Trying to buy but really?

[qdeathstar]

That's the hard part, has you need to sign all the papers and pay for it before you can see the car...

Dealerships pros cons

 

[Uncle Paul]

There is a big difference between an independant dealership that has hundreds of unsold cars in their lot (super inefficient and expensive) and the more modern system of just in time delivery or build to order.

Legacy dealerships for ordered cars will ususually not allow you to "test drive" your specific car prior to payment and acceptance. You can drive a representative car that they have on the lot, but not the actual car that you have custom ordered. You will need to make your deposit and approved credit prior to ordering as well on an in demand car.

Problem for Tesla is those customers with super high expectations. They want to make sure their car is the best of the lot. Every variable needs to be in their favor. Problem is that with most any car, if you inspect it enough, with high enough expectations, they most all will fall short.

 

[acarney]

There is a big difference between an independant dealership that has hundreds of unsold cars in their lot (super inefficient and expensive) and the more modern system of just in time delivery or build to order.

Legacy dealerships for ordered cars will ususually not allow you to "test drive" your specific car prior to payment and acceptance. You can drive a representative car that they have on the lot, but not the actual car that you have custom ordered. You will need to make your deposit and approved credit prior to ordering as well on an in demand car.

Problem for Tesla is those customers with super high expectations. They want to make sure their car is the best of the lot. Every variable needs to be in their favor. Problem is that with most any car, if you inspect it enough, with high enough expectations, they most all will fall short.

They also will then spend the next two weeks wondering why you’re not finishing the transaction. I had a Chevy dealer call me twice a day for 15 days after I said I wasn’t interested in the Bolt when I found out the incentives they advertised didn’t actually stack & the price was $10k higher than they listed. I have never wanted something horrible to happen to someone more in my entire life! >.<

Tesla called me once after I canceled my Model 3 pre-order to politely ask why. When I mentioned I was just waiting for the SR+ to be released & thought it would be better to have my $1,000 deposit back in my wallet until then they were totally understanding. Then they mentioned if I was near the store to swing by and test drive an S or LR 3 fir the heck of it while I was waiting. That was it, one call that lasted two minutes.

 

[Peteski]

Only recently have panel gaps become a big deal to typical owners.

In the 70's American and European vehicles had much larger panel gaps. Doors clanged shut, hinges creaked, and there was a significant variation in measured panel gaps around the car. Shocks were terrible, springs would sag over time, paint would often have sags, Exhaust systems lasted only a year or so, bias belt tires flat spotted and lasted only about 12,000 miles. Big cars wobbled down the road and handling was only available by increasing ride harshness. AM radios had knobs of push buttons and a big upgrade would be a rear speaker with adjustable reverb. Individual vent windows tended to whistle at speed and hand crank windows were standard. Had to reach across to each door to press down or lift up a locking button. Annual tune ups with carburetor adjustments, plugs & points replacements, tire rotations and new brakes was not unusual.

Europeans followed Mercedes lead by engineering a solid THUNK into door closings. Made consumers feel like the cars in total were better made. Seat belts were only lap belts, no air bags and often the dash was metal, and covered by paint. Bodies tended to begin rusting immediately, and where salt was used on the roads they could develope rust in only a few years. Owners would have aftermarket Ziebart spray tar based rust proofing to slow down the corrosions and make their loosly assembled cars quieter.

The Japaneese were perhaps the first to market wil better panel gaps. Their motors and bodies were put together like jewelry. Panel gaps began to become a marketing issue and people began to take note of what could be possible. These cars tended to be smaller and had less acreage to make alignments better.

Paint was getting better as well. Instead of a single coat of enamel over primer, water based multi coats were developed. They often used metal flakes to add drama and cover everything with a top coat of clear for a deeper look.
Repainting your car was common. Either go down to Earl Schieb (Any Car, Any Color...$29.95) or a trip into Mexico would get you a fresh and cheap respray.

Now, customers arrive at delivery with micrometers to measure each panel gap. They are looking at measurable, not only visible, differentiations all over the car. Want gaps perfectly equal from side to side as well. For some reason this has become the measure of quality in their minds. The car might work perfectly, but they still need to check the gaps.

For manufacturers, making every panel gap the same is hard, expensive, takes lots of time, causes more waste, and really slows down the production line. Companies like Rolls Royce and Bently almost price themselves out of the market by assembling many cars several times to get everything right. A common quote by Bob Lutz is that "too much quality can kill you" reminds people that if the production is not profitable the business will fail.

In mass production price and quality are opposing values. Consumers want their quality to be the best and their pricing the lowest.

Outside of fragile Ego's, having the right and left door jams slightly different do not really effect operations of the vehicle for transportation. Car fittments are often more a matter of pride than utility.

Many vehicle owners are perfectly happy to live with imperfections if it means they can still get to and from work, take vacations and run their errands.

Understand people wanting a well built car, but for some reason reading so many people not only rejecting their cars, but that they somehow take joy in coming to forums like these to kinda brag how they rejected a car because of a panel gap is somehow strange to me.

This is so true. Panel gaps have become an obsession. We now own 2 Teslas. Panel gaps are not perfect on either of them, but overall they are still the best cars I've ever owned. Whenever I have to drive a "traditional" car it feels like I've gone back to the 90's. But the panel gaps are great!

 

[jpfive]

I am trying hard to buy a new Tesla LR Y. I test drove one in the fall but saw some huge quality issues. Went back today and drove one again. Basically loved the drive and ready to order. Test car had some issues but I could live with them They had a new 7 seater just in so I stopped to look at it. The left rear corner of the roof was up at least ⅓ of a inch compared to the right. Pic I will post makes it look much better than it looked in person. Tesla rep said it’s because it was a 7 seater and they have to learn how to build them!!! Then he suggested I look at two other cars ready for delivery. One of those had the right front door protruding like the roof on the other car. Sales rep tried to close it but it was closed. I can’t believe they were trying to deliver these cars. Is it going to be a battle to get a decent car?

I have ordered two, a Model 3 and a Model Y. Both delivered to my home. Harder to reject at that point. Neither car was perfect in fit and finish, but were acceptable to me. I was delighted with both cars. Traded the 3 for the Y.

 

[Impaler]

Is it going to be a battle to get a decent car?

Wasn't a battle for me. I got mine in late July - it had a few fit/finish issues, fixed on the spot and with one service visit. Seemed easy to me. idk

 

[GeorgeC1]

I am not sure some posters understand that I am not talking about panel gaps. The roof sticking up like that is going to cause water intrusion issues unless they showed gobs of sealant in there which begs the question of what else are they not doing wrong you can’t see. The sales advisor kept trying to close the door on the other car thinking it wasn’t latched. Again that’s got to impact sealing the window and door against weather. That car was being delivered that day. As far as the argument that quality would cost Tesla to much it’s ridiculous. It’s always going to cost more to fix it later. It also costs sales above and beyond repair costs and enormous bad press. Quality does not seem to cost Kia to much to produce lower cost cars. As I mentioned the car I test drove had issues but I could live with them. These two cars were gross.
It’s sad because the design and engineering are brilliant. Fix the QA problems and Tesla would be back to a year wait for delivery after ordering on a Y. The service center can deliver a Y now in 3 days like I wanted and had several demos available immediately.

 

[Stavinski]

My Experience was completely different. Ordered my M3 LR on Dec 5 from the Tampa SC. A VIN was assigned a week or so later then a delivery day assigned (Dec 18) a few days later. Being a business owner in retail my time can be difficult to manage. I called and asked if a day earlier would be possible (Dec 17). They told me they will try. They called me on Wednesday and said Saturday the 18 would have to be the day as the car is currently on a truck in Arizona due to arrive in Tampa on Thursday and they need a day to inspect and clean the car. Delivery was at 4:30 PM. I arrived at 3:55. At about 4:40 or so they pulled the car in line for me to inspect, drove off at 4:55 on my way home. It was busy as *sugar* that day. I asked my delivery guy how many cars they were delivering that day as we had seen two semis of cars arrive while we were there. His answer was 92 scheduled for that day. They were efficient and professional.

I ordered the Homelink kit which included installation. Three days after I received it at my home a tech showed up and installed it and programmed to my garage. Once again, efficient and professional.

Tesla has been the best car buying experience of the dozen or so new cars I’ve purchased.

Same thing here. It took us 20 minutes to buy our Y, tried to have them do the opener at same time, they said not possible and sent a guy out a week later to install it at my home 35 ish miles from the service center. At $300 I think the remote cost more than my garage door opener! And no, we were not comfortable paying before seeing the car and brought a cashiers check with us for down payment. We’re still outta there in 20 minutes including inspection! Kids hadn’t even finished their lunch we brought them to eat while we waited thinking it would be a stupid and lengthy experience! It may have even been 10 minutes. They were on top of it...

 

[Peteski]

I am not sure some posters understand that I am not talking about panel gaps. The roof sticking up like that is going to cause water intrusion issues unless they showed gobs of sealant in there which begs the question of what else are they not doing wrong you can’t see. The sales advisor kept trying to close the door on the other car thinking it wasn’t latched. Again that’s got to impact sealing the window and door against weather. That car was being delivered that day. As far as the argument that quality would cost Tesla to much it’s ridiculous. It’s always going to cost more to fix it later. It also costs sales above and beyond repair costs and enormous bad press. Quality does not seem to cost Kia to much to produce lower cost cars. As I mentioned the car I test drove had issues but I could live with them. These two cars were gross.
It’s sad because the design and engineering are brilliant. Fix the QA problems and Tesla would be back to a year wait for delivery after ordering on a Y. The service center can deliver a Y now in 3 days like I wanted and had several demos available immediately.

People are trying to tell you that most cars only have minor cosmetic issues. The ones you saw sound pretty bad, but it’s unlikely you would get a car with those specific issues. Although it is quite likely that it won’t be perfect. Expect a few inconsistent panel gaps etc. But there’s more than a good chance the doors will shut!

Overall they are great cars. Probably not a good choice for people who judge cars with micrometers and paint thickness gauges. But beyond that it’s all very nice indeed, as you have already noted.