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Wall Connector vs. Extra Mobile Connector Cable?

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by mknox, Sep 1, 2012.

  1. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    The most power I'm going to get to my garage is 50 amps, and I was planning to simply install a NEMA 14-50 outlet for the Mobile Connector to plug in to.

    The Wall Connector would work at 50 amps, but is $1,300 in Canada.

    I would like to keep the Mobile Connector in the car for charging on the road, and simply get another cable to leave in the garage, but if an extra cable and the appropriate 14-50 adapter is close in cost to the slick Wall Connector, I might go that route.

    Anyone know what spare Mobile Connector cables and outlet adapters are going for?

    Mike
     
  2. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    We've heard US$500 for the Model S.
     
  3. Trnsl8r

    Trnsl8r Blue 85kwh since 12/8/12

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    I have the same philosophy. In fact, I'm going to ask the electrician for a quote of installing two 14-50 outlets, just in case there will be a second EV in our future. If the additional cost is negligible (or close to it), then I'll double down.

    Getting an extra mobile connector would be convenient. I'm curious what the price is as well. $500 is interesting... we'll see how inconvenient it is to unplug in the morning and simply throw the cord in the car...
     
  4. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    I know this has been discussed to death but I forget the answer...
    Don't you need twice the power available to make that worthwhile? Or is the idea to dial back both vehicles so that they are using half rate on a typical day?
     
  5. wycolo

    wycolo Active Member

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    > a quote of installing two 14-50 outlets [Trnsl8r]

    This is now getting serious since likely both cars would be charging concurrently. Best if the house service panel is already 200 Amps or larger. Then a 125 Amp sub box could serve the garage with separate 50 amp breakers for each 14-50 outlet. Ideal if sub box is within 50 ft +/- of service panel. And go serious on the copper wire guage. Code allows wires to get *hot* but you do not want this, hour after hour! Get at least one size larger than code requires.
    --
     
  6. teslasguy

    teslasguy MSP P#1117

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    I'm installing 100amp copper line to garage where I'm installing 100amp subpanel. Then 2 50amp nema 14-50 50 amp outlets about 25 feet away from subpanel in garage (closer to back of cars). $1060.
    Pretty sure I got a quote of $500 from Tesla for 2nd UMC.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  7. MikeK

    MikeK R#129, TSLA shareholder

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    I plan to keep the mobile connector in the car, and once the $500 pricing was announced for a second mobile connector, I went ahead and ordered the HPWC because it's more attractive and provides a better way to store the cable. Yeah, it was $700 more, but as a long-time EV owner, I value a tidy, permanent installation.
     
  8. mitch672

    mitch672 Active Member

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    #8 mitch672, Sep 1, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2012
    I'm building a 75A J-1772 OpenEVSE, this way it will be able to charge any vehicle, my total cost will be about $550.00-$600.00, so the price of the portable UMC cable, with the capabilities of the WHPC.

    (just bought and received the 75A ITT J-1772 connector/cable on eBay for $250, the 75A contactor I have found a source for $120, those 2 parts are the bulk of the total build cost), the case is also a little pricey too (~80)

    I also installed (2) 14-50Rs off the garages 125A subpanel. Both 14-50s and the 75A J-1772 can be used at once, because OpenEVSE is now adjustable for the current setting via a 1-button menu system, so the current availble can be dialed down to whatever you want, from say 12A to the full 75A... Once the "sweet spot" for charging is discovered. you can also adjust it in the car (for a lower number than the EVSE advertises), but this is just one more way to adjust it, and even allow both 14-50s and the J-1772 to all be used at once (as long as you stay below 125A max total). The 75A J-1772 probably won't be used at full power capability most of the time, it's just nice to be able to "dial in" whatever is need up to 75A, if a visiting Model S/X happens to need a charge, for example. The 14-50s are backups, and for a 2nd EV in the future.

    Here is an example of a 75A OpenEVSE: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/wiki/EVSE_Example75A

    Here is the OpenEVSE homepage, you can see some of the menus: http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/

    Enclosure I am think of using: NBE-10563 Bud Industries | 377-1146-ND | DigiKey
    Has a clear cover, and an "inner mounting panel" (to mount the LCD display to, as well as the "select" switch to adjust the menus), it also has a bottom interior mounting plate availble, so you don't need to punch extra holes in it, and it can stay waterproof.

    Enclosure mfr: NEMA Boxes - UL/NEMA/IEC NBE Series | BudInd

    PDF of enclosure: http://www.budind.com/pdf/hb10543.pdf

    75A contactor: SuperBreakers.netSquare D

    Mitch
     
  9. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    I'm thinking of going the same route - extra UMC so I can leave one in the garage but have a second in the frunk. I doubt i'd use more than 40A for daily charging.

    I might also adapt my Roadster HPC to J1772 so I can charge faster if the need ever arises.
     
  10. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Yes, there are electrical code issues to consider. You can't just keep adding loads to your panel or you will overload the main fuse/breaker and possibly the capacity of the panel itself.

    I have a 100 amp main service, and it would cost me considerably to upgrade. My underground utility lines would need to be upgraded and possibly the distribution transformer. I would have to pay the utility a "capital contribution" for this work on top of my own electrician's fees.

    I am changing my electric range (currently 40amp) and electric dryer (currently 30 amp) to gas in order to free up enough capacity for a 50amp outlet in the garage.
     
  11. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    FWIW, my electrician wasn't concerned about the 30A dryer + 50A range. He figures (correctly) that I can manage these appliances around charging.
     
  12. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Yes it is simple to manage. Set up your car to delay charging to 2 AM. You aren't going to be roasting a turkey at that hour. (Yes the Roadster can do this, so I assume the Model S will too.)
     
  13. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    How do you roast a turkey in the Roadster? I can see where the Model S has space for the oven in the back of the frunk.
     
  14. RDoc

    RDoc S85D

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  15. Trnsl8r

    Trnsl8r Blue 85kwh since 12/8/12

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  16. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

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    Just to be clear, when you say the most you are going to get is 50 amps, do you mean that's what the line is rated for? Because, at least in the US, the most your supposed to pull continuous on a 50 amp rated line is 40 amps. So even with the HPWC, you'd have to have it set for 40 amps.
     
  17. Jeeps17

    Jeeps17 Cath Jockey in a P85

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    LOL...

    Retrieving edible food can be problematic though!
     
  18. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    It depends on what size your main service is and what else you have connected. While I agree you can manage your load by (for example) not running the dryer when the car is charging, there are code requirements about how many circuits and how much load can be added to an existing main service.

    In my case (with a 100 amp main breaker) a 30 amp dryer, 50 amp stove and a 50 amp circuit for EV charging is just too much given everything else I have on my panel (I also have a 30 amp electric water heater and hot tub).

    If you've had a licensed electrician look at it, then you should be good to go. Those guys know the codes and wouldn't recommend something that isn't safe.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Yes, that is the same in Canada. The NEMA 14-50 outlet is fed using #6 wire from a 50 amp breaker, but is rated for 40 amps continuous.
     
  19. spatterso911

    spatterso911 MSP#7577 **--** MX#1891

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    Nahh! It'll just have that nasty burnt fuel flavor. We are all trying to get away from that! :tongue:
     
  20. neroden

    neroden Happy Model S Owner

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    There's another reason to get a second Mobile Connector.

    The Mobile Connector is basically your only option for charging at RV campgrounds, emergency charging at 110V sockets, etc. If it gets damaged or stolen -- for instance, while charging somewhere -- you may suddenly be *incapable* of taking a road trip. (Unless you're depending on J1772s.) Until you order a new one. This could throw a serious wrench in plans. Accordingly, I have planned to have a spare Mobile Connector from day one, just as I've planned to have a spare tire.

    If I've already got two Mobile Connectors and am not putting in a circuit larger than 50 amps into my house, then there is really no reason to get the Wall Connector.
     

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