Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Uber drivers and super chargers

erikku80

Member
Dec 9, 2015
19
1
Hong Kong
I think this is a very good idea but there is an electricity ordinance that you cannot resell electricity in a price higher than what you are charged.. Something like that.. Not exactly sure...
 

Optic

Member
Nov 10, 2014
198
14
Hong Kong
There is no doubt that parking at charging spot is a problem but that misses the point of this thread. The question here is does a commercial operation like Uber suck out our SC resources? Simple math shows it can/will and I hope that Tesla/Uber does something that is tailored for their solution. SC in fact is actually meant for long distance charging and in HK because home charging is difficult to come by, some of us have turned onto SC as our primary fuel source. If SC was not readily available (as its really becoming so), it is detrimental to the continuing growth of EVs in HK. Commercial uses of SC is just not fair to normal consumer as its us consumer that pays for the build out of SC (no commercial users means we pay less in our car price).

Like some people above, I agree that SC, as it's meant for long distance travel, should be charged a nominal fee for anyone to use. This will mean more owners will push for home charging and there will be less consumer chargers utilized by commercial fleets. Some may argue Tesla should build more chargers, but most of us can't even install a 13A charger at our parking spot.
 

lx3h

Charged.hk's Director of Education
Jan 3, 2014
1,330
34
Hong Kong SAR China
There is no doubt that parking at charging spot is a problem but that misses the point of this thread. The question here is does a commercial operation like Uber suck out our SC resources? Simple math shows it can/will and I hope that Tesla/Uber does something that is tailored for their solution. SC in fact is actually meant for long distance charging and in HK because home charging is difficult to come by, some of us have turned onto SC as our primary fuel source. If SC was not readily available (as its really becoming so), it is detrimental to the continuing growth of EVs in HK. Commercial uses of SC is just not fair to normal consumer as its us consumer that pays for the build out of SC (no commercial users means we pay less in our car price).

Like some people above, I agree that SC, as it's meant for long distance travel, should be charged a nominal fee for anyone to use. This will mean more owners will push for home charging and there will be less consumer chargers utilized by commercial fleets. Some may argue Tesla should build more chargers, but most of us can't even install a 13A charger at our parking spot.

I see your point, but Tesla can't tell who's an Uber driver and who's not. Also, the car in fact has included the cost of SC use (no free lunch), so even if a person is an Uber driver, in a way, he has paid so he uses. Hong Kong is a very special case where long distance travel really doesn't apply, saying that SCs are for "long distance travel" will allow Uber drivers qualify SC use even more because they cover long distances every day.

This Tesla-Uber issue is something that even Elon cannot answer in several public occasions. Let's not forget, Uber is potentially (if not already) a huge customer of Tesla.
 

DITB

Charged.hk co-founder
Nov 13, 2012
1,581
36
Hong Kong
Another option is that Tesla Motors issue warnings to repeat offenders. They have all the data: It would be quite simple to have an algorithm filter out those who are abusing the system, and send them a warning first. Then a second warning.

If they don't change their habits, it is even more easy for Tesla to somehow limit how much they can charge per day/week/month or ... stop it entirely, for a period of time. Yes, only after ample warnings, and not for one-off "mishaps".

Of course, offended offenders could then deliberately block superchargers, just to get back at Tesla - yet for the most part, they would get the point and see that "big brother is watching you - please behave, or find another place to charge". In the end, they need to charge their car, too, and limitations in supercharger use will surely teach them manners.
 

icemankaka

Member
Aug 18, 2015
100
8
M4 UK
i believe the SCs in HK have a different meaning as they are in the US. Tesla's marketing in HK is different from the US. the SCs are used differently.

as for selling power, Im sure Tesla can market the charge differently... esp they charge only when the car ISNT charging, not when it is.
 

Optic

Member
Nov 10, 2014
198
14
Hong Kong
It is easy to pick out the commercial users. Say average user charges 3 hours a week with a standard deviation of 1 hours. It means 95% people charges 5 or less hours per week. Anything above is beyond reasonable usage. In the end, the sc cost is spread per user and the at some fuzzy point, the lay man is subsidizing commercial fleets. Once again the topic Here is commercial fleets, not SPOTers. And hogging does detriment ev users. The Tesla marketing also never market itself to commercial fleets that can share into consumer sc. Well I have no solution, but if Tesla Let's sc be unlimited as it does, it will be a huge drag for us casual users.
 

Lerxt

Active Member
Feb 21, 2014
1,002
109
Australia
There would need to be a high threshold to determine commercial drivers. What would the daily km trigger be? And in your example what about the 5% who paid for their car with free supercharging? Why should they be penalized? More thinking is required.
 

lx3h

Charged.hk's Director of Education
Jan 3, 2014
1,330
34
Hong Kong SAR China
I know someone who needs to supercharge twice per day in order to get all the kids to school and back home. Poor him, he would be considered a commercial user be banned even before Uber drivers.
 

Optic

Member
Nov 10, 2014
198
14
Hong Kong
I know someone who needs to supercharge twice per day in order to get all the kids to school and back home. Poor him, he would be considered a commercial user be banned even before Uber drivers.

Well think of it this way, if this continues (unless you argue that such cases don't exist), it only takes 280 (13hrs*42SC/2hrs) of your friends before there will be a constant queue at the SC in the 9am-10pm time. Given your friend drives at least 250km a day and spends ~2 hours a day charging, he probably spends >5 hours in a car and 2 hours charging his car already and he won't have time queuing up at a SC. So the SC will not viable option for him in the longer term. Everyone becomes a loser in the end.

Free SC is great if there is plenty around as it will only be Tesla picking up the bill and all of us get to use it when we need it. It is no longer viable or fair if its constantly full because the avg user will be picking up the bill and also be lining up.

Once again my proposal is for Tesla to 1) limit the amount of hours we all can spend at a SC per week and 2) build out more SC in the outskirts to serve commercial fleets. Anyways all these is theoretical talk and won't ever be implemented. Many of us are avoiding SC because it is becoming too much hassle for the average Joe. Hopefully anyone thinking of commercial fleets will look at SC occupancy and price it in before they buy them. Except to wait an hour at SP or HW going forward.
 

Mikischu

Member
Dec 12, 2014
83
1
Hong Kong
Saw a driver today (not sure he was Uber, but 100% sure he was a professional driver for some car service).

When I got to the SC, I saw his display saying that he had 240km and he had set his charge to 100%.

Not only are they using the SC spaces more than regular drivers, but charging to 100% means that they take much longer to finish charging! The final bit of charging goes a lot slower.
 

Lerxt

Active Member
Feb 21, 2014
1,002
109
Australia
Ok so now I get the picture. We need to limit the charge % to a politically acceptable level, limit hours per day and ensure we all comply with the groups norm to be considered an acceptable supercharger user. Anyone read 1984? There had to be a smarter way of dealing with this.
 

Jim.MS

Member
Aug 28, 2015
49
0
Hong Kong
Elon promised SCs are free forever, anyone who bought a Tesla, until future changes, are eligible to use SCs anytime they want.

Even if there are SCs all over HK, it will be the same, because its free. I reckon the majority of Tesla owners in HK bought their cars with this very reason as their top priority, along with 0 tax, low running cost, resale value guaranteed. In other words, the total package is too cheap comparing to other vehicles.

If the same logic applies, P90D/P85D owners should have priority over other models, since they paid 80%+ more than a 70 with no option. This of course, is not right. I don't mean to offend anyone, but free things have trade offs. Even gas stations have long queues sometimes.
 

Optic

Member
Nov 10, 2014
198
14
Hong Kong
Elon promised SCs are free forever, anyone who bought a Tesla, until future changes, are eligible to use SCs anytime they want.

Even if there are SCs all over HK, it will be the same, because its free. I reckon the majority of Tesla owners in HK bought their cars with this very reason as their top priority, along with 0 tax, low running cost, resale value guaranteed. In other words, the total package is too cheap comparing to other vehicles.

If the same logic applies, P90D/P85D owners should have priority over other models, since they paid 80%+ more than a 70 with no option. This of course, is not right. I don't mean to offend anyone, but free things have trade offs. Even gas stations have long queues sometimes.

At this moment yes, SC is eligible for everyone. So far some argument is that it is legal and we have paid for it, but that is not the point of discussion here. Once again, the point of this discussion is, SHOULD IT BE prioritized somehow to maximize value to EV drivers? Rather than, was it or will it be.

SC is meant for long distance travel. In HK, we just use it in lieu of home charging. Thus people received below mail before which ruffled some peoples feathers.
Tesla Letter To Raises Several Questions | CleanTechnica

One of the social norm is to charge and get out of a charge spot and another is to not ICE. Also per Lerxt logic, if we don't stick to social norm then, your theory is that we can SPOT and ICE as these are legal. Obviously not correct. So once again, it was demonstrated that commercial fleets is hurting the average joe. There is nothing wrong with it legally but neither is ICEing nor parking at a super charger over night.
 

About Us

Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.

Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


SUPPORT TMC
Top