The TesLorean

[HankLloydRight]

Very cool! (...former Delorean owner here).

My good friend Dave built an EV Delorean years ago: The Home of the Electric Delorean Project

He also just bought a Tesla about 6 months ago.

DMC Texas also has an EV Delorean, but I believe they sold it to Google.

Another pair of Delorean owners (Brandys) also built an EV Delorean: Local owner electrifies DeLorean

Good luck on the project!

 

[scaesare]

I'm willing to assist with this project, but forget about installing the iBoost unless you are going to install almost all the original Tesla systems. It will fail and latch a DTC if it doesn't see CAN frames from most of the systems.

You will also have to spoof torque capability messages from the missing front DU to avoid limp mode, which will cause your rear DU to emit about as much power as the PRV V6 on 2 cylinders.

Then there's the immobilizer. This means you need the Body ECU and Gateway which is part of the 17" screen's main PCB. (Though you could mount a smaller screen if you like).

Don't even think about trying to get the AutoPilot running w/o a whole car.

Sorry to be full of negativity, I'd love to see this work, but the drive units in a D car are heavily interconnected.

Sounds like this project might be a candidate for a UMC 2.0 if Eldis gets them to market soon....

 

[DrJeff]

Sounds like this project might be a candidate for a UMC 2.0 if Eldis gets them to market soon....

Initial indications look good - can't wait to get my hands on one!

 

[DrJeff]

The drive inverter rpm signal compared to the front speed will detect slip. Just not which wheel.

True - I'm going to double detect the road speed 1) physical cable from the front wheel and 2) GPS module. The physical cable and the right-angle gearing that it goes through has a mixed reliability history. It's connection to the front hub is a plastic disk - I kid you not. Either the 1/8 inch square hole in the plastic disk gives out, the gearing gives out, or the cable gives out. Best case, when the physical cable fails you just get a bouncing speedometer needle. Having the physical cable and the GPS unit should provide sufficient redundancy to avoid a "limp home' mode (vehicle speed 0 or near 0 and the rear motor is spinning at X rpm).

I also need a speed signal for the electronic power steering (non-Tesla) which reduces the steering assist with speed.

 

[Ingineer]

GPS is usually delayed somewhat. Not sure how you can make that work well. Can't you retrofit some kind of ABS tone ring on one of the front wheels?

I suppose you could also modify the plastic disk with a hall effect (no contact) encoder and just ditch the mechanical cable. Install a meter movement in the dash if you are keeping the stock speedo, then it's all electronic.

 

[DrJeff]

GPS is usually delayed somewhat. Not sure how you can make that work well. Can't you retrofit some kind of ABS tone ring on one of the front wheels?

I suppose you could also modify the plastic disk with a hall effect (no contact) encoder and just ditch the mechanical cable. Install a meter movement in the dash if you are keeping the stock speedo, then it's all electronic.

The closest I've seen on hotrod builds is adding a reluctor ring and hall effect sensor.

Actually that gives me an idea. I might be able to replace the angle drive (the right-angle gear that on the inboard side of the driver's side front hub) with a dakota digital detector. That would remove the failure point of the angle drive and the cable running to the speedometer. But, it would mean then driving the speedometer electronically (which I've seen done before - involves going from electronic speed signal to spinning cable). Hmmm, maybe just putting the dakota digital detector in line (in the cable) is still the most direct - even with all the failure points.

My main concern was traction loss during launch 0-10 mph events. I didn't want to attempt to detect possible traction loss (and take corrective action) while the car was at speed (>10 mph).

 

[DrJeff]

Very cool! (...former Delorean owner here).
My good friend Dave built an EV Delorean years ago: The Home of the Electric Delorean Project
He also just bought a Tesla about 6 months ago.
DMC Texas also has an EV Delorean, but I believe they sold it to Google.
Another pair of Delorean owners (Brandys) also built an EV Delorean: Local owner electrifies DeLorean
Good luck on the project!

Was that the electric delorean built by Dr Dave? It is was, I remember finding some videos of the car back in 2012. I'm pretty sure he was the first conversion. He was one my inspirations for starting this journey. I wanted to convert a car and then saw the Electric DeLorean - and with my connection to N.Ireland (born there, lived there is 1981, married a girl from Derry), I was sold.

The DMC Texas car was built by Epic EV (just checked their website - looks like it's been dead for a few years). And yes, that is the Google car. It would be really nice to know what Google has done to it since. I hadn't heard about the Brandys Electric Delorean before - awesome.

EVWest are currently working on a DeLorean too. The car was constructed (just the DeLorean bits) at the DMC Houston site from scratch (not a refurbished car) and then sent to EVWest. I think I remember EVWest posted some blog photos of it when it arrived.

 

[DrJeff]

Got some new parts for the TesLorean. All Tesla... steering column/wheel, dc-dc converter, HV juction box, coolant heater, coolant chiller, coolant pumps, coolant diverter valves, power cables.

 

[doctorDHD]

This is DrDave with eLectricDeLorean.com. Where are you located. Sounds like a great project. I'd be willing to lend a hand.

 

[DrJeff]

This is DrDave with eLectricDeLorean.com. Where are you located. Sounds like a great project. I'd be willing to lend a hand.

I'm willing to assist with this project, ...

Hi DrDave, I'm located in Katy TX (30 miles west of Downtown Houston - hehe makes it sound like its in the country).

(DrDave, Ingineer) Yes, Yes, Yes. I'm going to need a bunch of help. I've done plenty of work on ICE's and lots of customizing on the DeLorean already, computer, the mechanical and 12v stuff I got, but this will be my first EV build. Classic mistake, I know, go straight for the top of the biggest hill. I kinda-sorta understand what I'm doing, but I wouldn't hire me to do it, only reason I have hired me to do it is because I can't beat my rates. Of course my low rates also mean that I take way too long to accomplish anything - which has its positives in that I think about stuff long enough so that I've avoided death and dismemberment so far.

 

[DrJeff]

Here's what I could find. Since it's safety-critical, I bet the boost function works even if CAN is lost:

<WIRING DIAGRAM>

Put +12v always-on power to Pin 1, Pin 17 and then Ignition to pin 20. I bet it starts boosting. The 2 going off the top of the page go to the Yaw sensor located in the middle of the chassis. But I unplugged this in one of my cars and Boost still worked. I suppose I can short CAN2 and see what happens.

It works!. The iBooster from the Tesla 70D with autopilot.

I made a video last night - but Internet connectivity problems kept me from uploading - coming soon. I left the Yaw and CAN2 unconnected and just put +12V on the Motor power, ECU power, and Ignition_On. Tried it with and without Ignition_On. Without ignition_on it does not provide assist, except for the 15-30 seconds just after switching the ignition off. With ignition_on it provides breaking assist immediately.

Now on to the process of figuring out the physical placement and bracing.

 

[Ingineer]

Awesome news! The iBoost unit is an amazing piece of engineering. Makes vacuum boosters look stone age.

 

[DrJeff]

They look sort of trashy in a sexy kind of way, and like most lingerie they won't be seen by the public. The stock DeLorean wheels hide the calipers, but don't have to stay stock under the surface

 

[TEG]

Is the EVTV Model S motor CAN controller something of use here?
EVTV hacks Tesla drivetrain, whiskey ensues [w/video]

 

[DrJeff]

Is the EVTV Model S motor CAN controller something of use here?

It might be, but there are unanswered questions about using CAN for motor control for motors from the AWD cars. There is also some uncertainty about how and when EVTV would offer a CAN based solution. Their current plan seems to be to bundle motors and an array of controller, displays, etc. into a single integrated product offering.

 

[Ingineer]

Jack is having problems figuring out the immobilizer, this is why he isn't offering anything as yet.

 

[DrJeff]

I got the Tesla steering column to produce some CAN (note had to provide power and ground to the CAN and LIN connections). The only levers that are producing CAN frames so far is the Park button and the steering column adjustment lever (up, down, in, out).

The frame IDs produced are 0404, 03, 0E, 45, 6D, and 032F. The steering column adjustment lever direction is byte 4 on the first frame with ID 45. Frames with ID 03 and 0E, byte 4, seems to contain a lever press duration or force measurement. All the other frames with IDs 0404, 6D, and 032F don't seem to contain any useful information (so far as I can tell).

When the Park or column adjustment lever is triggered the column produces about 5000 frames. I suspect it is waiting for a CAN message or handshake from the Body Control Module to confirm that the press / lever movement has been registered. The motors on the steering column are activated by the body control module, so the body control module has to receive the lever signal and then orchestrate the voltage & polarity to the respective motor.

I suspect that the reason why the Park and Column Adjustment lever are the only CAN producing controls is because the other controls don't have any function in an inactive car. I suspect that the other controls would wake up if they received the right activation frames from the body control module. This type of signal(s) must be produced just as the car is turned on.

REQUEST!!! If anyone has some wake up CAN logs from the Body Control Module, I'd be really interested to try them out.

I'm running SavvyCAN, GVRET, and CANDue (from EVTV). Many thanks to TheBlackKnight for helping me get the system up and running.

 

[DrJeff]

Got some new Tesla parts to play with...

- Yaw sensor (CAN connected)
- Rain and light sensor (LIN connected)
- Forward camera (with mobileye chip) (CAN x2)
- Airbox air temperature sensors
- Accelerator pedal (made by FoMoCo!)
- Rearview mirror (CAN connected)
- Lay (intermediate) shaft
- Wiring (just multi-colored wires - because you can't build a custom car with only black, blue, red, yellow, and white wires)

I'm forming a love-hate relationship with LIN. I've spent a week or more trying to get the Steering Column to talk. Some controls kick out CAN (by comparison to LIN they don't shut up), but most appear to be LIN (probably the Mercedes Benz heritage). Before LIN devices will put out you need to whisper sweet nothings.

Unless hooking up the column to the Body Control Module reveals the LIN codes, the best option for the column may be to build my own CAN sender taking the switch/indicator signals directly into a robust microcontroller.

 

[DrJeff]

CAN logs data and interpretation from the Yaw sensor (aka IVD Sensor)...

Produces IDs 0x0150, 0x0151, 0x0156

0x0151 bytes 5 & 4 (pitch)
0x0150 bytes 5 & 4 (roll)
0x0150 bytes 1 & 0 (yaw)
0x156 no apparent information

data is 16-bit unsigned integer
CAN data bytes numbered 0-7

 

[DrJeff]

WHY DOES THE REAR VIEW MIRROR HAVE LIN?

Working on the rear view mirror next. It is a Magna Donnelly make A048070 model 026664/046664. It activates the dimming in the left and right side mirrors. It also carries a LIN connection that runs between the mirror and the center main display. On the same LIN network are the seat heaters (hmmm, wouldn't have guessed that).

As far as I can tell the Tesla Model S rear view mirror does not display anything, so either the mirror has LIN connectivity & could display something (like a compass or temperature) but doesn't, or the mirror has LIN and is sending data to the center console (such as having to dim the mirrors due to headlights behind). The Rain & Light Sensor (located above the rear view mirror) also has LIN output that runs directly to the Body Control Module. If you wanted to see ambient light, that would be the best source.

I suspect it a case of the mirror being able to accept data (such a compass), and display it, but that the Tesla Model S doesn't need it to because of the more informative binnacle and main displays. Why put an 8 point compass in the rear view mirror if you've got a beautiful map on the main display. The alternative would be that the mirror is sending out data (notification that it dimmed the rear view mirrors?) - but that seems unlikely - and I can't see any reason why the mirror would be signaling to the seat heaters - UNLESS - if someone is riding your tail, the seat heaters come on!!!

So either the Model S does display information in the rear view mirror (never driven one so I don't know), or Tesla wired LIN to the rear view mirror but never uses it, or Tesla wired LIN to the rear view mirror, but then selected a mirror that can't use LIN (doesn't have a display behind the mirror).

Any ideas???