Wall of 10 Tesla Powerwall 2 units

[Zorg]

I wish I had in floor radiant heat so I could use my slab as a thermal battery and only heat it when the my solar was producing. Solar is cheap, and more versatile then solar (not PV) loop, well if you had a pool to heat in the summer maybe another story.

Some places put a thick polystyrene below the slab and run a loop in ground to heat/cool the slab. Sounds pretty neat.

 

[Patrick66]

Very cool setup. One thing I was curious about is why the SunBandit water heaters and not a heat pump? Environment aside, I would assume that exercising your generator on the low production days would be more cost effective, but I get having redundancy. How often do you run the generator?

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

@Jason Bloomberg: may I ask a few novice questions (awesome setup by the way)?

1. Can you provide the dimensions as depicted:

View attachment 628379

2. Can these batteries actually be installed out doors in a climate where winter temps descend below -25C?

3. If these batteries are installed outdoors, is there some sort of software "anti theft" protocols built in (such as operation tied to a specific GPS location for example)?

My third question is simply a concern I would have that these items could be a portable commodity if there are no built in safeties preventing unauthorized removal. Cheers. Thanks.

@Jason Bloomberg: may I ask a few novice questions (awesome setup by the way)?

Re: Q1 189" wide by 48" tall by 14" deep. The width includes the space between each pair and a little extra space so an existing wall outlet could continue to be used if desired.

Q2 you will need to contact Tesla about that or check the specifications sheet on their website. We installed them in our garage rather than outside so less energy would be required for the thermal management of the system compared to an outside installation in our climate.

Q3 I have no idea, you will need to contact Tesla about that. I do know that each Powerwall 2 and the Gateway has its own serial number which registers with Tesla both at time of purchase and installation, which Tesla can identify, so if anyone stole one, is can't be activated and used because it would show up as being registered to the legal owner (same principle as trying so Supercharge as stolen Tesla vehicle which has been reported as stolen). Also, keep in mind, each Powerwall 2 unit weighs about 250 pounds. The process of disconnecting and removing any of them is not something which can be done quickly.

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

Very cool setup. One thing I was curious about is why the SunBandit water heaters and not a heat pump? Environment aside, I would assume that exercising your generator on the low production days would be more cost effective, but I get having redundancy. How often do you run the generator?

Our home was built in 1988 "ranch style" (spread out on a slab foundation). It was also built in sections over time and had two water heaters. One for the east side of the house (two bedrooms, one bath, kitchen, and laundry) and one for the master bathroom on the west side of the house. It was constructed by the original owners who did many non-code things we have since corrected. And, while we admire their use of recycled materials, it resulted in some things being cobbled together rather than properly fitted. The building started out as a pole barn that was a machine shop, which eventually was converted into a home. We bought the home in 2001. In 2014 we replaced the propane furnace with a Series 7 Waterfurnace that when heating the hope will pre-heat domestic hot water which feeds the two water heaters. We hybridized that system with the Sun Bandit direct electric PV to supplement the preheating from the Waterfurnace with solar. It uses a 105 gallon Marathon water heater essentially as a storage tank for the Waterfurnace. It was never connected to household electricity, so we have the Sun Bandit system connected to it. This means less power is used by the Waterfurnace to preheat the water in winter, and also water now gets preheated in the summer even when the Waterfurnace is not heating the house. Water from this preheating system still goes to two other water heaters to deliver hot water closer to point of use, but this preheating substantially reduces how much heat needs to be added to the water at those locations.

The east side of the house has a 50 gallon Marathon water heater where the bottom element is powered by a separate set of panels and Sun Bandit system, and the top element runs on household current.

The west side of the house has a 50 gallon G.E. Geospring air to water heat pump water heater, which we run in pure heat pump mode. It has elements so can be operated as a hybrid, but we don't ever use them.

The Marathon Geospring water heaters were installed in 2014 at the same time as the Waterfurnce. They substantially reduced our electric bills, so our overall use of electricity for water heating decreased, but this was before we installed SENSE in 2019, so I can't quantify it.

I can compare 2019 to 2020, which respectively before and after installing the Sun Bandit systems to our existing systems. We used 3,000 fewer kWh in 2020 to heat hot water compared to 2019.

 

[navguy12]

Thanks!

 

[IsthataTesl.a?]

Darn. I wonder if I could have ordered them in red straight away.

Also, is there a Taycan in your future. My neighbor has a Taycan Turbo S and it is a beautiful car.

My friend that got me interested in Tesla and EVs in general may add one one day. I'm still not sure I forgive VW/VAG for all of the lies and deception. But then again, they're selling a Turbo EV so there's that.

 

[h2ofun]

My friend that got me interested in Tesla and EVs in general may add one one day. I'm still not sure I forgive VW/VAG for all of the lies and deception. But then again, they're selling a Turbo EV so there's that.

Do not ask them about their range projections

 

[jboy210]

Do not ask them about their range projections

He is well aware of the range limitation. This is a toy he gave himself for his birthday. He has other cars and motorcycles to drive if we ever start commuting again.

 

[Southpasfan]

Our home was built in 1988 "ranch style" (spread out on a slab foundation). It was also built in sections over time and had two water heaters. One for the east side of the house (two bedrooms, one bath, kitchen, and laundry) and one for the master bathroom on the west side of the house. It was constructed by the original owners who did many non-code things we have since corrected. And, while we admire their use of recycled materials, it resulted in some things being cobbled together rather than properly fitted. The building started out as a pole barn that was a machine shop, which eventually was converted into a home. We bought the home in 2001. In 2014 we replaced the propane furnace with a Series 7 Waterfurnace that when heating the hope will pre-heat domestic hot water which feeds the two water heaters. We hybridized that system with the Sun Bandit direct electric PV to supplement the preheating from the Waterfurnace with solar. It uses a 105 gallon Marathon water heater essentially as a storage tank for the Waterfurnace. It was never connected to household electricity, so we have the Sun Bandit system connected to it. This means less power is used by the Waterfurnace to preheat the water in winter, and also water now gets preheated in the summer even when the Waterfurnace is not heating the house. Water from this preheating system still goes to two other water heaters to deliver hot water closer to point of use, but this preheating substantially reduces how much heat needs to be added to the water at those locations.

The east side of the house has a 50 gallon Marathon water heater where the bottom element is powered by a separate set of panels and Sun Bandit system, and the top element runs on household current.

The west side of the house has a 50 gallon G.E. Geospring air to water heat pump water heater, which we run in pure heat pump mode. It has elements so can be operated as a hybrid, but we don't ever use them.

The Marathon Geospring water heaters were installed in 2014 at the same time as the Waterfurnce. They substantially reduced our electric bills, so our overall use of electricity for water heating decreased, but this was before we installed SENSE in 2019, so I can't quantify it.

I can compare 2019 to 2020, which respectively before and after installing the Sun Bandit systems to our existing systems. We used 3,000 fewer kWh in 2020 to heat hot water compared to 2019.

Is the wind system intergrated into the solar and powerwalls?

Of all the posts on here I have not seen this mentioned before.

 

[Laketime]

And another $500 today
Tesla increases the price of Powerwall again - Electrek

It looks like they added $500 to the price but increased the bundle discount back up to $2500 (it had recently been lowered to $1000).

 

[wjgjr]

It looks like they added $500 to the price but increased the bundle discount back up to $2500 (it had recently been lowered to $1000).

From what I can tell, they changed the bundle discount to $1k + $500 per PW, so the cost is the same for solar + PW.

 

[Patrick66]

Our home was built in 1988 "ranch style" (spread out on a slab foundation).

Just curious, but have you looked into the Scandanavian style foundation insulation? It is just done on the exterior perimeter, out horizontally from the edge of the house, so fairly easy to retrofit and huge energy savings if your slab was not insulated. It also helps use the ground below the home as a thermal mass year-round.

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

Is the wind system intergrated into the solar and powerwalls?

Of all the posts on here I have not seen this mentioned before.

Yes. I have not seen other systems which have done this integration, which is part of why I posted this. We have 4 Skystream 3.7 residential wind turbines, each rated at 2.4kW. The Powerwall treats them the same as the solar PV with microinverters. The solar and wind all go to a combiner panel before feeding the house and Powerwall Gateway. My understanding is that if the grid loses power and the batteries are full, the inverters in the Powerwalls will shift frequency to 50Hz from 60 Hz causing the wind turbines and microinverters to shut off just as if they were directly connected to the grid, then as the batteries deplete, shift back to 60 Hz so the batteries should be able to charge from the combined renewable energy panel if those devices have conditions which let them produce power.

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

Just curious, but have you looked into the Scandanavian style foundation insulation? It is just done on the exterior perimeter, out horizontally from the edge of the house, so fairly easy to retrofit and huge energy savings if your slab was not insulated. It also helps use the ground below the home as a thermal mass year-round.

I'm not familiar with it. Since most heat is lost through the ceiling, as heat rises, that is where we started. I'm skeptical about retrofitting foundations as being effective for much of anything. If you technical information about it, I'd be interested in seeing it. Thank you.

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

@Jason Bloomberg : can I ask how you are getting along with the Skystreams ? When did they get installed ? What hub height ? What wind resource ? (nice set up by the way)

We love the Skystream 3.7. 2 were installed in 2012, and 2 more in 2019. They are virtually zero maintenance, but things will wear out. They are appropriate for our specific needs. They are not for everyone or every installation.

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

" ... How many PowerWalls is a PowerPack?" .

A Powerpack is up to 232 kH per Powerpack. A Powerwall 2 has 13.5 kWh of usable power with a rating of 14 kWh. So a Powerpack is roughly the equivalent of 17 Powerwall 2 units.

 

[Jason Bloomberg]

I believe the number you are looking for is 10 for the smallest PowerPak. So why wouldn’t one use one of those?

A Powerpack is equivalent to about 17 Powerwall 2 units. The Tesla Powerpack is not available for residential installation at the time we installed our Powerwall 2 system, and as far as I know is still not available for residential installation. Powerpack entry level costs are about 2-1/2 to 3 times the cost of our installation. This system was within our financial reach. A Tesla Powerpack is not. Our utility service is single phase 240VAC. Powerpacks are designed for installation 3 phases, 380 to 480 VAC which cannot be accommodated at our site without having the utility bring in a service line with that configuration at our expense, which could cost as much as the Powerpack itself. More information about Tesla Powerpacks are at their website: Powerpack - Commercial & Utility Energy Storage Solutions | Tesla

 

[MP3Mike]

The Tesla Powerpack is not available for residential installation at the time we installed our Powerwall 2 system, and as far as I know is still not available for residential installation.

There was one residential Powerpack install recently: https://twitter.com/WimOracle/status/1328898226494140417?s=20

Wim Coekaerts@WimOracle

I am told this is the first residential Tesla Powerpack install. 480V/232kWh->75kVaY/208V(house) charged by 28kW solar panels (5x15) in a private micro-grid setup(100% disconnected). Been running 100% flawlessly since jumpstart a month ago. Thanks
@elonmusk
I love it.

 

[Southpasfan]

Yes. I have not seen other systems which have done this integration, which is part of why I posted this. We have 4 Skystream 3.7 residential wind turbines, each rated at 2.4kW. The Powerwall treats them the same as the solar PV with microinverters. The solar and wind all go to a combiner panel before feeding the house and Powerwall Gateway. My understanding is that if the grid loses power and the batteries are full, the inverters in the Powerwalls will shift frequency to 50Hz from 60 Hz causing the wind turbines and microinverters to shut off just as if they were directly connected to the grid, then as the batteries deplete, shift back to 60 Hz so the batteries should be able to charge from the combined renewable energy panel if those devices have conditions which let them produce power.

Hmmm......

well, the next question is what type of energy do you get per turbine? Obviously, many of us have (or in my case will have) fantastic systems for nine months or so with the three darkest months not as good. A wind turbine or two would go a long way in winter.

 

[FlatSix911]

We are in Cheyenne, Wyoming and have recently finished installing and bringing online 10 Powerwall 2 units (140 kWh of which 135 kWh is usable). The system is grid tied. We have 4 Skystream 3.7 residential scale wind turbines rated at 2.4 kW each, and just under 8 rated kW of solar PV in trackers with Enphase microinverters. We also have a 22 kW Generac backup generator which is fueled from a 250 gallon propane tank. This system is whole house back up of our all electric home, which has a ground source heat pump for HVAC. We have 3 EVs, a 2012 Signature Edition P85 Tesla Model S we purchased CPO from Tesla in 2016, a 2014 Nissan LEAF SL, and a 2008 Toyota Prius which has been converted to a plug-in hybrid with 17 kWh of salvaged 2013 LEAF batteries. We've been driving electric since 2007. Our previous EVs have been donated to the Historic Electric Vehicle Foundation Museum in Kingman, AZ. Here's a link to an online album of our EVs: Jason Bloomberg's 1993 Eagle Summit Wagon

These are all "Founders Edition" cases, and getting them was somewhat of a surprise. I bought a "referral premium" from a friend who earned one and lived in an apartment where he couldn't install it. I then purchased 9 more Powerwall 2 units from Tesla, fully expecting to get the regular white ones. Tesla knew we have one Founder's Edition Powerwall 2 and the people I was working with, without my asking for it, sent these so they matched the first one. I have no idea how they were able to do it, but it does make a nice installation which color coordinates well with our Signature Red Model S.

This is the maximal size of an installation with Powerwall 2 units. I haven't seen any others, but would love to see more of them. This is the first Powerwall installation in Cheyenne, and the largest installation in Wyoming.View attachment 627344

I am curious if there is anyone else in this group with 10 Powerwall 2 units in their system and what your experiences with have been?

Congratulations on your new Tesla Powerwall system! Please tell us more about your 911 SC EV conversion project...