in multiple places that you understand a sandstorm can cause >$10k damage to a car. Strong wind gusts also are common enough that there is another clause the rental car that you are liable if a door on your car gets blown off. Finally many roads, especially in the interior would be impossible to get a flatbed truck out to save a Tesla if anything goes wrong and tourists may not have the correct judgement to know this.

    This is just my perspective as someone who has rented a car in Iceland. I wish Telsa had more of a franchise system for international expansion/support to drive local ownership. Surely someone could make the business case with the electricity rates and stabilizing economy instead of ignoring the market because of the size...
     

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