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Ultra E - Ultra fast 350 Kw charging Stations - Europe

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by andrerodpt, Oct 19, 2016.

  1. andrerodpt

    andrerodpt Member

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    New ‘ultra-fast 350 kW charging stations’ for EVs to be deployed in Europe in partnership with Audi, BMW and others

    Full article:

    1 - It puzzles me this kind of project only requires a 13 million euro (around 14,5 million dollars) to implement.
    2 - And GM still thinks it don't need to implement any fast-charging station...
     
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  2. widodh

    widodh Model S 85kWh

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    Interesting! Would be great if there would be a CCS adapter from Tesla so that a Model S/X could charge there with ~120kW, just as fast as SuperChargers.
     
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  3. jbcarioca

    jbcarioca Active Member

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    This was in the plans from CharIN some time ago, and is essential for the German producers to meet their BEV 2020 sales numbers. Luckily for them the standard is already made, less luckily, the precise means of achieving the 350 kW is not so clearly defined. I anxiously await actual delivery, and the deployment of such technology in North America as well as Europe. This can only be good news for everyone, assuming they actually deliver. Candidly I'll wager their actual first deliveries will be around 100-125 kW rather than anything more. The theoretical 350 kW will demand giant steps in power distribution, battery charge absorption technology and heat dissipation in transmission. Beyond ~100 kW or so the complexity rises pretty quickly...
     
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  4. WannabeOwner

    WannabeOwner Active Member

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    Would it be daft to have "two" batteries (and chargers) and do half-and-half at 100kW each? (well .. until technology finds some better battery chemistry and solves the other problems). I suppose you still have the heat (from both batteries) to get rid of
     
  5. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    350kW capability is probably not going to help the entry level EVs at this point in technology.

    A 60kWh battery is not going to last as long if you try to recharge it at 6C. That's pretty brutal on the battery, and I doubt you could even cool the battery enough with a car sitting still. A radiator and electric fan can only transfer so much heat.

    Somebody smarter than I could do the math, but I believe the internal resistance of existing battery technology is going to be a serious roadblock. Big batteries will have some heat soak they can use up first, but then the cooling system will cap the charge rate.
     
  6. hiroshiy

    hiroshiy Supporting Member

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    350kW 350A means 1000V charging. If your vehicle operates at 400V you'll get 140kW.

    Now what is the difference between Ultra-E and CCS?
     
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  7. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Active Member

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    Exactly. Are car manufacturers addicted to bragging about about specs? Because this announcement is nothing but tossing out a big number with nothing to back it up. No cars are even on the drawing board that operate at 1,000 volts.

    In practice, this spec is no better than a current Tesla Supercharger.

    Or, as they like to say in the country, don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining.
     
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  8. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Clearly this quote is only discussing the 50KW capability...nothing spectacular there. o_O
     
  9. andrerodpt

    andrerodpt Member

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    I think we're missing the main point.
    IMO the relevance in this is that a bunch of car brands decided to join and create a network of chargers.
    Yes, it's true none have any EV that can charge at that rate. But they are willing to go the extra mile and future proof this network.
    They are not waiting on anyone else. They acknowledge the EU market is huge and there is demand. For us, Europeans, that is very good to hear.
     
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  10. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    Power distribution within the pack is irrelevant; the battery modules are already charged in parallel within the car. The limiting factors that you note still remain but will improve: the ability of the chemistry to take the charge rate without damage, and the ability of the system to dissipate heat. Large trucks and buses, with really large batteries, would be able to take higher charge rates.
     
  11. RDoc

    RDoc S85D

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    Again, what kind of C rate would this require and what battery system could absorb it without damage?

    Perhaps buses or trucks might have large enough batteries, but I'm pretty doubtful. The weight and cost of them (300-350 kWh?), not to mention very limited range, would be a tough sell for those industries.
     
  12. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    Yep. The actual voltage and amps is what matters. Once you factor that in, it's going to be pretty much the same as the superchargers until we move to much higher voltage packs.
     
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  13. hiroshiy

    hiroshiy Supporting Member

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    So what is Ultra-E alliance and what is the difference between Ultra-E and CCS standard? Isn't 1000V 350A within proposed spec of CCS?
     

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