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The usual Battery Degradation Topic

Just wanted to report on the experiment:
For 3 cycle charging i did:
1. not charge the car until it hits close to 20%
2. make sure to let the car sleep as long as i can
3. charge to 100%

Minimum charge before the calibration : 265miles @100%
current went back to [email protected]%

I can report the battery estimation increase quite a bit and i am hopping for it to increase more.


View attachment 720153
View attachment 720154
View attachment 720155

So my conclusion is that even though tesla recommends to charge it every night, it is probably not the best for certain type of driving like mine which is not lots of miles on a daily basis.

For what i have read, the BMS needs to be able to read the battery state at different level to properly do its job. If I always let it measure at only 1 or 2 data points, it will improperly estimate.

I will see if it reaches higher levels. I will not charge to 100% for the next cycle but until 70% unless i know i will drive far, and i will not charge every night unless it reaches less than 40%.

We will see what happens

Thanks all and sorry i did not answer earlier. i am not getting notifications and forgot about this while doing the experiment.

Adrien
Are you saying you did the 20% sleep 100% 3 times in a row?
 

AAKEE

Member
Jan 8, 2021
480
538
Sweden
There is only one type of real degradation and it will bring the battery capacity down.
Real degradation will not be reversible.

The indicated range doesnt always reflect the real range/remaining capacity.

Actions to increase range do only affect the indicated range. It can not restore real battery capacity.

By science we know that for current generation of lithium ion batterys in general and Panasonic NCA in particular the charge lewel/SOC when the battery is not in use cause calendar aging.
For the range allowed by the BMS we have less degradation the lower the SOC is when the car is not used. Tesla recommend to charge asap when reaching below 20%, and to a very probable level this is due to the risk of ending up with a emoty battery that does'nt charge the 12v lead acid battery as this might put us with a stranded car. Also, the 12v lead battery does not like to get discharged(the cell sulfates).
But fot the big battery low SOC is not an issue.

If the car stands for most part of the time during a year with high SOC( 60% or more) the degradation from time(calendar aging) will be higher or much higher than the degradation from cycles/driving.
High temperature is bad, specially in combination with high SOC.

Most owners could use charging habits that minimize the degradation. Some might not have the possibility due to not having an own charging station, and maybe a SR with the need for long drives.

Charging ”just in time”, so the charge is finish not many hours before going for the drive and having the battery at the low end during the night will help reducing the degradation.

Lowering the cycles from perhaps 80-90% charge and 50% low end before charging to charge to 50-60% with 20% low end give the same used range but less wear on the battery will also help.
 
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CheeseheadIL

New Member
Oct 25, 2021
1
2
Naperville
2018 Model 3 LR:
90% charge used to get 290 miles in 2018
90% charge used to get 284 miles in 2019
90% charge used to get 278 miles in 2020
90% charge gets 268 miles in 2021.

I have observed noticeable degradation after a software update that makes me believe that Tesla might be like Apple limiting battery performance through software for whatever reasons they have.

Telsa tech confirmed that warranty only kicks in after a drop below 70% retention efficiency from original specs.
I've got a 2018 Model 3 with about 25,000 miles on it. I'm mostly a suburban driver putting on 100 miles a week. Just returned from an 800 mile road trip. Ran the car battery down to < 80 miles of range. At 100% charge, 280 miles of range. Disappointing but after reading the threads, I'm guessing not surprising and not in range of Tesla doing anything about this.
 

svusa

Member
Sep 22, 2017
68
70
New York
I've got a 2018 Model 3 with about 25,000 miles on it. I'm mostly a suburban driver putting on 100 miles a week. Just returned from an 800 mile road trip. Ran the car battery down to < 80 miles of range. At 100% charge, 280 miles of range. Disappointing but after reading the threads, I'm guessing not surprising and not in range of Tesla doing anything about this.
I think about 10% range loss is the new normal. I would be concerned if drops to 20%! This also changes the financial model to own EV, your charging cost may not go up but range loss + winter could put a significant limitation on the ability to drive further.
 

blkswn

2020 M3 LR AWD
Sep 22, 2020
44
19
Los Angeles
03/2020 M3 LR, 39K miles mostly highway and I'm currently at 274 rated miles at 100% which represents a 15% degradation based on 322 rated miles new. In the first year I always charged to 90% and have only gone to 100% a handful of times. Now I go to 85% and charge as often as possible though I do routinely drain the battery down as I commute 60 miles a day and chargers are sometimes taken up at work. Lifetime wh/mi of 248. TeslaFi ranks me at the bottom -- 7th percentile vs the fleet on battery capacity based on similar make and +/- 300 miles on the odometer.
 

BoxcarX

New Member
May 2, 2016
3
1
Chicago
01/2019 M3 LR, 32K miles mostly suburban and I'm currently at 279 rates miles at 100%. I've always charged to 90% and like blkswn, only been to 100% on rare occasions. Will switch to 80% charge and maybe do that every few days. I find it odd that when you go to the Tesla site and look at the used (2018 and 2019) Model 3 list, all the LR ones are at 310-ish miles. That just marketing?
 
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