Understanding PGE/SVCE electricity bills/TrueUP

[cwied]

I have a hard time believing that you are a net importer with positive PG&E NEM charges for delivery and somehow have a net positive on the PCE CCA NEM charges for generation. Care to share your annual NEM charges/credits and import/export kWh numbers?

My issue isn't the delivery charges, but the PCIA and FFS charges. Those were billed by PG&E even though I had a negative NEM credit with PG&E. I can partially offset those with the PCE NEM credit (eventually - I had less than $100 credit this year). I had about $-90 NEM balance with PG&E and about $-40 NEM balance with PCE this past true-up. I was billed about $100 for the fees by PG&E despite the negative NEM balance. There's a discussion further up-thread about this.

I don't know what will happen this year. I'm both using more energy and exporting more during peak. It seems like the way the rates are structured is going to net me more NEM credits with PG&E than PCE, so you may be right that I'll end up with all my NEM credits on the PG&E side anyway. This seems to have changed in EV2-A compared to E-6 and EV-A.

 

[Redhill_qik]

My issue isn't the delivery charges, but the PCIA and FFS charges. Those were billed by PG&E even though I had a negative NEM credit with PG&E. I can partially offset those with the PCE NEM credit (eventually - I had less than $100 credit this year). I had about $-90 NEM balance with PG&E and about $-40 NEM balance with PCE this past true-up. I was billed about $100 for the fees by PG&E despite the negative NEM balance. There's a discussion further up-thread about this.

I don't know what will happen this year. I'm both using more energy and exporting more during peak. It seems like the way the rates are structured is going to net me more NEM credits with PG&E than PCE, so you may be right that I'll end up with all my NEM credits on the PG&E side anyway. This seems to have changed in EV2-A compared to E-6 and EV-A.

This was discussed earlier in post 374 and a couple after that one in this thread. The PCIA and FFS are generation charges and not transmission or distribution charges, so you still need to pay them if you imported more kWh than you exported. Since money is fungible, the PCE check that you received for your generation credit can be considered to have "paid" for the PG&E PCIA and FFS charges, but it did it indirectly versus directly due to PG&E and PCE being separate businesses.

 

[cwied]

This was discussed earlier in post 374 and a couple after that one in this thread. The PCIA and FFS are generation charges and not transmission or distribution charges, so you still need to pay them if you imported more kWh than you exported. Since money is fungible, the PCE check that you received for your generation credit can be considered to have "paid" for the PG&E PCIA and FFS charges, but it did it indirectly versus directly due to PG&E and PCE being separate businesses.

Yes, I remember that. My point is that if the CCA stops paying out, I would effectively have a non-bypassable generation charge because of the way the NEM credits and fees are split. While I understand that all of these rules are just artificial constructs, it makes some intuitive sense to me that I should be able to use NEM credits from the generation side to offset generation fees. It would seem cleaner to me if all the generation charges were on the same bill instead of being split between PG&E and PCE.

 

[holeydonut]

Hey folks... any chance you all lost access to your NEM2-PS statements via the PG&E website?

I used to be able to use the drop down on the main dashboard and click into "My Accounts & Services". Then I could click on my Service ID and view details about that meter/bill. But now under Service Details I just see some stuff, but no drop-down to download any past billing statement?

I'm on a CCA (MCE), but that shouldn't affect the NEM2-PS black and white statement right? I can still see my blue header normal PG&E bills under the normal "Bill and Payment History" menu.

 

[miimura]

The pull-down list of NEM-PS bills is gone when I look under "My Accounts & Services", so it's not just you.

 

[getakey]

disappeared for me yesterday. I've been checking everyday because I have not had an electric bill in over 2 months. Got switched to CCA on 3/28, but did not want the switch. Called to get switched back in April. No bill for electric service since 3/28. Have had 2 gas bills

 

[Redhill_qik]

Hey folks... any chance you all lost access to your NEM2-PS statements via the PG&E website?

I used to be able to use the drop down on the main dashboard and click into "My Accounts & Services". Then I could click on my Service ID and view details about that meter/bill. But now under Service Details I just see some stuff, but no drop-down to download any past billing statement?

I'm on a CCA (MCE), but that shouldn't affect the NEM2-PS black and white statement right? I can still see my blue header normal PG&E bills under the normal "Bill and Payment History" menu.

I've lost the ability to download the black bill as well from PG&E. I hope that it isn't related to my request to not get the paper bill mailed to me.

 

[holeydonut]

My tinfoil hat conspiracy is they've identified all the PG&E customers in this thread and blocked them from reading their NEM2-PS bills. We were close to understanding all their closely guarded secrets. Which is kind of weird since the only people that download the stupid 25 page black and white bill from PG&E's website are probably the ones posting in this thread.

Blocking us from accessing the bills kind of torpedoes that TED talk I was waiting for

 

[evtifosi]

I have been trying to figure out my CCA rates compared to PG&E for a few months. We are on Central Coast Community Energy here in the Monterey Bay area...

I am not sure I understand the rates correctly - but comparing things I think I have to add the generation and delivery charges to the CCA rate fees???

When I do this I get my real price per Kwh - so I am seeing E6 rates as follows:

Summer Peak 3PM-8PM Mon-Fri - $.40 kwh
Part Peak 12PM-3PM, 8PM-10PM Mon-Fri - $.311
Off Peak 10PM-12PM - $.297

I am on NEM1 - E-6 grandfathered rates. (I know E6 is going away after this year basically). I am thinking it might be a good time to switch to another plan but can't figure out if it is worth doing now or waiting. Plus I don't even know if my numbers above are correct...it is so hard trying to figure this stuff out.

2015-2018 we were at almost break even in our NEM charges on PG&E - then things started going sideways - now I am paying as much as we did before solar...

System: 4.1Kwh - 16 panels - Enphase micro-inverters - installed in 2015 - 1 Powerwall installed in 2021
Usage: Low - Medium - coastal climate, no AC, pool (running VS pump @1100rpm), 1 EV driven about 5000 miles per year

I would like to get help figuring out the rates and what I should do. Can anyone help me out a bit? Thanks!!!

 

[evtifosi]

You add PG&E transmission, distribution, your PCIA Vintage year and FFS to the CCA generation rate.

Thanks, I mixed up a few of the terms I think...

The CCCE "Generation Charges" are the rates I have a nice chart of...

SUMMER PEAK $0.19500
SUMMER PART‐PEAK $0.10100
SUMMER OFF‐PEAK $0.08600

I calculated the PG&E part I need to add as around $.21 for all the time periods...but I don't think I figured out the PCIA rate correctly

 

[Redhill_qik]

Thanks, I mixed up a few of the terms I think...

The CCCE "Generation Charges" are the rates I have a nice chart of...

SUMMER PEAK $0.19500
SUMMER PART‐PEAK $0.10100
SUMMER OFF‐PEAK $0.08600

I calculated the PG&E part I need to add as around $.21 for all the time periods...but I don't think I figured out the PCIA rate correctly

I started to work this out for you, but CCCE and E-6 is more complicated than I have time for. Here are some things to get you started.

First, the CCCE Residential Rates for generation looks like this.

Since you have a small array are a very likely a net consumer, I think that the Seasonal Flat Rate plan is your best options over trying to get slightly lower cost on the weekends and from 10:00pm-12:00pm, but you will need to gauge what you are doing during those times.

The PG&E E-6 tariff is currently this

The E-6 plan like the E-TOU-C plan that I am on has this Conservation Incentive Adjustment where if you use less than the Baseline kWh then you get a credit and if you are above it you pay a penalty. For some unknown reason during Summer Peak both under and over are credits, but of different amounts. So instead of it being $0.32243 it is either $0.05734 or $0.152338 which is really weird is that the Peak under amount is less than both the Part-Peak and Off-Peak under amounts.

You should then added up all of the flat transmission + fees items except for PPP, ND, CTC and WFC as those are your NBCs and the new Bundled PCIA that gets replaced with your actual PCIA Vintage year. Good luck.

 

[evtifosi]

I started to work this out for you, but CCCE and E-6 is more complicated than I have time for. Here are some things to get you started.
-----
You should then added up all of the flat transmission + fees items except for PPP, ND, CTC and WFC as those are your NBCs and the new Bundled PCIA that gets replaced with your actual PCIA Vintage year. Good luck.

Thanks Redhill

I have seen the first chart you posted as well - that is kind of my baseline

I don't think I can get on the flat rate plan (that was an option only up until October 2021)

 

[FlatSix911]

I started to work this out for you, but CCCE and E-6 is more complicated than I have time for. Here are some things to get you started.

First, the CCCE Residential Rates for generation looks like this.
View attachment 819803

Since you have a small array are a very likely a net consumer, I think that the Seasonal Flat Rate plan is your best options over trying to get slightly lower cost on the weekends and from 10:00pm-12:00pm, but you will need to gauge what you are doing during those times.

The PG&E E-6 tariff is currently this
View attachment 819805

The E-6 plan like the E-TOU-C plan that I am on has this Conservation Incentive Adjustment where if you use less than the Baseline kWh then you get a credit and if you are above it you pay a penalty. For some unknown reason during Summer Peak both under and over are credits, but of different amounts. So instead of it being $0.32243 it is either $0.05734 or $0.152338 which is really weird is that the Peak under amount is less than both the Part-Peak and Off-Peak under amounts.

You should then added up all of the flat transmission + fees items except for PPP, ND, CTC and WFC as those are your NBCs and the new Bundled PCIA that gets replaced with your actual PCIA Vintage year. Good luck.

Looks good... doesn't the PG&E E-6 rate plan start to phase out and transition to a TOU 4-9 pm plan on 7-1-22?

 

[Redhill_qik]

My tinfoil hat conspiracy is they've identified all the PG&E customers in this thread and blocked them from reading their NEM2-PS bills. We were close to understanding all their closely guarded secrets. Which is kind of weird since the only people that download the stupid 25 page black and white bill from PG&E's website are probably the ones posting in this thread.

Blocking us from accessing the bills kind of torpedoes that TED talk I was waiting for

I am able to download the black bill from PG&E again today.

 

[miimura]

I am able to download the black bill from PG&E again today.

Me too. It's back.

 

[holeydonut]

Me too. It's back.

Yeahhhhhh it's back for me too. I now have the only page of my black and white bill that I have ever understood.

 

[getakey]

I can download the B&W bills now too and I finally got a new electric bill. I had not received an electric bill since 3/28 which is the day I was supposedly converted to Pioneer CCA. I called them in April to convert back. They said it would take a month because it had to happen at the end of a billing cycle.
So I got a Blue bill with consolidated electric charges from 3/28 through 6/21 which included a true-up charge for last year thru 4/20 which is a month earlier than my normal true-up. It was not labelled as true-up in the blue bill. So I looked at the B&W bills which I now have 3 new ones. The true-up thru 4/20 plus 4/20 to 5/19 and 5/19 to 6/20. I do not see anything in the true-u which reflects being on Pioneer for any period of time nor do I have any blue bill which shows Pioneer. What would the CCA info look like in a B&W bill

 

[Redhill_qik]

On page 2 in the "True-Up History Summary" table you would see columns with CCA in the header, CCA Wildfire Fund, CCA DA Power, CCA Ongoing CTC, and CCA ECRA.

 

[getakey]

On page 2 in the "True-Up History Summary" table you would see columns with CCA in the header, CCA Wildfire Fund, CCA DA Power, CCA Ongoing CTC, and CCA ECRA.

nothing like that there

 

[getakey]

here's the odd part. The last B&W bill I got prior to getting the new ones was for 1 week of service: 3/21 to 3/28. This is kind of consistent with Pioneer telling me I was switched on 3/28. Now the recent B&W bills are:
3/28 to 4/20 which includes the true up summary
4/20 to 5/19
5/19 to 6/20

I'm wondering if when they switched me back to PG&E, they just said billing me for one month of service did not make sense and so PG&E generated their bills catching me back up from 3/28