Virginia DMV Mileage Choice Program for Highway Use Fee

[X-Chris]

Recent email from Virginia DMV promoted the "Mileage Choice" program for EV Owners.

This lets you pay the annual highway use fee based on mileage instead of a flat rate.

If anyone is enrolled, please share your experience:

• How much are you saving?
• How onerous is the process?

They say you can save money if you drive less than 11,000 miles in a year.

But it looks like they require you install an OBD2 device and run a companion app. If memory serves, on the Model3/Y that port is actually behind plastic trim on the back of the center console. Seems like a hassle.

https://www.dmv.virginia.gov/general/#va_mileage_choice.asp

 

[MisterBeardy]

I got the same email this morning and I clicked over onto the main site and found this "Mileage Choice Program" Seems with Tesla's it will use telematics instead of the OBD connection. It also records all highway miles and not those just in Virginia.

 

[X-Chris]

That link is more helpful, thanks.


I plugged in the info for one of my Teslas, and the popup below indicates it is eligible for telematics, at a cost of 1.004 cents per mile.

 

[Tronguy]

In NJ, so not directly affected by the above. But I'm insanely curious.

I know, I know, gasoline/hydrocarbons are Evil and Wreck the Atmosphere. But the gas tax was remarkably even-handed. Drive a light, high-mileage vehicle that barely disturbs the road surface? Don't use much gas, don't pay much tax. Drive a heavy, blot-out-the-sky kind of vehicle whose mere mention makes asphalt quiver in fear? Lousy gas mileage, this vehicle makes for a lot of tax revenue.

Drive the car in another state? They collect the tax locally, since you're driving on their roads, and that makes sense. Corner cases of going back and forth the border are likely in the noise.

BEVs, at present, don't work well with that. Whatever their weight and affect upon the maintenance of the roads, the tax authorities seem to be somewhat arbitrary in how much they charge, whether it's even handed or not, and all the money seems to go into the state in which one has the car registered.

So, if Tesla is doing telemantics with VA.. maybe they're planning to expand it to other states?

 

[MisterBeardy]

The good thing is you won't be billed more then the max of $116.49 for going over the 11,600 mile average. I'll probably sign up and see how it goes.

 

[RTPEV]

In NJ, so not directly affected by the above. But I'm insanely curious.

I know, I know, gasoline/hydrocarbons are Evil and Wreck the Atmosphere. But the gas tax was remarkably even-handed. Drive a light, high-mileage vehicle that barely disturbs the road surface? Don't use much gas, don't pay much tax. Drive a heavy, blot-out-the-sky kind of vehicle whose mere mention makes asphalt quiver in fear? Lousy gas mileage, this vehicle makes for a lot of tax revenue.

Drive the car in another state? They collect the tax locally, since you're driving on their roads, and that makes sense. Corner cases of going back and forth the border are likely in the noise.

I think for many out of state trips it winds up being in the noise (not just back and forth border crossings). You're going to have some miles counted in your home state that you drove in other states (that won't be "paid" for your miles), but then those other states will have drivers driving on "your" roads for "free". I suspect by and large these things would tend to even themselves out, and are not representative of typical patterns anyway. Nonetheless, maybe there are some small states (DE, RI)? where most of the driving takes place in a larger adjacent state (MD, MA)...I suspect the costs could be absorbed somewhat by the larger populations of the larger state, but there could also be an agreement between those neighboring states as well based on statistics.

BEVs, at present, don't work well with that. Whatever their weight and affect upon the maintenance of the roads, the tax authorities seem to be somewhat arbitrary in how much they charge, whether it's even handed or not, and all the money seems to go into the state in which one has the car registered.

In NC, the DMV already collects odometer readings at annual inspections. I'm not sure exactly how they use this information, but one possible use is that as part of our annual registration fee, we pay a property tax based on the value of our vehicle, so perhaps they use it to determine that value. So here we have a state agency that is already capable of referencing a database of car values and charging a different fee (tax) based on that. So I don't see why, if they wanted to, they couldn't create a system where the fee was calculated based on a database of vehicle curb weights to provide a "road damage" factor. I'm not saying that I believe that should be done, just saying that if that was the will of the people, it's not technically unreasonable.

 

[Tronguy]

I think for many out of state trips it winds up being in the noise (not just back and forth border crossings). You're going to have some miles counted in your home state that you drove in other states (that won't be "paid" for your miles), but then those other states will have drivers driving on "your" roads for "free". I suspect by and large these things would tend to even themselves out, and are not representative of typical patterns anyway. Nonetheless, maybe there are some small states (DE, RI)? where most of the driving takes place in a larger adjacent state (MD, MA)...I suspect the costs could be absorbed somewhat by the larger populations of the larger state, but there could also be an agreement between those neighboring states as well based on statistics.


In NC, the DMV already collects odometer readings at annual inspections. I'm not sure exactly how they use this information, but one possible use is that as part of our annual registration fee, we pay a property tax based on the value of our vehicle, so perhaps they use it to determine that value. So here we have a state agency that is already capable of referencing a database of car values and charging a different fee (tax) based on that. So I don't see why, if they wanted to, they couldn't create a system where the fee was calculated based on a database of vehicle curb weights to provide a "road damage" factor. I'm not saying that I believe that should be done, just saying that if that was the will of the people, it's not technically unreasonable.

No argument there. And, for what it's worth, in NJ, the more one's vehicle weighs, the more one pays in registration fees. Since I renewed the registration recently, I had a look at these numbers: It's not two-to-one for a light vehicle vs. a heavy one, which would make sense from a road damage point of view, but it does go up and down some five or ten bucks around $70 or so. I'm not sure what trucks pay, but trucks always seem to pay more.

I think it was in Ohio where a bunch of vaguely sane state legislators got together with the DMV and actually worked out what rough parity should be for BEVs vs. ICEs; but I don't think they took into account mileage driven. I like the NC approach of at least getting the distance driven in there.

When I was much younger and poorer and in college, I used to drive coast to coast for summer jobs or, earlier than that, long distances from various military postings to home when on leave and such. A significant percentage of my annual car mileage during those years was on those trips. And, thinking about it, I would guess that a significant percentage of the people traveling on interstates are long distance drivers going from point A to B. The federal gas tax ($0.184/gallon?) pays for the repairs on those interstate roads; the state and local gas taxes pay for the maintenance on everything else.

I mean: Probably, Tesla (and very likely other BEV types) have location data sufficient so that a taxing authority could use that info to tax travel. In a nice world, this would be done in a fair fashion, taking into account what roads were traveled, and resulting in the roads being properly maintained. In an evil world, this would be used by cops without warrants left, right, and center in trolling expeditions everywhere, getting rid of the anonymity of travel and making this place like some 3rd world autocratic country.

Maybe the best we can hope for is something like a merger between NC and OH.. but somehow, we have to keep the interstates up and running, too.

 

[RTPEV]

Let me clarify that NC does not currently have a mileage based EV tax/fee system. It's currently a flat $130 registration add-on fee for EVs. I was just pointing out that the state does already collect odometer readings for some reason.

There is a mileage-based pilot program going on at the moment (in conjunction with other eastern states), but it's only being used to test the concept: it's not being used to actually calculate taxes.

 

[X-Chris]

Regarding the Virginia program, another note:

When you attempt to activate the program using telematics, you are forwarded to the domain "smartcar.com" which requests your Tesla login information.

Because of this, I bailed. In all likelihood this is legit, but I am not comfortable turning over my Tesla credentials to a 3rd party just to save a few bucks.

 

[carbdriver]

@X-Chris emovis won the VA contract for this - started in July 2022. Award press release . If you read the press release they say “Personal information and travel habits are always kept private” which to me sounds like they get it, store it but may not currently send it along to DMV (until a misconfig and whoops). Your spidey senses are right, I wouldn’t give them api access to all of my car’s data and personal info regardless if they’re only sending a subset to DMV. They still appear to be getting all other info, until they confirm otherwise.

 

[JBare]

Great info on this thread, thanks for doing the legwork and posting here! I was about to start the sign up process as my renewal is coming up but no chance I'm giving my vehicle login info to any site.

 

[GeoMetry]

I live in Virginia and I need to renew my registration soon, so I am looking into this. I have questions and wonder if anyone has tried this. The web site says: "

Your Vehicle Has Built-in Capabilities​

Your vehicle has embedded Telematics, which can record and transmit your mileage. If you would like to use this function for Virginia's Mileage Choice Program, click USE TELEMATICS to authorize a direct connection. Note: This may require a subscription."

What might I need to subscribe to and how much does that cost? How do I determine if I need to subscribe? If I decide that I would like to use this function it says to click on the USE TELEMATICS button what if I don't like to use that function is there another option?

Then there is an option to "Enable GPS Location Data" It says that allows additional features described as "Find my car" and "Trip advisor" but I don't see any explanation of those features. Can anyone here explain what those features are and why I might want those features?

 

[Tronguy]

I live in Virginia and I need to renew my registration soon, so I am looking into this. I have questions and wonder if anyone has tried this. The web site says: "

Your Vehicle Has Built-in Capabilities​

Your vehicle has embedded Telematics, which can record and transmit your mileage. If you would like to use this function for Virginia's Mileage Choice Program, click USE TELEMATICS to authorize a direct connection. Note: This may require a subscription."

What might I need to subscribe to and how much does that cost? How do I determine if I need to subscribe? If I decide that I would like to use this function it says to click on the USE TELEMATICS button what if I don't like to use that function is there another option?

Then there is an option to "Enable GPS Location Data" It says that allows additional features described as "Find my car" and "Trip advisor" but I don't see any explanation of those features. Can anyone here explain what those features are and why I might want those features?

Um. Over here in New Jersey, there was a small news article/advertisement from the state DMV, looking for volunteers for a pilot program to determine how/if/whatever a system that recorded miles driven, with the idea that one would pay Road Tax on those miles.

Being the volunteering maniac that I am, I went to the mentioned web site and signed up. It's pretty clear that if roads depend only upon gasoline/diesel taxes in order to be maintained, a distinct lack of vehicles burning those fuels will end up with no road maintenance, which won't fly.

In this pilot no actual money changed hands. Name of the pilot was the "TEC MBUF Pilot", run by a company named Azunga. A typical email had the following statement in it:

Thank you for participating in the TETC MBUF Pilot and helping us bring the East Coast voice to a national discussion on how to potentially pay for roads in the future! ​

The Eastern Transportation Coalition is a partnership of 18 states and Washington DC focused on connecting for solutions to support the economic engine of the US. The Eastern Transportation Coalition is neutral regarding if a mileage-based user fee(MBUF) as the ultimate solution to establishing a sustainable and equitable transportation funding approach.
*Please note that all charges reflected on this statement are simulated. No money will be exchanged.

As part of the trial, depending upon the car, one would either get a little gps/tracker that would record one's movements. The Model 3 and Y in the household, being Teslas, could be connected to the proposed system's back end and mileage numbers recorded that way. Which we set up and used for the trial. It all ran from July through November or so.

Notable items:

• Costs per mile were based upon weight of the vehicle. I guess heavier vehicles tear up the road surface more, so that makes some kind of sense.
• Different states charged different amounts. The states ran from Maine down to Florida and wrapped around to Alabama, I think.

As one can see, the highest simulated cost per mile was in Pennsylvania at $0.0255/mile; the numbers seem to track with the gas tax.

In the scheme I was signed into, it was straight mileage being automatically reported back to the Mothership. Which could get weird: Take a coast-to-coast trip, and one will be paying New Jersey (in my case) for all that travel between NJ and CA and back. There were some hints that there would be other schemes that involved location, so, presumably, going up and down ye East Coast would involve various states being paid for the travel in those states.

This crowd swore up and down that when the study was over they'd delete user individual user data, remove the telemantics link to Tesla for retrieving user data, and all that jazz. Near as I can tell they seem to have done that. They also swore that No Data Would Be Sold; it was all about how well the system worked, with a report going to this East Coast Transportation Coalition.

The concern, in my mind, is privacy and security. I figure that once a system like this gets going, there's going to be an irresistible desire on the part of law enforcement to Get At That Data, then start tracking everybody, everywhere, at all times. So, if you're going to sign up for something like this, look carefully at the safeguards to see who has access. (I have this horror in the back of my head of a car going 70 in a 65 zone, keeping up with traffic, and the driver getting a speeding ticket later in the mail. Whee.)

 

[GNFO]

Great info on this thread, thanks for doing the legwork and posting here! I was about to start the sign up process as my renewal is coming up but no chance I'm giving my vehicle login info to any site.

Just to see what they would say, I asked the VA DMV why they couldn't use the mileage that had to be read off every year for the annual safety inspection. They actually did respond quickly, but as expected it was not helpful. Like any good bureaucracy, the questionable value safety inspection is run by the Virginia State Police, whose systems don't touch DMV, who collects the road usage tax. She also said the way the Mileage Choice Program was essentially forced on them and recommended contacting our representatives. Not sure how true that is, but wouldn't surprise me that some politician decided that the best option was to dictate paying a contractor a bunch of money to run a convoluted hardware/software solution instead of just some better coordination between two state organizations. She was also not aware of the security risk involved in handing over login information to a Tesla account. They can talk about privacy safeguards all they want, but it's not like hacking or insider threats have ever happened, right?

 

[Tronguy]

Just to see what they would say, I asked the VA DMV why they couldn't use the mileage that had to be read off every year for the annual safety inspection. They actually did respond quickly, but as expected it was not helpful. Like any good bureaucracy, the questionable value safety inspection is run by the Virginia State Police, whose systems don't touch DMV, who collects the road usage tax. She also said the way the Mileage Choice Program was essentially forced on them and recommended contacting our representatives. Not sure how true that is, but wouldn't surprise me that some politician decided that the best option was to dictate paying a contractor a bunch of money to run a convoluted hardware/software solution instead of just some better coordination between two state organizations. She was also not aware of the security risk involved in handing over login information to a Tesla account. They can talk about privacy safeguards all they want, but it's not like hacking or insider threats have ever happened, right?

As I've said earlier in this thread, privacy is a very, very important thing when it comes to tracking people's cars over the landscape. Have you tried to track down privacy protections?

I went looking. I'm not a VA resident. I found this, in a non-legalese section on the Mileage Choice program for Virginia:

---------
The information you submit to participate in the Mileage Choice Program is confidential and may not be released to the public. Any information collected while you participate in the program, including location data (if you choose a GPS-enabled device) is also protected and may not be disclosed to any entity other than one involved in running the program.
--------------

Yeah. And no further information. How do they stop a cop with a warrant? Or an NSA/CIA/FBI type with some kind of super-sekret, FSA-approved-with-no-appeal blanket warrant? All it takes is some idiot reciting, "Think of the Children!" and "National Security!" and one can kiss one's privacy goodbye, in perpetuity.

 

[RTPEV]

I live in Virginia and I need to renew my registration soon, so I am looking into this. I have questions and wonder if anyone has tried this. The web site says: "

Your Vehicle Has Built-in Capabilities​

Your vehicle has embedded Telematics, which can record and transmit your mileage. If you would like to use this function for Virginia's Mileage Choice Program, click USE TELEMATICS to authorize a direct connection. Note: This may require a subscription."

What might I need to subscribe to and how much does that cost? How do I determine if I need to subscribe? If I decide that I would like to use this function it says to click on the USE TELEMATICS button what if I don't like to use that function is there another option?

This is referring to any subscription you may need for your car to use telematics. If you are in a Tesla, there is no subscription required. Your car has telematics support for the lifetime of your car with no additional fees.

That's not the case with other manufacturers. Usually they have an introductory plan of 3-5 years where you can use your car's telematics, and then you have to pay for it to use it after that. With the Chevy Bolt for example, you have to pay for OnStar to get your car's telematics to work. That's the subscription they are talking about.