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[uk] UltraSonic Sensors removal/TV replacement performance

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#2,321
Hi,
Something that has not been mentioned previously by people who purchased cars in the UK are the Distance Selling Regulations!
Do these cover cars purchased online, I wonder (as DSR give consumers added protection for products purchased online & therefore unseen in person)?
Cheers
Steve
 
#2,322
Anyone consumer who paid part of the car cost on credit may also be eligible for recompense under section 75 of consumer credit act. Would only cover cost of EAP/FSD abd not whole car.

www.which.co.uk

Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act - Which?

If you buy goods or services on your credit card, Section 75 can give you extra protection if things go wrong.
www.which.co.uk www.which.co.uk

May also be worth bringing up topic with Which? I got them involved as part of a claim against Tesla regarding Premium Connectivity subscription on early UK Model 3’s - which Tesla backed down on.
 
#2,323
SteveM3Perf said:
Hi,
Something that has not been mentioned previously by people who purchased cars in the UK are the Distance Selling Regulations!
Do these cover cars purchased online, I wonder (as DSR give consumers added protection for products purchased online & therefore unseen in person)?
Cheers
Steve
Click to expand...
DSR was withdrawn in 2014. The Consumer Contracts Regulations is now in force and gives additional protection for distance selling. This has been covered before in other threads, yes it does apply and is why Tesla has to refund the ‘non-refundable‘ deposit if you cancel your order or return all money if you return the vehicle within 14 days without requiring reason or fault.
 
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#2,324
MrT3 said:
DSR was withdrawn in 2014. The Consumer Contracts Regulations is now in force and gives additional protection for distance selling. This has been covered before in other threads, yes it does apply and is why Tesla has to refund the ‘non-refundable‘ deposit if you cancel your order or return all money if you return the vehicle within 14 days without requiring reason or fault.
Click to expand...
Thanks - we moved overseas in 2012 - so a bit behind the times on current UK consumer law!!!
 
#2,329
rowedav said:
A step in the right direction at last!
Click to expand...
If it’s true, it is, I’m personally a little sceptical (although I’m more grumpy than usual today after over indulging last night). The usual release notes websites only have what Green tweeted (including his numbering mistake) and his recent form includes telling the world we were getting lots more cameras with hW4 which didn’t seem to happen. Hopefully I’m wrong
 
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#2,330
GeorgeSymonds said:
If it’s true, it is, I’m personally a little sceptical (although I’m more grumpy than usual today after over indulging last night). The usual release notes websites only have what Green tweeted (including his numbering mistake) and his recent form includes telling the world we were getting lots more cameras with hW4 which didn’t seem to happen. Hopefully I’m wrong
Click to expand...
Didn’t he guess the cameras from the computer board though and the inputs and who would have guessed some were left empty etc
 
#2,331
Artiste said:
Complete crap. Not everyone follows forums. If a paid for feature is removed it is incumbent upon the manufacturer to inform the customer. It isn’t the customers responsibility to somehow find out. Some people were informed but plenty weren’t. It’s another example of Tesla treating their customers with contempt.
Click to expand...
I have to agree there.. after reading the forum before getting my car, I didn’t know if my car would have matrix headlights, the new ryzen processor, the new 12v battery or USS (to some extent).. but I’ll admit it was becoming fairly obvious that USS was gone as people were belly aching about it. Much like the LFP battery, I read enough to assume that was standard for my standard range model 3. Lucky for me I’ve never had a car with USS so my standards were low and I just learned to use the cameras and back into parking spaces.. carefully..
 
#2,332
James-R10 said:
Didn’t he guess the cameras from the computer board though and the inputs and who would have guessed some were left empty etc
Click to expand...
I guess that’s my point and one that’s been made before by others, he guessed (hmm.. I’m guessing he’s guessing so I’m no better, irony acknowledged). He might guess correctly a lot of the time, and they are educated guesses, but has anyone seen anyone who’s actually got the software actually post their release notes and/or it in operation? He usually reverse engineers the code and finds fragments which aren’t necessarily live, so after that it’s speculation on how mature the code is, whether it’s near to being activated in the car etc.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the graphic is the graphic they’ll use, I’ve just grown to believe Tesla related stuff when I see it, and not before. I’ve become a lot less disappointed as a result
 
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#2,333
Erm, he had the actual HW4 in his hands and read off the labels. What wasn’t obvious at the time was that the hardware was likely containing ports for future/other use. Lots of things make it in to the software that are either never immediately or ever used. Spot on with the radar.

His speculation is based upon actually witnessing the presence of hardware or software features and, with help of others, decoding things like the NN’s (something that even Tesla commented on his accuracy of) - so an educated guess. Everyone else’s speculation is mostly based on other speculation/Chinese whispers and wishful thinking.

A big difference between his educated guess and speculation. He is a very useful source of information, that is mostly pretty accurate, even if it is not immediately relevant. eg he actually showed Apple Music already in the code even if it didn’t come along for over a year or longer. It wasn’t a guess, it was presence of actual code, just like phoenix radar, vision based parking and a whole host of other features.
 
#2,334
MrBadger said:
Erm, he had the actual HW4 in his hands and read off the labels. What wasn’t obvious at the time was that the hardware was likely containing ports for future/other use. Lots of things make it in to the software that are either never immediately or ever used. Spot on with the radar.

His speculation is based upon actually witnessing the presence of hardware or software features and, with help of others, decoding things like the NN’s (something that even Tesla commented on his accuracy of) - so an educated guess. Everyone else’s speculation is mostly based on other speculation/Chinese whispers and wishful thinking.

A big difference between his educated guess and speculation. He is a very useful source of information, that is mostly pretty accurate, even if it is not immediately relevant. eg he actually showed Apple Music already in the code even if it didn’t come along for over a year or longer. It wasn’t a guess, it was presence of actual code, just like phoenix radar, vision based parking and a whole host of other features.
Click to expand...
He thought the car would have more cameras than it does because a circuit board had more inputs - the cars don’t, they physically have less, I’m not sure the point is even debatable. As I say about the sensors thing, he’s found a buried image in the code but that doesn’t mean it’s active in this release

Maybe its interpretation and when he says he’s found something people need to understand what that actually means. The sensors feature might appear this release, or next, or only on FSDb cars for the time being or or.. it”s coming but we don’t really know when, but that much we knew before. Setting expectations is important, Tesla are getting a chronic name for timescales and I can’t help feeling that in part it’s people taking a small piece of evidence and then extrapolating from it.
 
#2,336
GeorgeSymonds said:
He thought the car would have more cameras than it does because a circuit board had more inputs - the cars don’t, they physically have less, I’m not sure the point is even debatable. As I say about the sensors thing, he’s found a buried image in the code but that doesn’t mean it’s active in this release
Click to expand...

Its not images buried in code that they find. Its quite unlike like many websites post images of release notes or configuration codes and puts their own interpretation on their meaning.

@verygreen actually enables a lot of features and runs them on their bench or even in their car. See the below of vision based auto parking (not the same as auto parking on cars without USS - need to mention that before someone takes it as fact that it is TeslaVision parking without USS). Far more than in image or bit of code is it not? They have done the same for FSD and shown the many configuration options of the FSD in their vehicle.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1425196411386306561

Or there are posts like this where they are getting real data out of the car - see overlay bottom left. Many of these come from crashes cars where the hardware has been retrieved and are able to be analysed.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1628446170509897728

And this is the thread about HW4 and its cameras. People can make up their own mind of whether of not they were talking about specific cars or just the hardware capabilities and potential configurations. Its HW4 - fact, It came from a Model Y - fact. Nothing about how it was actually connected or configured though, except one of the connectors being marked as spare and a bit of (and clearly noted as) guesswork on what the various labels mean.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1625905179282354194

GeorgeSymonds said:
Maybe its interpretation and when he says he’s found something people need to understand what that actually means. The sensors feature might appear this release, or next, or only on FSDb cars for the time being or or.. it”s coming but we don’t really know when, but that much we knew before.
Click to expand...

I totally agree. Far too many websites use this information, put their own interpretation and speculation on things and pass it as fact which many lap up. But don't think that is any different from much of the internet?
 
#2,337
If as we hope we are nearly there with a vision based park assist for cars without USS, I wonder if it will solve some of the weaknesses of the previous implementation. Specifically

1. It doesn't detect kerbs as they are too low, which combined with the tyres that provide no protection keeps wheel repair companies in business. Could a visual system overcome this height based limitation.
2. Could it have a more practical range, most of the time I'm parking it just says STOP and maybe beeps. TBH I'm not even sure if it does beep as I'm used to ignoring it.
3. Autopark is generally useless, just a novelty not remotely practical. With a more accurate model of the surroundings surely it can spot spaces better, handle parking between cars as well as within markings, and do it all at a more human speed (which admittedly would be terrifying). Why can't AutoPark work without me in the car like some other manufacturers.
 
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#2,338
On 3 - as far as I'm aware remote parking can't work on Teslas because per UNECE it can only be operated with a continuous signal from a dead man's switch.

Kia, Hyundai, etc come with fobs so can do that, but the fobs on Teslas are optional (and Bluetooth I think, not the same kind of signal/technology as normal fobs), so they can't. Tesla don't seem likely to develop proper remote parking for those of us with fobs since it would deviate from their current development focus (i.e. it would be a Europe centric feature).
 
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