TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Unknowns

Discussion in 'Model S' started by goaliemanshark, Jun 10, 2012.

  1. goaliemanshark

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Messages:
    162
    #1 goaliemanshark, Jun 10, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
    I was just at the Menlo Park dealership and they had 4 S' there. Including beta 49, I spent A LOT of time with it. The car is really incredible, but it led me to ask the question, what is still unknown about the car? I figured we can make a list and cross things off when they are figured out!

    Unknowns:
    3G/4G connectivity: LTE? Carrier? Cost per month? Will their be hotspot functionality? It has a SIM, meaning most likely ATT or Tmobile
    Convenience lighting: Where is it? When does it turn on?
    Music control: Can you edit and add to your music library over wifi? What form of iPod/iPhone/MP3 player functionality will it have?
    Smartphone app: What will you be able to do? Map? Pre-condition? Cost? Live later this summer?
    Panoramic roof shade: What will it look like? What will it be made out of?
    Supercharger network: Cost? Locations? One hour charge for 85 ?
    Homelink: Where is it located? How many buttons?
    Wiper blades: Will there be a off function?
    Electrocromatic mirrors: Is the rear view mirror electrocromatic? Is that a standard feature?
    Keyless entry: Will it be available at launch?
    Speakers: How bad do the standard speakers sound?
    "Textile" seats: What will they be like? How adjustable?
    Badging: How will it be badged? P85? R60?
    Bluetooth: How will the phone contacts work? A2DP?
    Center console accessory: Availability? Cost? "Called the opportunity console" Prototypes available to see at the launch event.
    Service: How much will it cost? What will be covered? Battery degradation covered?
    Charging locations finder: Can you use the touchscreen to find a charging station- YES? Are they in use or not?
    Battery swapping: Can you rent a 85 kWh pack for a road trip?

    And the real big questions: What will the differences between signatures and regular production be? Headliner difference? Seat difference?
    Actual Performance: What will the ACTUAL numbers be? 0-60? Slalom? Skidpad? RANGE?


    Things I learned today:
    The screen and newest software is really, really, REALLY zippy. It was amazing how fast and responsive it was.
    Air suspension is really cool, noticeable and could actually be useful.
    The keyfob is awesome, and beautiful.
    The screen directly in front of the driver has three zones, the speedo and two zones on either side. Those zones are adjustable using the two scroll wheels on the steering wheel. The left scroll wheel controls volume and on/off. Or, you can map it onto the other side. The options were: Phone, Stats, Music, Nav, and a few others.
    Visibility isn't great on the car. The sun shades are also super small.

    I CAN'T WAIT!

    What else do we still need to find out?
     
  2. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2006
    Messages:
    17,249
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    How do you use the touch screen to find charging locations?
    What will it tell you about them?
    Can it tell you if you have the range to reach them? If they are in use?

    I suppose with Internet you could just run Plugshare or Recargo or somesuch, but I wonder if they will have their own app for this.
    Will those other charge finder apps start to show Tesla supercharge locations soon?
     
  3. Trnsl8r

    Trnsl8r Blue 85kwh since 12/8/12

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2011
    Messages:
    1,674
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    I think I can answer that based on the 4 Model S Santana Row event. They're really slick and therefore easy to miss. The interior lights are tiny buttons which are also the light itself. You press the light to turn it on. They're smaller than a quarter but bigger than a nickel I think. (Did that description make any sense?)
     
  4. Jason S

    Jason S Model S Sig Perf (P85)

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2012
    Messages:
    1,350
    Location:
    Rocklin, CA
    Can you rephrase that question? I don't understand. It has been said that the car will connect over wi-fi and I recall there are screens for configuring that connection.

    I've read that it won't be available at launch. Exact features therefore unknown as well.

    Yes, I believe that's on the specs page.

    I think there is video of #1 demo'ing the doors, but I thought I saw him pressing a button for override. It is available at launch.

    I think that's in the specs as well? Not sure.

    I can't think of any questions you missed. I'm interested in the skidpad and slalom numbers however.
     
  5. ddruz

    ddruz Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    673
    Location:
    North Shore Oahu, HI
    An extremely pertinent unknown is how to estimate battery degradation. There have been numbers mentioned in the forums such as at least 70% capacity remaining at 5 years or 8 years or 10 years and the example has been given of the Roadster owner who has driven 125,000 miles with 70% capacity remaining. But has anyone seen anything official yet from Tesla other than frequent charging in Range mode (100% max) results in faster battery degradation than charging in standard mode (80% max)?

    While in the Menlo Park store in late April I was told the battery warranty would definitely not cover capacity. Should this turn out to be correct it becomes even more critical to have guidelines for estimating battery degradation so people can intelligently determine which battery size to order. We should not be buying a battery size primarily considering its capacity out the door. Our primary consideration should be what our battery's residual capacity is reasonably expected to be at the end of the time we plan to own the car. There are many variables involved, which is why I was told Tesla will not be warrantying battery capacity, but Tesla could explain them all in a blog as they have done so beautifully with range estimates. IMO this remains the most pertinent unknown of all the unknowns because it bears directly on how to most appropriately configure the order for your car based on your driving requirements. Official guidelines from Tesla in making this estimation would be extremely helpful.
     
  6. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2006
    Messages:
    15,914
    Location:
    Stanford, California
    Are they offering a pay upfront battery replacement program like they did for the Roadster?
     
  7. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    11,923
    Pretty sure convenience lighting is outside. As others said, we know there will be hotspot functionality.
     
  8. J in MN

    J in MN S60 P12635

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    460
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Here are my questions:

    -Can the automatic wipers be disabled?
    -When will parking sensors and adaptive cruise control be available?
    -How about collision avoidance?
    -What charge schedule options are available? Is the a "complete by"?
    -What is the minimum service required to maintain warranty? What is the cost?
    -Will the service manual be for sale?
     
  9. daniel

    daniel Active Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2009
    Messages:
    1,131
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    In the Roadster, Homelink is in the VDS, so there are no physical buttons. It's programmable, and you can have up to 3 devices programmed in. The manual also says the third button on the key fob can be programmed to operate a device, but does not say whether that's in addition to the three, or whether that operates one of the three.

    So the S will certainly allow at least three devices, and probably will be operated by the touch screen.

    As for battery degradation over time, I'm sure the reason there's no clear statement from Tesla is that they just don't know. These kinds of battery packs are just too new to have any hard information other than a few anecdotal examples. But you definitely want to allow for some loss of range over time, and only charge to 80% except when you're going to need more.
     
  10. daniel

    daniel Active Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2009
    Messages:
    1,131
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    How about curb feelers? Does anybody remember curb feelers? My step-father's car in the 1950's had them. Simple, effective, low-tech solution. As a concession to the 21st century, they could be retractible.
     
  11. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2011
    Messages:
    13,257
    Location:
    Sarasota, FL
    There's a reversing camera. Why would you need parking sensors?

    I'd be willing to bet "No".
     
  12. goaliemanshark

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Messages:
    162
    Thanks everyone for your additions! I added most of them to the main list.

    The convenience lighting i'm talking about is on the outside, the interior lights are already known.
    There was some concern over the automatic keyless entry at launch.
    I don't see electrocromatic rear mirror in the specs page, but I did see AD2P, I updated the main page.
     
  13. J in MN

    J in MN S60 P12635

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    460
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Because there is no camera in the front bumper. Actually, a front camera would be better than parking sensors.
     
  14. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2011
    Messages:
    13,257
    Location:
    Sarasota, FL
    Never had a car with front parking sensors and never felt the need for them. (I'm sure someone will post up examples though). I'm generally looking forward when the car is moving that way.
     
  15. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    11,923
    Sometimes you can't exactly tell where the curb or concrete barrier is in relation to your lower bumper. When we go to NYC and park in garages that want you to pull all the way forward and make good use of the little space they have, it becomes pretty useful -- especially when the alternative is getting out to see how close you are.

    one could also say they are looking backward when the car is moving in that direction as well, but there's no doubt a backup camera is great for seeing what's on the ground behind you.
     
  16. AndyM

    AndyM Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2012
    Messages:
    661
    Location:
    Sherwood, OR, USA
    As for speakers, I think the low-end audio system is what we've seen in the Betas all along. In-store reps have told me the premium sound system hasn't been in any of them yet.

    I have an unknown, related to speakers: will the audio be speed-sensitive, allowing (customizable) increases in volume to compensate for wind/road noise at higher speeds?
     
  17. ljbad4life

    ljbad4life Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2009
    Messages:
    289
    Electrochromatic mirrors are listed underneath the tech package.
     
  18. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    11,923
    This is something I believe Mercedes vehicles do, so hopefully it, like the lane-change blinkers, will make it over as well.
     
  19. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2012
    Messages:
    4,279
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    My GTI does this. My favorite is the volume bump at ~93mph (150kmh, noticeable increase). I doubt that very many people know (or even have used) that tier. It also does it around ~38mph (60kmh, very subtle increase) and ~62mph (100kmh, noticeable increase). The deadband seems to be about 5 seconds and ~10kmh to move back down. It is instant increase.
     
  20. AndyM

    AndyM Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2012
    Messages:
    661
    Location:
    Sherwood, OR, USA
    This thread reminds me: we all have lists of "unknowns" that everyone asks to fill in the gaps from TM's web site.
    Is there a Model S FAQ sticky thread? or, a page to collect these questions and answers, frequently-asked or not, maybe not on TMC?
    If not, I volunteer to start one.
     

Share This Page