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What does "ignore" mean in 8.0?

Discussion in 'Model S' started by Hengist, Sep 22, 2016.

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  1. Hengist

    Hengist Member

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    We seem to be missing a definion of what "ignore" means in 8.0. If I "ignore" three alerts my autopilot gets disabled. But what is the definition of ignore? Does it mean that I don't twitch the wheel in five seconds of the alert appearing? Of the bong sound that gets my attention from the road? Is getting a bong sound mean I ignored the dash alert? Just what is the definition? A real answer would be input into whether I accept the 8.0 software at this time.

    Anybody know?
     
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  2. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    I think "ignore" means the car does not sense your hand on the steering wheel. A very slight torque needs to be applied to the wheel. How often that needs to be applied is not certain, but every few minutes seems likely. Many AP users seem to drive with one or both hands resting lightly on the wheel. Some AP users occasionally put a hand on the wheel.

    There are so many major improvements in V8.0 that if you don't install it you are going to miss out on a lot of useful features.
     
  3. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    I haven't seen anything definitive yet.

    I think it'll be if you don't respond at all the the visual alert, jerk the wheel when the audible hits, and then it doesn't detect you on the wheel shortly after the jerk.

    (And then repeat that cycle twice more to get the red hands of shame.)
     
  4. Hengist

    Hengist Member

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    I was not clear enough. In 7.1 there are escalating alerts: first a visual, then a tone, then another tone, and eventually the car slows and stops and puts on the flashers.

    In 8.0, what exactly happens? From elon's tweets and talks, it sounds like getting any alert means you are ignoring the hands on. He saya that experienced drivers get an alert, twitch the wheel - and he is trying to punish that behavior. Does getting three tone alerts kill autopilot? Or how many seconds from a tone do you need to respond? Or does getting a tone mean you ignored the purely visual alert?
     
  5. jelloslug

    jelloslug Member

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    I have never had to "torque" the wheel to get rid of a warning. You can feel the sensors if you run your fingers over the outside rim of the wheel. Simply holding the wheel for a second is all I ever have to do.
     
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  6. CmdrThor

    CmdrThor Member

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    There are no sensors on the wheel. It detects whether you move the wheel or resist AP's moving of the wheel.
     
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  7. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    I don't think we have a definitive answer.

    I think it will be getting three tone alerts in an hour to kill AP - possibly even three tone alerts with a hold wheel immediately after the interval (as in, if you put your hands on the wheel for a while instead of just jerking the wheel and releasing it won't count.)

    I'm expecting the same sequence - a visual alert, an audible if you don't comply, and finally the slowing audible if you still don't.
     
  8. u00mem9

    u00mem9 Member

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    That is not correct. The steering system has a direct torque measurement of the steering shaft. It uses that signal which is zero if there are no hands on the wheel, and nonzero when the EPS system steers the vehicle and your hands are on the wheel and cause a momentary reaction torque as your hand begins to be accelerated by the wheel.
     
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  9. jelloslug

    jelloslug Member

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    I can just touch the outside of the wheel and the warning will go away.
     
  10. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    Interesting. Where on the outside of the wheel are you touching. What kind of car? Do you have the heated steering wheel?
     
  11. u00mem9

    u00mem9 Member

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    yes, because that creates a torque between the steering rack and the steering wheel.
     
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  12. sdmunson

    sdmunson New Member

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    I think we all get the Torque detection, steering wheel operation, sensors, etc... Additionally, we all know the language or the misbehavior penalty...."Ignore 3 warning within 1 hour". The question Hengist was asking is simple and only someone with 8.0 installed can answer it definitively........ What constitutes "Ignore"???? Once the visual message is displayed and no-touch, Once the Audible Chime is played and no-touch.... Here is a simple way to ask the question.... "I am driving with autopilot activated and I reach over to unzip my laptop back for some peanuts, shortly during this time I see a message on the display asking me to Place Hands On Wheel.....I put my hands on the wheel and eat my peanuts....." DO I GET A IGNORE STRIKE #1 ???? I starting to believe nobody really knows out here in forum land....
     
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  13. chillaban

    chillaban Member

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    You are likely slightly moving the steering column or resisting Autosteer's minor corrective steering torque when you do this.

    It's the same for me. The "way" I touch the wheel causes AP to sense me even when I'm not trying to apply torque.

    However, I've seen other folks drive my car grip the wheel but AP still says "hold steering wheel", especially on extremely straight sections of the road.
     
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  14. Sir Guacamolaf

    Sir Guacamolaf The good kind of fat

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    Bumping this up. I'd like to know the answer to this too.

    If the screen says "hold steering", and I hold it and the warning goes away, does that constitute as 1 out 3 warnings before AP is disabled?
     
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  15. Seashepherd

    Seashepherd Member

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    I'm so surprised that no one here has posted a review of the 8.0 AP yet. It's so heavily discussed, yet the only thing owners, who already received the update, discuss is the media player?
     
  16. u00mem9

    u00mem9 Member

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    This is the only one I have seen...seems to show the frequent warnings but not clear about if the 3 strikes rule is being triggered

     
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  17. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    I used AP alot yesterday on 8.0 but I don't know the answer either. I get the warning, torque the wheel it goes away. That should not be an "ignore" . I didn't have it on long enough each time to check this. I think of it as ignoring the warning several times before losing AP.
     
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  18. Nerdy_Engineer

    Nerdy_Engineer Brett - The Nerdy Engineer

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    Do you all not keep any hands on the wheel when using Autopilot? The only time I take both hands off the wheel is in very slow stop and go traffic. However, even with my hands on the wheel on the interstate, occasionally I'll get the notification to hold the steering wheel.
     
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  19. u00mem9

    u00mem9 Member

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    Same here. That is the point of the concern. Since the system is unable to sense a hand touching the wheel, unless it also provides a reaction torque, many (most?) users get the notification even when they have hands on the wheel. Dispatching that warning every 1-3 min seems like a burden which is why there is discussion about 7.1 vs 8.0 in the other thread.
     
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  20. Nerdy_Engineer

    Nerdy_Engineer Brett - The Nerdy Engineer

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    I had read that some people can just squeeze the wheel to make the warning go away. I've had mixed results with that. I'm not sure if squeezing the wheel really doesn't anything, or if you're just holding the wheel from rotating ever so slightly and autopilot is just sensing that.
     

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