TSLA Market Action: 2018 Investor Roundtable

[heltok]

Chief Engineer Maier:

• -"Battery losing performance has mainly to do with them operating frequent into a too warm or too cold condition"
• "you can accelerate the vehicle 10 times 0-100 (km/h) with the value we will tell and that will be a very good value"
• " you can accelerate that vehicle 4 times 0-200 km/h without that, we at any point get into a problem of performance"
• Porsche is certain that with the above statements they can outpace Tesla. They also want to beat Tesla with quality

Yeah, good luck with that. Maybe consumers also care about other things beside being able to accelerate to 0-200km/h 4 times and 0-100km/h 10times. Like for example range, acceleration, comfort, safety, infotainment, storage etc. Just a theory.

Looking forward to seeing Taycan vs SpaceX Roadster.

 

[EVNow]

Tesla opened losing some of the pre-market gains.Nasdaq losing gains as well. Tesla up 0.5%, Nasdaq up 1.25%.

 

[Fact Checking]

My only issue is that I still can't explain their "350kW charging" thing. I have several theories**, each with its own set of repercussions (mostly "not good", but some worse than others). We'll see which turns out to be true.

Isn't Porsche using 800V, while Tesla uses 350V? This means they can put roughly twice as much power to the batteries over the same thickness charging cable as a 350V charger.

The question is whether the cells can be charged that quickly - which I believe is mostly a function of active battery cooling capacity, of which the Taycan appears to have enough.

Are there any other physical constraints that are limiting the fast charging of properly cooled battery packs?

 

[Krugerrand]

I ask very insistently to remove any association between Tesla and global warming/climate changing discussion. It is very important that in a 4-5y Tesla should be completely separated from this discussion.

If you do need a reason you can understand consider that the reason of "saving the climate" is just one of many possible reasons to buy or use Tesla products.

Huh?

 

[Chickenlittle]

I wonder if tesla can open gf3 faster than anyone believes. Musk to give press conference in China in a month. We already know that factory will not initially make batteries. Could they initially operate like Belgium factory doing final assembly steps to qualify for subsidies and eliminate tariffs? That would be added to as factory is completed. I don’t pretend to know the rules/regulations but with support of Chinese gov, they may help tesla get a good head start

 

[Drax7]

Daimler is buying over $20 billion in battery cells to support electric vehicle plans
Electrek for those that can't stand Fred anymore...

I think they meant trillion

 

[avoigt]

I believe Elon is really negative that 60 minutes did only air 14 minutes out of hours and how they edited what they brought out but I am disappointed and more that we all miss out on many statements he made that could be very valuable for us to understand Elon and Tesla.

To translate Elons Twitter below as I read it: "lame *sugar* ..... " The second part could be, "start to be tired" of this.

No wonder he unfollowed 60 minutes to express his disappointment and made it twice to make his followers aware. In fact he knows he cannot talk loud out expressing it and he is well advised not to do so but we get the message. Same happened with NYT but this time Elon was more smart and did not fall in the trap.

Really bad and although I believe what has been published is ok because Elon did well and it cannot do any harm its a missed opportunity on the duty of the media to inform the population.

In decades ahead the moment we are in will be talked about very often as a remarkable transition the society made and all what 60 minutes did was to fish in hours of interviews the few parts that potentially could create some sort of sensation but luckily they didn't.


2h2 hours ago
Oh... the video that they wasted all his precious time filming for no reason? IDK

2h2 hours ago
Exactly!! He gifted them his time... You KNOW there was at LEAST one dad joke in those hours of footage!! WE'VE BEEN ROBBED!!!

Elon Musk‏Verified account @elonmusk
Replying to @DOfaquarius @ElonsBrain and
So true

10:37 PM - 10 Dec 2018

Verified account 4h4 hours ago
Replying to @JohnnaCrider1 @mundanemun and
60 Mins actually had several hours of interview time, which they distilled to 14 mins. Many stories could been told with that time. This was accurate as viewed from an Upper East Side Manhattan dinner party.

Elon Musk on Twitter

Here is some prove what Elon did really say and what 60 minutes edited to change the content wired. Its almost like doctoring...

25m25 minutes ago

0 replies1 retweet2 likes

Domenick on Twitter

 

[KarenRei]

Isn't Porsche using 800V, while Tesla uses 350V? This means they can put roughly twice as much power to the batteries over the same thickness charging cable as a 350V charger. The question is whether the cells can be charged that quickly

That is, obviously, the issue. There's no magic to moving current over a wire. C rates are the issue.

- which I believe is mostly a function of active battery cooling capacity, of which the Taycan appears to have enough.

There's a lot of limits, of which cooling is only one.

My theory is low energy density and high C rate (expensive) cells.

That used to be my leading theory, but Porsche has already claimed that their cells are 270Wh/kg.

 

[Todd Burch]

MMD almost complete...

Amateurs...

 

[Krugerrand]

Going to help bust down that wall today
View attachment 360056

Not unless you charge that sucker.

 

[KarenRei]

Here is some prove what Elon did really say and what 60 minutes edited to change the content wired. Its almost like doctoring...

25m25 minutes ago

0 replies1 retweet2 likes

Domenick on Twitter

Almost like doctoring?

 

[Fact Checking]

[High C-rate, low density] used to be my leading theory, but Porsche has already claimed that their cells are 270Wh/kg.

I don't think they can achieve the desired acceleration with low energy density, so that was a non-starter.

So maybe the price premium includes the notion that they might have to change the battery pack under warranty if users fry their cells via fast charging. Porsche might be hoping that most (95%+) of the users will put it in their garage with no DC fast-charging available. Those customers will subsidize the battery warranty of the 5%.

Is anything known about the battery warranty? If I were buying a Taycan that would be my primary concern, as with any first-generation battery management system.

Beyond the craziness of routing 800V within a car - 350V is crazy high enough already and pretty dangerous. Or is the Taycan 800V bus limited to fast-charging only, and the rest of the high voltage power bus uses a lower voltage?

 

[Krugerrand]

Here is some prove what Elon did really say and what 60 minutes edited to change the content wired. Its almost like doctoring...

25m25 minutes ago

0 replies1 retweet2 likes

Domenick on Twitter

And there’s the qualifier that changes everything. More asshats.

 

[neroden]

I had a dream that I put $500k into shares and it was the best decision I’ve ever made. Dividends alone bought me a 2030 Roadster... Someone stop me because I’m about to transfer half a mil to Robinhood... I need a psychiatrist

OK, I'll stop you. Get a real broker, not Robinhood. Transfer that half a mil to IB or Fidelity or something. Robinhood is way too flaky to trust with big money. They take a larger "payment for order flow" cut than most brokers (IB doesn't take any, IIRC), and offer bad execution, and their platform is known for not working at crucial times.

 

[Unpilot]

Here is some prove what Elon did really say and what 60 minutes edited to change the content wired. Its almost like doctoring...

25m25 minutes ago

0 replies1 retweet2 likes

Domenick on Twitter

Bastages

 

[Right_Said_Fred]

I wonder if tesla can open gf3 faster than anyone believes. Musk to give press conference in China in a month. We already know that factory will not initially make batteries. Could they initially operate like Belgium factory doing final assembly steps to qualify for subsidies and eliminate tariffs? That would be added to as factory is completed. I don’t pretend to know the rules/regulations but with support of Chinese gov, they may help tesla get a good head start

Even though we really like our cosy Belgian neighbours, the Tilburg factory is still located in The Netherlands,

 

[Fact Checking]

Almost like doctoring?

Also note the following tidbit:

"[Full transcript of the interview] was supplied to @arstechnica by @Tesla."​

I.e. Elon had the sense to record the whole interview, or had the rights to get the raw material from 60 Minutes.

Yes, the 60 Minutes video editing and the manipulated transcript they provided on Twitter was false/misleading material information. The SEC should go after 60 Minutes for essentially lying about a key corporate governance statement of a public company, that might have had an effect on the stock price.

60 Minutes should really not be allowed to get away with this - this was clear-cut bad-faith manipulative editing that changed this statement Elon made:

Elon Musk: "So essentially I could just pull for a shareholder vote and get anything that I want provided I could get support for at least a 1/3 of the other shareholders. At the end of the day the shareholders pull the vote."​

60 Minutes cut out the section in bold, changing the nature of the statement Elon made materially.

Yes, I'm upset, because they are trying to steal good people's money, which attempt also happens to be illegal as sugar under SEC regulations.

 

[KarenRei]

Even though we really like our cosy Belgian neighbours, the Tilburg factory is still located in The Netherlands,

Could be worse - you could live in Sweden or Switzerland. Americans are always mixing those two up.

 

[EVNow]

I don't know when I missed this but what does MMA mean?

The original term was MMD - Mandatory Morning Dip, market manipulation by shorts to drive down the price, usually in the morning.

MMA - Market Manipulation Action.

 

[Chickenlittle]

Could be worse - you could live in Sweden or Switzerland. Americans are always mixing those two up.

They are different?