What battery charge level for storage?

[ucmndd]

American laws require battery packs to last 100,000 miles. So American EVs typically do not let their batteries drop below 50%.

This is complete and utter fabrication. Pure fantasy.

 

[CaseyL]

This is complete and utter fabrication. Pure fantasy.

Wait for it ....

 

[westom]

Absolutely amazing how many somehow know. And (as CaseyL constantly demonstrates) cannot even post one fact or number that demonstrates any knowledge. Somehow his emotions justified by insult are proof.

Because tell him that a 50% charged battery is listed a 0% on the dashboard, then he somehow knows that battery is at 0% energy. And again, no battery is at 0%.

We generally rate a battery with 20% energy as 0% to the consumer. For lithium, that would result in a battery only good for 300 to 600 recharges. So we don't tell CaseyL anything about reality. We keep him ignorant. Only let him discharge his battery to 50%.

Then, somehow, he is an expert.

Lithium and lead acid batteries suffer fast degradation when discharged fully. NiMHd batteries (once) had to be fully discharged to eliminate its 'memory effect'. Panasonic eliminated that problem over a decade ago. (Only the informed know these things.) Better technology NiMHd batteries need not be fully discharged.

A reality, cited repeatedly even by professional sources, does not change with emotional denials. A deeper discharge in a lithium battery degrades it exponentially faster due to passivation.

So that lithium batteries need not be replaced after 300 to 600 discharges, EVs only discharge a battery no lower than 50%. Then tell a naive consumers that his battery is at zero percent. Easier to not make them informed. So that they do not post more insults inspired only by emotions.

There are technical differences in how a Tesla and a Nissan Leaf accomplish this. But entrenched and hate inspired emotions here make it impossible to discuss such differences..

 

[Stuart Watson]

When I left my 2020 LRMY parked, unplugged, unlocked inside my home garage for a week with Sentry mode turned off the battery SOC dropped 1%. Perhaps others can provide their experience.

Odd because sentry mode auto - disconnects at 20% charge

 

[CaseyL]

Absolutely amazing how many somehow know. And (as CaseyL constantly demonstrates) cannot even post one fact or number that demonstrates any knowledge. Somehow his emotions justified by insult are proof.

Because tell him that a 50% charged battery is listed a 0% on the dashboard, then he somehow knows that battery is at 0% energy. And again, no battery is at 0%.

We generally rate a battery with 20% energy as 0% to the consumer. For lithium, that would result in a battery only good for 300 to 600 recharges. So we don't tell CaseyL anything about reality. We keep him ignorant. Only let him discharge his battery to 50%.

I seem to be living rent-free in the westom-bot's head.

 

[OliverM3]

It's getting way to weird down here. everyone knows the curves and the voltages and the hidden remaining % on both ends to help longevity.
We actually see the voltage on the obd2 app so we know 0 is not 50% capacity.

 

[ucmndd]

EVs only discharge a battery no lower than 50%.

This is, again, complete fabrication and fantasy. It’s also trivial to be proven false - lithium ion cells have well understood discharge/voltage curves. If “0%” is actually “50%” that would be easy to prove by measuring the pack voltage.

Nobody disputes the idea that battery packs usually have a buffer built into them at the bottom to prevent complete discharge (or sometimes the top to prevent a real 100% charge). For Teslas this bottom buffer is generally like 3-4% of overall capacity. Some very conservative EVs might lock out 10-15% of overall capacity.

50%? The idea that the batteries in EVs are actually capable of TWICE the energy density and range manufacturers make available to the consumer is a next-level delusion. Batteries are expensive. And heavy. Nobody is putting in DOUBLE the number of cells necessary, for any reason.

 

[CaseyL]

This is, again, complete fabrication and fantasy. It’s also trivial to be proven false - lithium ion cells have well understood discharge/voltage curves. If “0%” is actually “50%” that would be easy to prove by measuring the pack voltage.
:
50%? The idea that the batteries in EVs are actually capable of TWICE the energy density and range manufacturers make available to the consumer is a next-level delusion. Batteries are expensive. And heavy. Nobody is putting in DOUBLE the number of cells necessary, for any reason.

There is also no way that Tesla, or any other car company, would "give away" that much range. I can just see the meeting where the engineer says, "This car actually has 600 miles of range, but I recommend that we specify the range closer to 300 miles".

Manager says, "You're a genius!"

And, yeah, I'm an engineer.

 

[RichAZ/CapeCod]

I am so confused. I don't know who to be tee'd off with!

Rich

 

[ucmndd]

There is also no way that Tesla, or any other car company, would "give away" that much range. I can just see the meeting where the engineer says, "This car actually has 600 miles of range, but I recommend that we specify the range closer to 300 miles".

Manager says, "You're a genius!”

Think of the cottage industry that would have sprung up to unlock that extra range! People have had root on these cars for a decade now…

 

[CaseyL]

I am so confused. I don't know who to be tee'd off with!

Rich

Honestly, amost all of us are agreeing with each other.

 

[CaseyL]

Absolutely amazing how many somehow know. And (as CaseyL constantly demonstrates) cannot even post one fact or number that demonstrates any knowledge. Somehow his emotions justified by insult are proof.

Then tell a naive consumers that his battery is at zero percent. Easier to not make them informed. So that they do not post more insults inspired only by emotions.

There are technical differences in how a Tesla and a Nissan Leaf accomplish this. But entrenched and hate inspired emotions here make it impossible to discuss such differences..

Okay, this should be simple.

Quote my insult.

 

[CyberGus]

Honestly, amost all of us are agreeing with each other.

I disagree!!

 

[thesmokingman]

Fully charge it. Then leave it unplugged. It almost never happens. But batteries tend to create fires most often when charging.

If you do not have a 'whole house' protector (connected low impedance - ie less than 10 feet to single point earth ground electrodes), then lightning is all but invited inside to find earth ground destructively via your charger and car. Either a surge (lightning is only one example) connects low impedance (ie hardwire has no sharp bends) to earth. Or it is inside hunting for earth ground via all things inside. Only you make that choice.

A disconnected car is not a best connection to earth. Strongly recommended especially if using plug-in protectors anywhere inside a house. Since those puny Type 3 protectors have a nasty habit of finding even more destructive connections to earth. Must be more than 30 feet from the main breaker box and earth ground (to reduce fire threats). And must be protected by properly earthed 'whole house' protection.

Best is to charge it fully, disconnect a charger, and leave it. I should hold most of that charge even three weeks later. Lithium batteries are that significantly better at holding a charge compared to other rechargeable batteries.

I don't know what more hilarious that you post with such confidence when you're actually flat out wrong, or that you keep doubling down over and over again.

 

[D.E.]

My neighbor’s house was hit by lightning. Here is one of his surge protectors. The underside is where the thing was welded to the carpet. Everything plugged into this surge protector survived without damage. I figured everyone might be interested in seeing these pictures.

 

[CyberGus]

My neighbor’s house was hit by lightning. Here is one of his surge protectors. The underside is where the thing was welded to the carpet. Everything plugged into this surge protector survived without damage. I figured everyone might be interested in seeing these pictures.

View attachment 804871View attachment 804872

A friend of mine also took a direct strike to his home. Not only did the surge protector fail to protect anything, but the plugs were welded into the sockets!

 

[thesmokingman]

Ya know, Teslas have been hit by lightning before like any other car I suppose. But this one was hit while charging, guess what happened? Not much of anything actually, 12v conked out which had to be jumped later to get charge door unlocked. But omg, it did not blow up, what?

[UPDATE] Tesla Model S Struck By Lightning While Charging

A Model S struck by lightning while charging must wait at least one day for Tesla technicians to figure out what went wrong and restore it to service.

www.teslarati.com

 

[ucmndd]

Shortly after I got my car it was charging when there was a lightning strike VERY close to our home that caused a sizable power surge. The car's cooling fans went into ludicrous mode for about 2 minutes - sounded like a jet taking off in the garage.

Then they stopped, and that was pretty much it. I freaked because the car was so new but there was nothing to really report. That was 5.5 years and 140,000 miles ago.

 

[westom]

My neighbor’s house was hit by lightning. Here is one of his surge protectors. The underside is where the thing was welded to the carpet. Everything plugged into this surge protector survived without damage.

That is the APC protector that resulted in a 15 million unit recall. Due to at least 700 potential fires that APC knew about. Also discussed here.

A surge, too tiny to overwhelm protection in attached appliances, also destroyed that tiny joule protector - catastrophically. Protector part (MOV) manufacturers state that catastrophic failures must never happen. Only acceptable failure mode is degradation.

So, a surge, too tiny to harm attached electronics, almost caused a house fire. Grossly undersizing a protector (Type 3) gets naive consumers to recommend that protector. Rather than superior circuits, inside an appliance, that are more robust.

Effective protectors remain functional for many decades after many direct lightning strikes. With specification numbers that say so. Provided by other companies known for integrity. Protector must never burn - fail catastrophically.

For same reasons, if a plug-in protector is found in your luggage, a cruise ship will probably confiscate it. They take fire threats far more seriously.

That protector did no effective protection. Adding five cent protector parts, to sell for $25 or $80, protects profit margins. Effective protectors remain functional - do not burn. Come with numbers that define protection even for direct lightning strikes. Cost about $1 per protected appliance. Must exist to protect Type 3 protectors. Nearby lightning strikes cause no changes if protection is effective.

Effective solution answer this question. Where do hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate? Then potential house fires do not exist. Then fans did not spin. A Tesla did not need external power to open its door. Indicators that no effective protection existed.

How many joules in that APC protector? Thousand joules is near zero protection.

 

[WarekiwiT]

I wonder if a good surge protector would help and just keep the mobile connector plugged in? I mean we don't run around the house and unplug all appliances and devices while we're away. They don't cost 100k either though I do leave mine plugged in during storms since my chargepoint is a smart charger and has gfci protection.

All new home/office installations in the UK now have a surge protector- I fitted one before installing the tesla Gen 3 wall connector.