Told sudden permanent 15 mile loss of range is "normal"

[aviators99]

I just got the car back from service (13,000 miles). I'm pretty disappointed to report that they say that there is no problem with the battery, and my overnight 15 mile range loss is normal function.

I have a 5.5% loss for max charge and 3.3% loss for standard charge. They claim to have run diagnostics and everything checks out okay.

 

[Puyallup Bill]

I'm not too happy with that Vamp loss either. Last night mine was 9 miles from standard, which seems a bit higher than it has been.

 

[aviators99]

I'm not too happy with that Vamp loss either. Last night mine was 9 miles from standard, which seems a bit higher than it has been.

I am not talking about vampire loss. I'm talking about range loss at the time a charge finishes (the maximum at either setting).

Edit: Sorry, realized my subject was confusing. I didn't mean that overnight I was losing range. I mean I lost capacity overnight, and from that point on, it has been 5.5% lower. I will see if I can get the subject changed to: Sudden permanent 15 mile loss of range is "normal"

 

[Mnlevin]

that could be a real problem if you want to go on a cruise or vacation and leave the car at the airport. 10 * 15 means you would lose 150 miles of range. Could be a problem getting back to where you came from... that doesn't seem right to me

 

[Al Sherman]

I am not talking about vampire loss. I'm talking about range loss at the time a charge finishes (the maximum at either setting).

Edit: Sorry, realized my subject was confusing. I didn't mean that overnight I was losing range. I mean I lost capacity overnight, and from that point on, it has been 5.5% lower. I will see if I can get the subject changed to: Sudden permanent 15 mile loss of range is "normal"

So you're seeing around 225 rated miles for a standard charge?

 

[wstuff]

I have found a few miles drop if I don't use the car after it has been on charge for a while, but I have backed the car out of the garage to get at things easier and then put the car back in and plugged back in and the miles mysteriously reappear, i don't think it's a case of degradation it may be more a case of battery temperature and gauge sensitivity that is actually measuring the charge.

 

[markb1]

I am not talking about vampire loss. I'm talking about range loss at the time a charge finishes (the maximum at either setting).

Edit: Sorry, realized my subject was confusing. I didn't mean that overnight I was losing range. I mean I lost capacity overnight, and from that point on, it has been 5.5% lower. I will see if I can get the subject changed to: Sudden permanent 15 mile loss of range is "normal"

That amount of permanent range loss is pretty alarming. I'm still a little confused by what you mean by "overnight". Did you lose that 5.5% suddenly, in one night? That would be totally unacceptable, IMO.

 

[Todd Burch]

Remember the recent update that adjusted the range indication calculation based on pack temperature? Wonder if that's at play here and it's not actual degredation? It would go along with the idea that everything (cell/module voltages) checked out. Not sure the service guys really would know what normal degredation is.

This seems like an issue for JB to address.

 

[cinergi]

I just got the car back from service (13,000 miles). I'm pretty disappointed to report that they say that there is no problem with the battery, and my overnight 15 mile range loss is normal function.

I have a 5.5% loss for max charge and 3.3% loss for standard charge. They claim to have run diagnostics and everything checks out okay.

What version are you running? (did they update you during service)

 

[aviators99]

So you're seeing around 225 rated miles for a standard charge?

No. 235 from 243. Rated now 258, from 273.

- - - Updated - - -

That amount of permanent range loss is pretty alarming. I'm still a little confused by what you mean by "overnight". Did you lose that 5.5% suddenly, in one night? That would be totally unacceptable, IMO.

Yes.

- - - Updated - - -

Remember the recent update that adjusted the range indication calculation based on pack temperature? Wonder if that's at play here and it's not actual degredation? It would go along with the idea that everything (cell/module voltages) checked out. Not sure the service guys really would know what normal degredation is.

This seems like an issue for JB to address.

They claimed that engineering checked it.

- - - Updated - - -

What version are you running? (did they update you during service)

This started happening some time after the 4.4 upgrade.

 

[Oside2lv]

I only have 3500 miles on my MS and I have noticed some change in overall charge from time to time. I attribute it to temperature and battery reporting. I'm sorry to hear about your issue. Keep us updated as I'd like to know the final outcome.

 

[Oside2lv]

Do you charge to 100% a majority of the time or 80%? When I charge to 100% I get the battery longevity warning. Could this be a factor?

 

[rlawson4]

Seems the common issue is the lack of information as to what the standard charge should be etc. Information would clear up a great many things.

 

[aviators99]

Do you charge to 100% a majority of the time or 80%? When I charge to 100% I get the battery longevity warning. Could this be a factor?

Very rarely to 100%. Only 3 road trips and 3 or 4 high local travel days, compared to many Standard charges in my 13,000 miles.

 

[gregincal]

I think I said this in an earlier thread, but it's hard to fault them for losing range they didn't promise in the first place. A normal full charge for a new car is 265 miles. If you got more than that for a while that was a bonus. They are certainly going to only start counting range loss from 265 miles. That's only a 2.6% range loss after 13000 miles, which does seem normal.

 

[Todd Burch]

There's now word going around that rated range does indeed take driving habits into account. Someone on the Tesla Model S owners Facebook page said that a Tesla service employee from the factory told him this.

I don't believe it for a minute, but thought I'd toss it out there.

 

[Doug_G]

I believe that's a widespread myth among Tesla employees. I'm pretty sure they're just confused between Projected and Rated.

 

[rlawson4]

I believe that's a widespread myth among Tesla employees. I'm pretty sure they're just confused between Projected and Rated.

I have been told that as well. I do expect a decrease in range. I just want the best information.

 

[aviators99]

I think I said this in an earlier thread, but it's hard to fault them for losing range they didn't promise in the first place. A normal full charge for a new car is 265 miles. If you got more than that for a while that was a bonus. They are certainly going to only start counting range loss from 265 miles. That's only a 2.6% range loss after 13000 miles, which does seem normal.

My understanding was that it would decrease somewhat gradually; not over one night. Do you really think that this is normal?

 

[gregincal]

My understanding was that it would decrease somewhat gradually; not over one night. Do you really think that this is normal?

I agree it's weird, but I'm not sure it's indicative of a problem. While I don't necessarily believe the thing of it taking driving into account, there definitely is software strangeness around showing miles remaining (look at the adjustment they made for reporting cold battery miles remaining in 4.3 that was entirely a software issue). If they say there's nothing wrong with your battery, I'd just believe them. If after another 12000 miles you've lost an additional 15 miles of range that's one thing, but otherwise I'd be inclined to just chalk it up to the mysteries of life. The fact is that your current remaining range seems normal. For myself I know the first time I did a range charge I got 273, and one month (and 1000 miles) later when I next did one I got 265. But since 265 is normal, I didn't really think much of it.