Wall Connector install - Planning ahead

[TheLocNar]

3rd estimate today. No sub panel with a disconnect. All 3 prices have been about the same. This guy said "guarantee to not exceed $1500. Looks like a $1k-1200 job. Permit is up to you." 60A breaker and 6AWG/conduit.

Looks like I'll be going with the 2nd estimate as I'd be getting more for the $.

Now, how to break it gently to the other 2 estimates, as they were all really cool people. lol

 

[davewill]

3rd estimate today. No sub panel with a disconnect. All 3 prices have been about the same. This guy said "guarantee to not exceed $1500. Looks like a $1k-1200 job. Permit is up to you." 60A breaker and 6AWG/conduit.

Looks like I'll be going with the 2nd estimate as I'd be getting more for the $.

Now, how to break it gently to the other 2 estimates, as they were all really cool people. lol

"Permit is up to you" is the sign of a hack, not a cool people.

 

[TheLocNar]

"Permit is up to you" is the sign of a hack, not a cool people.

Bingo.

 

[Rocky_H]

Wow, I'm noticing an ongoing war on this forum between the two parties of:
(1) Permitting is useless and just a greedy gouging thing cities do only for the purpose of ripping you off, so you don't need it.
versus
(2) Anyone who says a permit isn't needed is an unskilled, unqualified hack, who is dangerous and needs to be kicked out of your house

 

[eprosenx]

Wow, I'm noticing an ongoing war on this forum between the two parties of:
(1) Permitting is useless and just a greedy gouging thing cities do only for the purpose of ripping you off, so you don't need it.
versus
(2) Anyone who says a permit isn't needed is an unskilled, unqualified hack, who is dangerous and needs to be kicked out of your house

I see both sides of it. As always, the truth is probably somewhere in between.

I permitted my work and I was WOEFULLY underwhelmed by the inspection. Granted I had done nice conduit bending work, but he did not want to even wait the two minutes for me to take the panel cover off for him to at least look at the wiring (I offered multiple times). I installed a Wall Connector, a 14-50, and a full generator transfer panel on like eight circuits including an inlet receptacle from the outside. Total time the inspector was here was like five minutes...

Now, with that being said, if my wiring looked totally horrible and I had no clue what I was talking about when answering questions I would like to think that the inspector would have dug deeper.

So yeah, I guess I am glad we have codes and inspections, but clearly they are kind of hit or miss. Some jurisdictions I am sure do treat it as just a revenue source.

 

[NickFie]

Wow, I'm noticing an ongoing war on this forum between the two parties of:
(1) Permitting is useless and just a greedy gouging thing cities do only for the purpose of ripping you off, so you don't need it.
versus
(2) Anyone who says a permit isn't needed is an unskilled, unqualified hack, who is dangerous and needs to be kicked out of your house

The right answer about permits may vary by geography. The Township where I live is very strict on permits. The inspector seems to know what's going on. With an undergraduate Engineering degree, I understand fundamentals of electricity. Can do simple outlets and switches myself. Still want the skill of a good electrician and an inspector's eye for second opinion.

Enforcement people sometimes cruise through neighborhoods, looking for work in progress. If there's no permit on file, trouble ensues. One neighbor had to pull down a just-built garden shed. It wasn't permitted and did not follow setback rules. Our daughter and her husband decided to have a no-permit contractor do major renovation for a lower price. We warned them it was unlikely to succeed. Turns out a Township employee lives a block or two away, they were called on it. Delay to get the drawings, apply for permit, then wait for approval.

If a prospective home buyer discovers work done without a permit, there can be problems. Suggests work may be substandard, that the seller may have cut other corners and that the seller may be dodgy during the home sale. There may be a delay while the deficiency is corrected, or an allowance at settlement.

A good friend in another state has a different environment. His town has a skilled blue-collar history. Code enforcement recognizes that homeowners can do a good job on their own, there's much more latitude.

 

[NickFie]

Having a 100 Amp circuit to feed one or two HPWCs is not necessary for most people. However, it can be "nice to have" now and then for quick charging from a daily 70-80% to 90-100% just prior to a long trip. So, if 100 Amp is not much more expensive than 40-60 Amps for your home, then I would go for it.

Amen! If you can afford 100-Amp capacity, it will make things easier.

Just needed to charge at full 72 Amps this morning. My wife drives the S100D, I'm the tech wrangler and long-haul driver. Hadn't charged the car in a few days since she doesn't drive that far. Also hadn't checked charge level in Tesla App or Teslafi. This morning she came back from coffee with friends, asked me to plug in the HPWC. She told me battery was barely above 20% (her range anxiety threshold), and that she was driving to lunch with a friend on the other side of the city.

Plugged in HPWC, went into car. Told it to start charging, then dialed charge rate up to the car's 72-Amp Max. In just under two hours, the battery went from 23% to 51%. My wife unplugged the charge cable and drove off without any concern. Met my objectives - the S100D remains wonderful, worry-free magic carpet for my wife. A great car to drive and tech toy for me.

I could have tracked charge level more closely, and/or charged the car more consistently and we could have lived with 40-Amp capacity - normal charge setting - and 1:00 AM charge start. The fact is, I prefer possessions that work for me, not those that demand I work for them. And we're willing to pay a bit extra to set that up.

 

[Runt8]

Wow, I'm noticing an ongoing war on this forum between the two parties of:
(1) Permitting is useless and just a greedy gouging thing cities do only for the purpose of ripping you off, so you don't need it.
versus
(2) Anyone who says a permit isn't needed is an unskilled, unqualified hack, who is dangerous and needs to be kicked out of your house

I view the permitting process as important for two reasons:

1. A second set of eyes never hurts, although the quality of inspections varies greatly.
2. Having a permit on file for new work protects me from greedy insurance companies looking for any reason to deny a claim. If my house burns down and the inspector finds wiring for a car charger without a permit, my insurance claim could be denied even if the cause of the fire was completely unrelated.

So even if a permit and inspection don't make the install any safer (and that certainly can be the case if the inspector is garbage) the potential downside for skipping it outweighs the cost of doing it.

 

[PJFW8]

I view the permitting process as important for two reasons:

1. A second set of eyes never hurts, although the quality of inspections varies greatly.
2. Having a permit on file for new work protects me from greedy insurance companies looking for any reason to deny a claim. If my house burns down and the inspector finds wiring for a car charger without a permit, my insurance claim could be denied even if the cause of the fire was completely unrelated.

So even if a permit and inspection don't make the install any safer (and that certainly can be the case if the inspector is garbage) the potential downside for skipping it outweighs the cost of doing it.

When you sell a property there is an implied representation that all work had the necessary permits. Some states and lenders require a written representation. Since I was the prosecutor for zoning and building code violations for 25 years, local contractors always called the local authorities to see if I had a permit whenever I did a project. Permits are often a pain to get, but you take a real risk if you ignore the rules.

 

[1deepthink]

My Wall Charger will be connected to a 100 amp circuit. Understanding that the Model 3 maxes out at 48 amps, do I need to tell my electrician to dial down the Wall Charger or does that happen on the car side?

 

[eprosenx]

My Wall Charger will be connected to a 100 amp circuit. Understanding that the Model 3 maxes out at 48 amps, do I need to tell my electrician to dial down the Wall Charger or does that happen on the car side?

So any EVSE (of which the wall connector is one) sends a signal to the vehicle to let it know what the max number of amps that are allowed to be drawn (as to not blow a breaker or create a hazard). If the EVSE sends a signal indicating more amps are available than the car can make use of, the car simply just does not use all the available amps. It charges at whatever it’s max rate is (or whatever max rate the user artificially chooses that is less than the max capability of the car)

So that is a long winded way to say: Don’t have your electrician dial it down. It will be fine.

 

[1deepthink]

So any EVSE (of which the wall connector is one) sends a signal to the vehicle to let it know what the max number of amps that are allowed to be drawn (as to not blow a breaker or create a hazard). If the EVSE sends a signal indicating more amps are available than the car can make use of, the car simply just does not use all the available amps. It charges at whatever it’s max rate is (or whatever max rate the user artificially chooses that is less than the max capability of the car)

So that is a long winded way to say: Don’t have your electrician dial it down. It will be fine.

Perfect informed answer. Thank YOU and thank you to the forum!

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

Following up.

Installed my wall connector on a 100a circuit last weekend. Not terribly difficult and overkill for sure, but ready for another Tesla when my wallet is!

Thanks to everyone in this thread for their guidance.

 

[P85_DA]

Following up.

Installed my wall connector on a 100a circuit last weekend. Not terribly difficult and overkill for sure, but ready for another Tesla when my wallet is!

Thanks to everyone in this thread for their guidance.


View attachment 332304

Gigablast service is great !!!

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

Gigablast service is great !!!

Indeed. Everything else feels so slow lol.

 

[1deepthink]

Perfect informed answer. Thank YOU and thank you to the forum!

Ready here as well!