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Volkswagen Gigafactory
- Thread starter Mookuh
- Start date
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Investment wise I'd say regardless of however many 10's of billions that are "rumored to be invested" that the actual however many hundred millions dollars Tesla have already invested.
The big question I have is whether the count of EVs they gave is battery only electric or are they counting all EVs including PHEVs.
The english version of the slides published by VW itself states it pretty clearly as "Fully Electric", ie. BEV, not all electrified vehicles.
Do you have any source for global battery production. Have been looking for one and not really found anything.
Seems fine.
streamers is not a good translation though. In German electricity is called Strom and Stromer is basically created out of that word which basically just means electric car.
Yeah.. Ok, that's 30 new BEVs by 2025, but the next line says 2-3 million e-cars, not BEVs. That 3rd bullet point includes all EVs, including PHEVs. Otherwise, they would use the same language... Pure-electric is used on the 2nd line, e-cars on the 3rd.
adiggs
Well-Known Member
Reading comprehension for the win! Thank you @techmaven - those bullets were artfully arranged and conveyed to me, the idea that VW is thinking 2-3M BEVs per year in 2025.
My flickering respect for VW and the possibility of a real competitor in the decade timeframe has gone down :|
adiggs
Well-Known Member
Of course, any appropriately skeptical person would understand that bullet points 2 and 3 are independent thoughts. Only a fanboy would assume that the total volume of #3 would be derived from only the BEVs in #2. The use of the non-specific term "e-car" is clearly code for "electrified vehicle" which is a favorite of other automakers like Ford who use it for standard hybrid, plug-in hybrid and battery electric vehicles.
Having 30 distinct pure electric models across the VW Group by 2025 is still impressive.
My .02 -- it honestly doesn't matter what language the slide uses. Ultimately, their EV/PH-EV breakout will be determined by sales.
And, if you believe the pace of battery improvements will continue at 5-10% per year, then by 2025 BEVs will be cheaper at all price points than ICE vehicles. When that happens, there will be no point in buying a less-reliable, more complex ICE vehicle, nor will there be any reasonable point in strapping an engine next to a battery.
Since when can weathermen predict the weather, let alone the future?
And, if you believe the pace of battery improvements will continue at 5-10% per year, then by 2025 BEVs will be cheaper at all price points than ICE vehicles. When that happens, there will be no point in buying a less-reliable, more complex ICE vehicle, nor will there be any reasonable point in strapping an engine next to a battery.
Since when can weathermen predict the weather, let alone the future?
I agree. Sales will determine the breakout.
Here's some calculation. 150GWh / 2million cars = 75kWh per car, 3 million cars = 50kWh per car. Based on this calc VW seems to consider very high rate of BEVs among 2M-3M e-cars they produce.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Likely around $0 since they didn't expect to get caught. But not to worry, the pound has gotten very cheap (the original post said they're supposed to invest £8 billion). Now if only pigs could fly...
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Did I hear it right, recently, that VW don't intend to pay any compensation to European Customers?
Opportunity for a Windfall post-BRExit perhaps? ...
Yes. The settlement was with US courts so applies US only. There still is litigation in various other places; one question is whether a, say, German solution would apply to the UK also, or be limited to a given country.
In 2018 or even 2020, 50 kWh might be considered significant. However, by 2025? I think the low end is 75 kWh by that point, and the high end is well over 100 kWh. Considering they have Audi and Porsche in their production mix and they likely lead the transition from the high end and trickle down to the low end, I would say an average of 90 kWh in 2025 is more reasonable.
In any case, @Alketi is right, consumer behavior will drive the market. In any case, 150 GWh by 2025 is not particularly a high number for the world's largest car maker by volume.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
I thought, but may have my facts wrong, that VW had announced that there would be no compensation to European customers?
You are right
VW emissions scandal: VW Group agrees to $15bn settlement with US owners
In the second part of this article it's discussed.
This is one of the reasons why I will never own a Volkswagen in my life, and I will try to prevent anyone I can from buying one.
I will also never work for that company.
(Semi-related note: I'm starting my first job at a company that develops infrastructure for EVs in cities tomorrow. I am overjoyed and just had to get it out.)
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