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U.S. reports $9.7 billion loss on General Motors bailout

Discussion in 'Energy, Environment, and Policy' started by ggies07, Oct 29, 2013.

  1. ggies07

    ggies07 Active Member

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    #1 ggies07, Oct 29, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2013
  2. J in MN

    J in MN S60 P12635

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    What you didn't hear is that the naysayers claim GM lost all that money on the Volt.
     
  3. scottf200

    scottf200 Active Member

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    And 1000s of suppliers stayed in business to keep jobs and provide parts to not only GM but Ford and many others, etc, etc.

    And they are producing award winning and high selling vehicles of high quality.
     
  4. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    How much did they offset this loss by paying less unemployment benefits? Reduced health and retirement benefits? Reduced impact to our economy by not having as many jobs leave the country to foreign automakers and parts suppliers?

    I'm not entirely convinced the bailout was a good idea, but trying to keep it in perspective.
     
  5. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    The loss was a direct result of the GOV selling their position. It was a self inflicted loss.
     
  6. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    They could only sell their share for what the market could bear. GM is only worth so much, no matter how much money they dumped into that hole.
     
  7. neroden

    neroden Happy Model S Owner

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    There was serious fear that Delphi would go under if GM went under, and that would have been a mess for everyone in the automotive industry.
     
  8. dm33

    dm33 Member

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    LOL. I've asked before, but sure you don't work for GM?

    In this context I'd say the $10 billion would have been better spent encouraging free enterprise. For that much, new companies could have been started. Imagine what Tesla would (will) do with that much money.
     
  9. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    +1000000

    Rewarding failure is a horrible way to spur growth and innovation.
     
  10. scottf200

    scottf200 Active Member

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    I've been a Ford fan since growing up. GM Chevrolet Volt was my 1st Chevrolet product. Very impressed with the car even after 26,701 electric miles from my garage plug in 2.5 years. And they've treated their customers excellent (like Tesla and unlike Nissan).

    Added you to my ignore list on this forum as well. MNL sure has been nice without you.
     
  11. rolosrevenge

    rolosrevenge Dr. EVS

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    Right behind you...
    So perhaps all of those suppliers and the newly profitable GM can pony up and reimburse the tax payer with interest?
     
  12. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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    Along with a lot of unreliable vehicles (from Consumer Reports reliability ratings and plenty of supporting evidence from places like say cruzetalk.com) still. :( My parents have had 3 GM vehicles in the past. We don't buy their products anymore.

    I did consider the Volt as it had a fairly decent reliability record, but there were numerous reasons not to and instead go w/a pure BEV. I would be very hesitant to buy any GM product until that particular model has a consistently good reliability record. That's much less of a gamble w/say Toyota and Honda (and their luxury brands).
     
  13. ggies07

    ggies07 Active Member

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    My whole point was that the Gov't gave money to GM AND Tesla, one making out of date cars and the other pushing humanity forward. Which one was able to pay it back with interest? Ah, that's right, the one moving us forward. All the while you have naysayers of EVs saying "But Tesla took money from the Gov't, yada, yada, yada....."
     
  14. scottf200

    scottf200 Active Member

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    I'm happy to see the USA headquartered companies doing well ... selling not only locally but globally!

    USA_auto-market-share-chart-october-2013.jpg
     
  15. dm33

    dm33 Member

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    For those that don't know, Scott is a moderator on the gm-volt forum. A site that regularly filters/bans posts that aren't pro-GM and has a culture that generally encourages attacks against even owners who dare complain about the Volt. I think such censorship causes more harm than good making it look like you have something to hide. Luckily I haven't noticed such behavior here.

    - - - Updated - - -

    But.. but... GM is the company coming out with their Tesla Model S killer. Their answer to the Model S is the Cadillac ELR starting at $75,000. Its a Chevy Volt with less electric range (35 miles), even less interior room and only 2 doors. It must be the real reason Tesla stock is down so much. (/sarcasm)
     
  16. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    CR methodology is terrible when it comes to "best" cars. I like their test reports, but when they pick the "best", then CR is junk.
     
  17. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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    There's a big difference between their reviews (which some may find worthless) vs. them reporting reliability statistics which come from subscriber surveys. They require that there be at least 100 responses for a given model year of a given model to even report the stats.

    Seems generally a lot more reliable than anecdotal reports and asking a few people who have them the vehicle. The sample size is WAY too small.
     
  18. GSP

    GSP Member

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    Excellent idea. They should set up a payment plan with the US Treasury to gradually pay off the $9.7B over 10-15 years.

    I won't hold my breath waiting for this to be announced however.

    GSP
     
  19. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    It is still a biased report. They only take reports from CR faithful. It is like asking baseball fans what is the best sport. Garbage in, garbage out.
     

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