Unhappy with FSD sales and pricing

[rxlawdude]

Given people were still able to bring a class action back then, I presume their agreements didn't have a requirement for arbitration however (or did all of people participating opt out?). I would presume Tesla can't unilaterally retroactively change the terms for those people.

That was prior to the SCOTUS case. And I'm pretty sure Tesla then (after the class action you cite) added the prohibition against class action arbitration. Because the 2019 SCOTUS decision says "no class action arbitration unless explicitly specified in the agreement," the language is not even needed anymore.

 

[Skotty]

Tesla has been pretty direct with scamming even the most loyal fans. But if you're thinking of buying FSD, just consider that first day reservation people have been waiting close to three years for FSD -- and counting. Then Elon says during the fourth quarter earnings report call that Tesla isn't considering transferring ownership to a new car. For perspective, you buy software in mostly everywhere else, and it easily continues on to the next device, be it iPad, iphone, Android, etc. Perhaps Elon knew everyone would just assume if you're putting this amount of money into a software that hasn't even been released, the decent thing to do is to at least do the same thing. NOPE.

If you buy FSD, and you get into a bad accident with it, and say you're forced to buy a used car, insurance won't take into account the value of that software. If this happens anytime soon or has happened to, imagine, a first day reservation Model 3, that person would never even experience that software. Bottom line, Tesla will have used those thousands to build their company, promised you something, and you actually won't even get that something. That is totally unheard of. That is incredibly wrong.

So basically, there's a whole group of people who bought this software for a cheaper price, but are not taking into account the risk of actually buying something that they may never actually receive. Or if they do receive it, these consumers need to also keep in mind that the discount is one thing, but the years shaved off the car itself is another consideration.

Elon's strategy is simple. Get his company profitable. Use your money to do it. Promise FSD for 2019, 2020, 2021 -- and so on... Get the company to profit. Screw the consumers on whose backs Tesla was build on. And these consumers, if the car has been spared of any major accidents, will receive the software possibly with half the life of the car remaining.

If you don't think this is a major scam, Elon by the way isn't new to scams. Remember when he offered all these Tesla Model S owners free supercharging. Those old school nickel / aluminum / magnanese / cobalt batteries are already subject to dying out faster than the newer, more advanced batteries, but also supercharging your car for free only encourages batteries to die out faster and, later, this person will be coming to Tesla to replace their battery, which will pay back all the "free" electricity fees to begin with.

I would say FSD is a crap deal not worth the money, but not a scam. The worst thing they have done is probably the bait and switch on the cost of the original Roadster during the early years, which was somewhat forgivable, and more recently the bait and switch on solar install cost for signed contracts, which is arguably not forgivable.

A lot of hype with FSD, and people genuinely think it will be here sooner than it actually will be, and that includes Tesla staff and management as well. It's not a scam. It's just overconfidence.

 

[FunSecured]

My argument is going to be that this was stated for wide release for everyone who purchased it in March and was willing to accept specific terms and conditions, then the button was tied to v9, which was subsequently released, but only to the existing beta testers, then it went to v10 or 11, but the next update is 9.1, meaning they can keep pushing out a ton of sub updates.

Clearly they feel it's safe enough for public use because they pushed it out to 71 non employees, which appears to be more based on social influencing ability than driving style/record.

I figure at worst, I don't get the software, at best they don't want to waste money on arbitration fees, and decide to give it to me earlier than I'd otherwise get it.

Thanks for sharing all that info. It’ll be interesting to see how it shakes out (if you go BBB). If you think about it (after) I’d be interested to know how it all ends!

 

[pilotbeagle]

I think you're missing some massive groups of people.

The biggest group that I can think of is Senior citizens. Where they still want their freedom, but they have issues with driving. Or they're worried about their driving, but they're too stubborn to let go of it. Quite a few of us including myself have had to take the keys away from our parents because they're a danger to others on the roads.

Older folks might not traditionally spend >$70K on a car, but exceptions are made.

In technology the price of something goes down fairly rapidly over time, and EV's a perfect example of this. The 2015 Model S I had was close to $100K when I bought it, but it doesn't have nearly the range/dollar that a new Model 3 offers or even the new Model S.

So I expect the cost of self-driving cars to quickly come down as the high demand from certain groups is satisfied. But, those groups will account for years, and years of lucrative sales.

For myself I'm kind of lucky in that Tesla didn't accomplish FSD because if/when they do I promised my mother I'd give her my car.

I agree...As a senior that owns two FSD upgraded Tesla's (2017 Model S 75 and a 2018 Model 3 LR AWD Performance), I will definitely use FSD when I receive the V9 software upgrade. Unfortunately, at 75 I wonder when that will happen. I've volunteered to be a beta tester numerous times with no response from the early access folks. As a former test pilot in the military and for the airlines, one would think that Tesla would be interested in using my extensive experience. It has been over 1 1/2 years since I upgraded both vehicles to HW3 FSD. I hope that Tesla will upgrade one or both of my vehicles to the V9 software soon!

 

[techlogik]

People keep saying this, but most of the people that got the FSD beta, didn't even have Youtube accounts, or at least not active ones, when they got access. (Most of them were involved in their local Tesla Owner's club. And those people have direct access to Tesla management, so that makes sense.)

Because Tesla gave the employees it for free and they signed non disclosures. For the other 70 people that doesn’t leave much for us.

 

[OnTheSnap]

I really want to buy EAP for $5K or less. Not at all interested in $10K for EAP plus a FSD promise.
Sucks they took away buying EAP again. Hope they revisit it once FSD is shipping and the price goes beyond $10K.

 

[evdude69]

Personally I don't think its worth 10k. At least not yet