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Well, luck finally caught up with me... Main pack failed...

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by islandbayy, Jul 22, 2014.

  1. islandbayy

    islandbayy Active Member

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    Well, luck has finally caught up. Great, hot humid evening, getting on the freeway, punch the accelerator and CLUNK, car shutting down please pull over safely. and I just did my range update video this morning, 203 rated miles on my 60kW "A" pack at 34,000 miles,1 year 1 month 6 days of ownership. :-( very frustrated right now, and just wanting to vent.
    90+ degrees and extremely humid.
     
  2. efusco

    efusco Moderator - Model S & X forums

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    Well, the silver lining is a new battery pack, and probably a "D" type. But yea, I think we all dread seeing the pack failures.
     
  3. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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  4. spaghetti

    spaghetti Member

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    Sorry to hear. Hope you get speedy resolution from Tesla. BTW, does anyone know if Tesla has figured out the root cause of these pack failures?
     
  5. islandbayy

    islandbayy Active Member

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    suppose it could have been the drive unit, I have been complaining of the knock and clunk when going from drive to regen and back etc... but the LOUD clunk I do reconise as being a contactor seperateing. car just shut the screens off and they won't come back on. thankfully I got it in tow mode and have been standing on the brake for a hour how. facing uphill on a freeway on ramp. I would have coasted down but the intersection would have been a worse place to end up.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Riddle me this guys, when my car stopped, the 12v low warning came on immediately after the car stopped, and now the car is dead, shut off the screens and everything, only thing left working is the 4 ways. could it have been a DC to DC converter failure or a 12 battery failure? I had 88 miles left on my main pack when she died.
     
  6. Zythryn

    Zythryn MS 70D, MX 90D

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    To whom have you been complaining?
    Service should have scheduled a checkup I would hope?
     
  7. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    The circuit that runs the DC/DC converter(located inside the traction battery), is most likely the culprit. Looks like a new pack is your destiny. Please report what the range charge is on it when you get it back.
     
  8. Seattle

    Seattle Member

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    if it was the contactor that connects the battery to the electric engine (I am using my fancy words :)) that is thunking and failing somehow, that shouldn't just kill the battery pack. it must be something else. Maybe one of our electrical experts could speculate what that could be.
     
  9. David99

    David99 Active Member

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    Could be. If the 12 Volt battery dies it will shut off the main pack and of course the car itself.
     
  10. islandbayy

    islandbayy Active Member

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    Service center. When it was in for the Titanium Shield over 4th of July weekend, they pulled things apart, and re-packed the splines with grease, and the sound did go away for a few days. Saturday, I got Service vehicle warning, called Tesla support, they said it was a non-critical error and no problem to keep driving. Service center called me Monday (Highland Park SC is AWESOME!!!) and they went through logs. Turns out, since I had a cooling pump replaced about a month ago, a new service bulliten out wants them to replace all pumps if one gets replaced, and that was what the warning was about (My vehicle was tagged???).

    So was going to bring it in for that next week. I'm sure I will be getting a call from Ryan tomorrow morning. I hope the news isn't too bad. But like I said, we have been keeping a eye, or rather a ear on that drivetrain noise. Though, What it sounded like and felt like was the main contactor opening up at 230kW power draw.. I've had similar things happen on EV's that I've built.

    - - - Updated - - -


    I sure will, I have been meticulous about my range reports. Unfortunately, I will be starting from 0 miles again.... I had hoped to be able to report the range loss over the entire usable life of my vehicle...

    I will say, after this, and while I'm one of the biggest Tesla Fan-boys out their, I am really nervous about driving this car while out of warranty. My warranty will be up in 16,000 miles for bumper to bumper, and in 91,000 miles for the Battery. so within 2-4 months for bumper to bumper and drive train. I know I can get the extended for 4,500, but it's not in the finances right now, and nor should it be needed at 34,000 miles. Just a accumulation of everything. All the small, minor things that have happened (Of which, I can deal with as none have left me stranded or stuck or in a dangerous situation). The potential pack failure or potential drive train failure that I suffered this evening is a eye opener. If this car were to fail me out of warranty, in one of the above mentioned ways, it would then be towed back to my driveway and would sit for most likely a fairly long time before I would be able to afford a repair. I hope that does not become the case, and maybe I'm just shooken up, tired, hot, sweaty, exhausted, frustrated right now and need this ranting time, and I know the vehicle quality has improved vastly since my lowly # 9846, but I really am scared of the longevity right now.

    - - - Updated - - -

    The Thunking is the sound of the contactor (Think massive light switch) opening while under high load (A few hundred amps will do). You can also hear it when you first enter the car, or when it starts to charge, just not as loud when their isnt as much of a load on it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    It's possible. If thei 12v cant supply enough power to keep the contactor closed, and power flowing, it will open. However, if the DC to DC converter is doing it's job properly, even with a dead no longer taking a charge 12v battery, the converter should be able to supply enough power to keep the car in operation. In that case, it should only be apparent if the 12v is dead after parking and attempting to start the car again (as far as my understanding of tesla systems goes).

    - - - Updated - - -

    And Just a recap how awesome the Tesla service is. Despite my frustration.

    After pulling over safely, I gave Tesla service a call. The tech was very helpful, got my information. Not much he could do to fix the car of course. Within minutes he already forwarded all my info to Highland Park service center. We hung up so the tech could contact a tow company. He got the tow company on the line.
    While their was a wait for the tow truck (is there ever not a wait for a tow..., but thats not Tesla's Fault), he kept calling me back every 10 to 15 minutes to check on me and make sure I was ok.
    Tow truck arrived. Had gotten delayed because the Sheriff redirected him to remove a broken down vehicle blocking freeway lanes (understandable). Loaded my MS on the flat bed. At that point, the Tesla tech called again to check on me. I said we were almost loaded up. Tech put in for a UBER driver to pick me up. Within 3 minutes or so a UBER driver arrived (I'm one as well), picked me up. Nice fellow by the name of Andrew. Had the AC on and the car all nice and freezing for me. I hope I didn't get his car seats to sweaty. I'd also like to give a shout out to Andrew and a thank you for his service in with the US Military!!!
    Tow truck took off. They will be storing my car at the impound lot tonight, then towing it to Highland Park tomorrow, as Highland park is not yet setup for night drop offs yet, and being flat dead and in tow mode, the tow truck driver wants to roll it straight off the truck bed right into the service center garage in the morning.

    So anyways, UBER driver took me to my parents house, where I have been storing my Stinker (ICE Truck). I still need to tow 5,000 Lbs loads every now and then, and since the truck is old, and not worth much, no reason to get rid of it. Well, truck DID start (thank the lord), though took a few tires and a big belch of burnt oil exhaust out the tail pipe. Let er warm up for a few, and just got home before typing these reply's.

    So, my Poor Model S is spending the night in a impound lot, followed most likely Major Surgery tomorrow, and my Poor Clunker Truck is spending the night in my nice clean driveway thoughtfully oil coating it for me haha. Oh god, don't know if I will remember how to pump gas....
     
  11. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Active Member

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    You'll figure it out quick, but then you'll have 10-15 minutes to think about it too. Filling up that truck won't be quick and any gas car is slower than plugging in your EVSE. :smile:

    You know you'll love your Model S even more after spending a day or two with the truck.
     
  12. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    You guys have it right. Once the DC/DC converter or DC/DC charging circuit inside the battery malfunctions, it can no longer charge the 12V battery. Then it's only a matter of time until the 12V goes flat. The Model S doesn't have a battery safety switch you can pull out like virtually every other EV(this is not necessarily a bad thing), therefore the contactor needs 12V power to stay closed and flow juice. Once there is no more 12V power, the contactor opens, and the main pack becomes isolated. When this happens under load, the clunk is much louder than when done at idle.

    As far as the warranty goes, Tesla really does need a seperate powertrain warranty like many ICE cars have. If anything, just for peace of mind. The least they can do, is ship either the failed drive unit or traction battery to Fremont, have it repaired, and ship it back. This way the owner only incurs the specific failure repair costs plus shipping. Much better than the current charge of a rebuilt unit at new unit price. That's not really sustainable. The battery warranty alone on the 85kwh packs is worth it's weight in gold for high mileage drivers.
     
  13. Kalud

    Kalud Member

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    Sorry to hear islandbayy! Hope you get a fresh D pack ;)

    Keep us posted!
     
  14. rlang59

    rlang59 Member

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    Sounds like this has been done in at least one case:

    High Voltage Battery is Being Replaced - Page 2
     
  15. islandbayy

    islandbayy Active Member

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    No kidding. I loved my truck, but in all honesty I thought I was going to die driving it home haha.
     
  16. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    I went through similar emotions (but perhaps not multiplied by heat and exhaustion) when my Roadster had some problems quite a while ago. And then I realized that it really is like anything else when coming off warranty. House paid off. Do I keep fire insurance in place or risk total loss? Only I can weigh my ability to suffer the total loss and manage to replace the house vs. cost of monthly insurance. Long-term care insurance. Pay monthly fee or self-insure if the need arises? Same thing. Roadster catastrophic replacement? Let's see, I bought the battery replacement, so that leaves PEM and other pricey stuff.

    All I'm saying is that I didn't find a single thing where the choice was to NOT pay insurance/extended warranty vs. take a risk on paying out some large amount. The choice is always to pay some money up front vs. paying a very large bill. If you can afford to pay the very large bill and you think the odds are low, then skip the insurance/warranty. If you can't afford the big bill, then budget in the insurance/warranty. Part of the TCO for anything, not just a Model S or Roadster.

    Best of luck in getting your car back quickly. It took me a little time to fully trust that everything would be fine again (just like with anything), but I happily drive anywhere and everywhere without any worries.
     
  17. islandbayy

    islandbayy Active Member

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    I agree on the power train warranty. I a considering the extended, but $4500 for a warranty is hard to swallow when I know I will exceed it's mileage in another 1 to 1 1/2 years. though that might make the difference between a functioning car and a paperweight...

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    yah , I know I should get the extended. If it was still the $2500 it was when I ordered, it would be a lot easier. I don't want this to turn into a shudda cudda woulda
     
  18. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    Yep. This is the same thought process I went through. The extended warranty will only cover 50-100k miles. That's not a very large window for those of us who plan to drive these cars for a long time. I've decided that if I have problems with the drive unit after 50k miles, I'll drop the subframe and repair the thing myself, just like I would be doing at 101k miles anyway.
     
  19. islandbayy

    islandbayy Active Member

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    update, my car appears to be online??? tow company must have charged the 12v last night. I am able to log into the app and the gps is displaying location. looks like it will be arriving at highland park in about 20 minutes.
    Enterprise called me, will be here at 10 am to pick me up. at least I will be chugging around in somthing that gets more the. 10 mpg... ;-). will update when HP calls me.
     
  20. iadbound

    iadbound Member

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    Interested to hear how it turns out. BTW, the extended warranty is only $4,000 :rolleyes: So at least it's $500 less than you thought.
     

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