Thoughts on Yoke from Plaid owner

[DayTrippin]

Oh, but they did. And you were getting a yoke anyway.

Obviously their thought process if flawed. I can say at this point after driving with the wheel, if I had to go back to the yoke, I would sell the car and buy something else. I would argue that the most important control input for the car is the wheel. The fact that they effed this up so badly with almost no benefit by going with the yoke, shows me that some of their priorities are truly skewed or their decision making is truly flawed.

The fact that they are putting the yoke on the cyber truck really makes me question how well they understand the role of a truck. They will get the heck flamed out of them once somebody has to park a trailer dealing with this abomination for control inputs.

Hands down I'd buy the F150 over the Cyber Truck. Ford will get the "truck" part right. I have absolutely no faith in Tesla regarding this. The CT may look cool but the Ford will likely just plain work like a truck should. I think Tesla announced way in advance of Ford for an electric truck but Ford beat them by a mile to market.

If Tesla keeps on the path they are, in a decade they could easily be old news. The competition is quickly catch up. If you are going to be on the cutting edge of design decisions, you better get them mostly right, and the key ones you absolutely have to get them 100% right. If the yoke was such an amazing control input, it would be on the 3/Y's right now.

 

[Plaid to Mod 3]

I did not test drive a Model S or any Tesla before I bought a Feb 2022 MSLR. In the four months of waiting for it to arrive I did frequent this forum. My first drive in a Model S was when I drove it off the lot. It took about 10min to get used to regen braking. And I practiced using the yoke in a parking lot, i love the Model S! This S replaced my Corvette very nicely ... no looking back! I did improve finding the horn by putting a raised clear sticker on it.

I think a lot of people are going to think it's okay at first because they took a big risk and it doesn't immediately explode in their face. I think over time the weaknesses of the yoke really start the surface especially if you spend any time driving in a car with a normal steering wheel. It took about 5 months for me to figure it out.

 

[SilverGS]

Hey guys, appreciate all the responses here and ideas. I will challenge one thought that people do not put their hands on top of the steering wheel or at least out of 10 and 2 position. Next time that you drive down the freeway look at how many people have their hands on the top portion of the steering wheel I would say it's going to be 98% plus. There's more to the consideration than simply airbags, it's also achieving a comfortable driving positions for long periods of time.

Honestly, I hadn't thought too much about doing the replacement steering wheel because it is not even completely circular and it seems like it would bring up additional issues without stocks and things. In addition it's simply frustrating to me to spend $150,000 on the car and have to do something Mickey mouse as this. I like the model S and I wouldn't be surprised if I get one at some point if they return to a steering wheel.

In terms of losing money, a decent portion of that lost money was simply in taxes and registration that I'm never going to get back. California is pretty high where I bought it. Also I'm just taking it to a dealer and selling it to them because I don't want to mess with selling it private party with a car that expensive. I could probably get another 10 or 15,000 out of it. However, a good 12 to 15,000 was immediately lost due to taxes and registration. As somebody mentioned above as well the wait time for a plaid is next to nothing so I don't think you get the bump that you get with a model 3.

In terms of my experience of full self-driving or autopilot, I'm not going to say I'm the most experienced person in the world but I have driven the car for several thousand mile plus road trips, I've got about 5,000 mi on the car and I was a commercial pilot so I do have an idea on how those kind of automated features work.

Anyway, appreciate the discussion I think it brings up some good points.

I guess I'm in the 2% minority that very ever rarely have my hands on top of the wheel.

I find the top position very fatiguing.

I find it so much more comfortable at the 9 and 3 position

 

[SilverGS]

I’m going to comment as I happen to have a new Model 3 Long range/boost and I actually changed the wheel to a yoke. I’m fortunate to have the traditional stalks with the yoke style steering.

Let me start by saying over the past few months I’ve come to enjoy the yoke much make than the wheel in our recently picked up ModelY Perf.

I find my hands rest just fine on the bottom of the flat section and much easier to relax for longer distance. My hands are actually more engaged at 3 and 9 than they ever were with a wheel and my lazy tendency to drive with one hand at the top and the other Across the passenger seat or simply resting on the centre column. Last weekend we had to drive 3.5 hrs return for kids soccer and we took the MYP first time. I will admit the wheel was uncomfortable for me and I found it awkward to rest my hands at the bottom on an angle.
My arms and hands are now more relaxed after driving a yoke than a wheel…something I had had not predicted.

Another interesting fact I discovered is that given the yoke is weight balanced to favour always being in the straight position (gravity), whenever I’m taking a turn it tends wants to return to its original straight position. Since there is no top section, the bottom section wants to remain ….well..at the bottom. Coming out of a turn has become so simple given the car wants to remain straight. Hard to explain but oddly it also helps with the car remaining straighter within the lanes (Less drift).

All in all, i don’t see the yoke as an issue. I’ve driven the new MS and I found the lack of stalks, horn placement and signal lights that move position a bit unnerving. Having a Yoke in an M3/MY is the sweet spot imo.

I’d try to ascertain if it’s the yoke that’s bothering you or the lack of stalks. If it’s the latter, no AMarket wheel will solve that particular issue.

Used to be an S owner from 2016-2021 so I do know the diff in both drives. MS is comfort touring speed while M3 is a superb handling dart. Different.

View attachment 820669View attachment 820670

Whenever I see these pictures, I want to get a yoke for my S But I won't as my wife drives my S too

 

[Swissness]

I think a lot of people are going to think it's okay at first because they took a big risk and it doesn't immediately explode in their face. I think over time the weaknesses of the yoke really start the surface especially if you spend any time driving in a car with a normal steering wheel. It took about 5 months for me to figure it out.

We are starting to worry about your mental health. Go out smell the roses, take a walk, enjoy nature. You obsession is not healthy.
You don’t like it we get it. Move the F## on, or sue, this is tiring.

 

[TessP100D]

We are starting to worry about your mental health. Go out smell the roses, take a walk, enjoy nature. You obsession is not healthy.
You don’t like it we get it. Move the F## on, or sue, this is tiring.

I kind of liked his colorful description. Seems ok with me.

 

[2putt4]

Obviously their thought process if flawed. I can say at this point after driving with the wheel, if I had to go back to the yoke, I would sell the car and buy something else. I would argue that the most important control input for the car is the wheel. The fact that they effed this up so badly with almost no benefit by going with the yoke, shows me that some of their priorities are truly skewed or their decision making is truly flawed.

The fact that they are putting the yoke on the cyber truck really makes me question how well they understand the role of a truck. They will get the heck flamed out of them once somebody has to park a trailer dealing with this abomination for control inputs.

Hands down I'd buy the F150 over the Cyber Truck. Ford will get the "truck" part right. I have absolutely no faith in Tesla regarding this. The CT may look cool but the Ford will likely just plain work like a truck should. I think Tesla announced way in advance of Ford for an electric truck but Ford beat them by a mile to market.

If Tesla keeps on the path they are, in a decade they could easily be old news. The competition is quickly catch up. If you are going to be on the cutting edge of design decisions, you better get them mostly right, and the key ones you absolutely have to get them 100% right. If the yoke was such an amazing control input, it would be on the 3/Y's right now.

People laughed at the first iPhone and continued their loyalty with BlackBerry and its physical keyboard. Companies advertise that they still have a headphone jack when their competitors don’t. Where are they now? BlackBerry now focusing on security software and whatever, Google and many others have now ditched the jack. Sometimes things that are so different don’t make sense and is hard to accept, but someone has to innovate and make the leap. Is the implementation perfect, no, but it will be refined over time as this is their first iteration. I’ve gotten used to it and love the Yoke, but the turn signals should have been positioned differently, but again it’s my opinion. I’m sure they have designers and user experience researchers iterate design to meet Elon’s vision. The fact that it’s on the road, it has met safety and regulatory requirements otherwise NHTSA would have denied it.


The F150 and Cyber Truck will have two different consumer demographics, some will overlap, but F150 will cater to the utilitarian consumer who use their trucks for work and the CT will be for the affluent suburban tech and first-time truck owners. The CT will be a conversation piece and it will likely surprise you at how many non truck owners will likely have one now that it is “cool” to won a truck. The #1 barrier to current truck owners moving to EV is range anxiety and ability to take your trucks places where a charging network is not nearby. This will be the hurdle that Ford and others will have to struggle with, the freedom to roam, be in the wilderness of Montana and not have to worry about having a charge. The infrastructure bill will be in the hands of companies that do not know how to build a charging network. I went on a road trip from SF to LAS and back and saw a few EV go next to some supercharges and the ratio was 20:1. Near Baker CA, there were like 40 Tesla stalls that were near full compared to 6 Electrify America that was totally empty until I saw an Ioniq roll in. Tesla is planning to triple its network in 2 years where the infrastructure bill will only try to get to where Tesla is at today in the hands of mismanaged companies. Good luck all EV manufacturers.

Tesla has at least an 8 year lead on its competition. Define quickly catching up, please. Just because GM announced the silverado, lyriq, and hummer does not mean that their catching up. Lucid just reduced their production guidance for the full year, Rivian going through similar early-phase pain, VW just got rid of their CEO who was probably the best they had. If anyone is catching up it’s the Chinese because they went all-in.

No one gets anything 100% right. Have you owned any car in your life and felt it was perfect? I complained about design decisions, features, and options with all the cars I’ve owned. Is you wife or gf 100% perfect? Nothing is perfect and you have to weigh in on what’s important to you. If the yoke is a deal breaker, then move on, don’t have to convince others. The Yoke is an option on the 3 BTW.

 

[TessP100D]

People laughed at the first iPhone and continued their loyalty with BlackBerry and its physical keyboard. Companies advertise that they still have a headphone jack when their competitors don’t. Where are they now? BlackBerry now focusing on security software and whatever, Google and many others have now ditched the jack. Sometimes things that are so different don’t make sense and is hard to accept, but someone has to innovate and make the leap. Is the implementation perfect, no, but it will be refined over time as this is their first iteration. I’ve gotten used to it and love the Yoke, but the turn signals should have been positioned differently, but again it’s my opinion. I’m sure they have designers and user experience researchers iterate design to meet Elon’s vision. The fact that it’s on the road, it has met safety and regulatory requirements otherwise NHTSA would have denied it.


The F150 and Cyber Truck will have two different consumer demographics, some will overlap, but F150 will cater to the utilitarian consumer who use their trucks for work and the CT will be for the affluent suburban tech and first-time truck owners. The CT will be a conversation piece and it will likely surprise you at how many non truck owners will likely have one now that it is “cool” to won a truck. The #1 barrier to current truck owners moving to EV is range anxiety and ability to take your trucks places where a charging network is not nearby. This will be the hurdle that Ford and others will have to struggle with, the freedom to roam, be in the wilderness of Montana and not have to worry about having a charge. The infrastructure bill will be in the hands of companies that do not know how to build a charging network. I went on a road trip from SF to LAS and back and saw a few EV go next to some supercharges and the ratio was 20:1. Near Baker CA, there were like 40 Tesla stalls that were near full compared to 6 Electrify America that was totally empty until I saw an Ioniq roll in. Tesla is planning to triple its network in 2 years where the infrastructure bill will only try to get to where Tesla is at today in the hands of mismanaged companies. Good luck all EV manufacturers.

Tesla has at least an 8 year lead on its competition. Define quickly catching up, please. Just because GM announced the silverado, lyriq, and hummer does not mean that their catching up. Lucid just reduced their production guidance for the full year, Rivian going through similar early-phase pain, VW just got rid of their CEO who was probably the best they had. If anyone is catching up it’s the Chinese because they went all-in.

No one gets anything 100% right. Have you owned any car in your life and felt it was perfect? I complained about design decisions, features, and options with all the cars I’ve owned. Is you wife or gf 100% perfect? Nothing is perfect and you have to weigh in on what’s important to you. If the yoke is a deal breaker, then move on, don’t have to convince others. The Yoke is an option on the 3 BTW.

The yoke sucks. …. And you know it.

 

[SDRick]

The yoke sucks. …. And you know it.

4 U , yes, we understand.

 

[TigerNinety]

I must have gotten used to the yoke in record time. I just have a very high adaptation rate.
Took me less than 30 minutes to get a hang of turning and I love the visibility the yoke allows. Turn signals are not a problem for me thankfully.
I couldn't even believe I was doing most of my driving with one hand.

An option for a regular round steering would have been the best for customers.

I'm curious, what increased visibility does the yoke allow?

 

[TigerNinety]

I realize that you are having a good time stirring the pot and getting everyone all riled up. But you need to understand that Elon and Tesla do not care at all what you think. I have been a Tesla customer for 12 years now - you can trust me on this. Elon and Tesla will create and deliver whatever it is that they think is cool and you can take it or leave it. They do not expect you to go aftermarket. They expect you to love whatever they create because they are always the coolest people in the room.

It's not entirely true that "Elon and Tesla do not care at all what you think." The removal of the included charging kit and the price to get just the basic option caused enough of a revolt that Tesla changed course and offered a less expensive option. True, they didn't go back to just including it, but where they ended up isn't where they started.

Tesla still lacks any real competition in the Model S space. It will be interesting to see what happens when it exists.

 

[TigerNinety]

The Yoke is an option on the 3 BTW.

As of 14 August, I don't see that as a Tesla option. Could you please say where?

 

[2putt4]

The yoke sucks. …. And you know it.

That’s all you got? Great.

 

[mspohr]

I'm curious, what increased visibility does the yoke allow?

You can see the dashboard.

 

[mspohr]

Just finished two long (800 miles/day) drives with the yoke.
I love it.
Very comfortable to rest my hands at 8 and 4 positions... lower corners of the yoke.
Much better visibility of the dashboard, also.

 

[2putt4]

As of 14 August, I don't see that as a Tesla option. Could you please say where?

Maybe you’re right about yoke not being offered anymore, but I thought I watch a video, probably old, that had it as an option. Regardless, it was introduced in the new S and X and the Cyber Truck soon. Why wasn’t it teplace in the 3 and Y?? I don’t know maybe they focused on the giga press update to the Y, battery chemistry, 4680, and other critical changes. Supply chain is an issue and the last thing they want is having to get a new mold or supplier for the steering wheel to fit the 3 and Y. Additionally, the 3 and Y has not had an interior major refresh. This is the reason why the model S hasn’t changed since it came out in terms of styling. Retooling your factory is costly and unlike traditional auto who refreshes their car every 2 years (mid-cycle) and 4 years (full refresh), Tesla has pretty much kept everything the same.

 

[TigerNinety]

Maybe you’re right about yoke not being offered anymore, but I thought I watch a video, probably old, that had it as an option. Regardless, it was introduced in the new S and X and the Cyber Truck soon. Why wasn’t it teplace in the 3 and Y?? I don’t know maybe they focused on the giga press update to the Y, battery chemistry, 4680, and other critical changes. Supply chain is an issue and the last thing they want is having to get a new mold or supplier for the steering wheel to fit the 3 and Y. Additionally, the 3 and Y has not had an interior major refresh. This is the reason why the model S hasn’t changed since it came out in terms of styling. Retooling your factory is costly and unlike traditional auto who refreshes their car every 2 years (mid-cycle) and 4 years (full refresh), Tesla has pretty much kept everything the same.

FWIW, neither the M3 nor the MY have ever had it as an option. The M3 and MY interiors have continuously been refreshed (much more frequently than the pre-21 MS/MX), and many of the MS and MX interior cues derive from the M3 and MY (eg cup holders, horizontal screen, etc).

As far as I know, there’s no official indication about why the yoke is not on the M3/MY, but one guess would be that the broader market wouldn’t go for it.

It will be interesting to see if the CyberTruck has only the yoke as an option. Some have speculated that the yoke may not be as well suited for rough off-road circumstances, but I have little experience there.

Thanks!

 

[TigerNinety]

You can see the dashboard.

I’m sure the seat and wheel can be adjusted on the prior MS so that this is a problem, but it mostly shouldn’t be.

 

[Wol747]

We are starting to worry about your mental health. Go out smell the roses, take a walk, enjoy nature. You obsession is not healthy.
You don’t like it we get it. Move the F## on, or sue, this is tiring.

The OP, like me, is concerned at the safety aspects of the yoke - although he has made the mistake of putting his money where he wishes he hadn't.
Apart from being, to some, "cool", I haven't seen ONE thing said about it that makes it a better buy.
I've seen multiple videos showing how "easy" it is to use and almost all of them show it being used in a way that in my experience would fail a driving test in 2/3rds of countries. And that's not even mentioning the ridiculous blinker controls.

 

[WilliamG]

FWIW, neither the M3 nor the MY have ever had it as an option. The M3 and MY interiors have continuously been refreshed (much more frequently than the pre-21 MS/MX), and many of the MS and MX interior cues derive from the M3 and MY (eg cup holders, horizontal screen, etc).

As far as I know, there’s no official indication about why the yoke is not on the M3/MY, but one guess would be that the broader market wouldn’t go for it.

It will be interesting to see if the CyberTruck has only the yoke as an option. Some have speculated that the yoke may not be as well suited for rough off-road circumstances, but I have little experience there.

Thanks!

I’m off the very firm belief there will never be a yoke option for the 3 and Y the way it is implemented in the S/X, i.e. without variable ratio steering. It would be suicidal for Tesla.

Can this thread die already? Pleeeeeease.