What I Learned from My First Road Trip

[Jeeps17]

I had all the same issues tonight on a drive home through snow and unplowed roads, plus the wipers are brutal in winter conditions.
We tried a/c off and on for defrost and found it best to have the heat set to high for both sides and the defrosters on without a/c.
It was still hard to regulate. If I didn't have my son experimenting while I drove it would have been treacherous. There should be specific side window defrosters like most cars have today. Plus, what am I missing, how do you warm up and defrost the car while you are outside trying to clear off snow and scrape the windows?

Sigh... looks like the real winter testing (vs. just "cold weather testing") is going on now, and the S v1.0 is not faring very well... Handling and traction may be adequate, but not of great use if you can't see where you are going.

Could you elaborate on the issues you had with the wipers?

 

[PatP]

Sigh... looks like the real winter testing (vs. just "cold weather testing") is going on now, and the S v1.0 is not faring very well... Handling and traction may be adequate, but not of great use if you can't see where you are going.

Could you elaborate on the issues you had with the wipers?

I have to go in the same direction. True winter testing hasn't probably been done in a real life (except for handling and battery). After living with the car for almost a week, I have to say many things have to be improved for winter. Another problem that people will have is that the rated battery display is dangerously optimistic for winter. So you *think" you have (for example) 200km left from the main display, but the reality if you dig deeper (what most normal people will not do), your true range is more like 120 km (so almost half of it). Again, really bad surprises.

The thing I found weird is that I had LESS issues with the Roadster (except inadequate heating which was expected for a convertible) in winter than my Model S... So that's why I expected the Model S would be even better in winter conditions.

And I'm not taking in account sudden car power off - V4.1 - can't charge? - Page 9 - (at least two documented cases) which could be really dangerous in winter time.

 

[Brian H]

May I already express the hope that you guys won't start a competition of who can come as close as possible to an empty battery, just for the thrill of it? Because the reports of that failing don't read well...actually it doesn't read that well in the first place.

Actually, by one report there are at least 5 or 6 miles left when it sez 0; eating into that will be the REAL squeeze-test‼
:scared:

 

[mknox]

I just checked the owner's manual on my car and you are correct! The manual says that when "defrost" or "defrost/feet vents" mode is selected, circulation goes to "fresh air" and the A/C automatically engages, but the LED on the A/C button will not be lit.

My current ICE is the same. A/C compressor comes on, but the LED on the A/C button doesn't illuminate in these conditions. There is a point when the temperature drops to a certain level, that the A/C will never come on, even if manually selected. I think this is to protect the A/C system from extreme cold situations.

 

[FlasherZ]

My current ICE is the same. A/C compressor comes on, but the LED on the A/C button doesn't illuminate in these conditions. There is a point when the temperature drops to a certain level, that the A/C will never come on, even if manually selected. I think this is to protect the A/C system from extreme cold situations.

On my car this is below 40 degrees F. The "snowflake" icon will flash 3 times then go off.

 

[Doug_G]

On my car this is below 40 degrees F. The "snowflake" icon will flash 3 times then go off.

When you get this cold, simply bringing in outside air and heating it will cause the relative humidity to plummet. So under very cold conditions you shouldn't need the A/C.

In cold weather, the first thing you should do when you start fogging up is turn off the recirculate button.

 

[mknox]

In cold weather, the first thing you should do when you start fogging up is turn off the recirculate button.

I can't remember that last time I actually used Recirculate. I think in Auto, it will go into that mode for a couple of minutes in the summer when it's really hot and is first cooling down the car.

 

[cinergi]

Is Tesla leaving the Roadster HPC -> Model S adapters in their retail location chargers? Was curious about the protocol for charging at these Tesla Retail locations. Do you have to go inside and talk to the folks in the store first?

My experience with two stores has been "no" -- you have to go inside and ask for it. Theft risk.

 

[GDH]

My experience with two stores has been "no" -- you have to go inside and ask for it. Theft risk.

I was told by 2 different employees at the Portland store that you can charge at their charge stations for free. And that you did not have to ask.

 

[Robert.Boston]

I was told by 2 different employees at the Portland store that you can charge at their charge stations for free. And that you did not have to ask.

That's true if you have a Roadster or your own HPC->Model S converter cord. If you need the cord, you need to borrow it from the store.

 

[stevezzzz]

I just checked the owner's manual on my car and you are correct! The manual says that when "defrost" or "defrost/feet vents" mode is selected, circulation goes to "fresh air" and the A/C automatically engages, but the LED on the A/C button will not be lit.

I don't remember if this was the case on my first car from the mid-1980's, but I've always hit AC, Blower, and Heat since then. Old habits die hard I guess. Well, that simplifies things. A,B,C becomes B,C :smile:

It's even simpler than that: when you select the front Defrost icon from the bottom ribbon of the touch screen the temp goes to HI, the blower goes to max, the distribution setting goes to defrost, recirculate setting goes to outside air, and the A/C (presumably, according to the manual, if it's not too cold out) comes on. When you touch the icon again everything reverts to whatever settings you had previously. So: A, B, C becomes D. :smile:

Can anyone confirm that this is a 4.0/4.1 change in behavior? I don't recall it working this way when I first got the car three months ago.

Note that this doesn't solve the inherent de-fogging problems people are reporting, it just makes it easy to set up the climate system to do the best it can.

Update: I went out to the garage and played with the climate controls to verify what I'd written. It's accurate but for the fact that, occasionally, the blower doesn't go to max when you select the front defrost icon. Cycling defrost off and back on a second time will always force the system to max blower. On my car, the vast majority of the defrost airflow is delivered to the windshield and very little to the side windows. Opening the climate control popup and adding face-level distribution does improve flow to the side windows without detracting from windshield defrosting much but, and this is a very big 'but', doing so means that when you turn off the defrost icon the temperature remains set to HI, and the distribution remains set to face-level plus windshield.

 

[Kipernicus]

Thanks for the super writeup, Francis!

What struck me as interesting was:
1. To do this trip in a 60 one would have to charge for MUCH longer at the destination (or hope to find a HPWC)
2. Something didn't seem to add up with the kWh started, used, and added. Perhaps regen messes up the math, but wouldn't regen leave more miles remaining?
91 total kWh used round trip, about 18 added, and assuming he started with 85 (he said a full range mode charge) that should leave 12kWh remaining, or rated range of about 40 miles (at 300), not 4. When dmetcalf did the historic 423 mile run did the car say he used 85 kWh? His twitpic was quite blurry.

 

[Lyon]

I would imagine that it would be a difficult retrofit unless Tesla has planned ahead for one. On the RAV4, the windshield wiring was a high-voltage system, not standard 12V. I don't know what the voltage was -- it was not the full traction pack voltage, but it was more than 12V.

Our LR3 has a heated windshield and, as far as I know, it's just got the standard 12v system. I'm not saying that it would be an easy retrofit but I doubt that they'd need an extra battery system.

 

[brianman]

It's even simpler than that: when you select the front Defrost icon ...
Can anyone confirm that this is a 4.0/4.1 change in behavior? I don't recall it working this way when I first got the car three months ago.

4.0
Model S Software/Firmware Updates - Page 47

 

[tomn]

Setting ventilation to Fresh Air removed my fogging problem

I believe that the ventilation has to be on Fresh Air and not Recycle Air for the fogging not to occur. During the first week I was driving in heavy rain in the Bay Area and had the same fogging on the windshield as reported by many owners. Then I notice that the ventilation setting was on Automatic. I switched it to Fresh Air and reduced the fogging quite a bit. I explored a little bit more have my current manual settings as follows: No A/C, Fresh Air, air flow to feet and windshield, temp 70-75, fan at level 2. Since then (a month now) I don't have any more fogging problem even when driving through heavy rain. The Fresh Air setting is important, since my old Honda van has the same issue if I recycle air. Fogging occurs heavily when I have 4-5 passengers in the car because human breath has lot of humidity. Setting ventilation to Fresh Air and just have the air flow go to the windshield solves the fogging on both my Honda van and the Model S.

 

[Brian H]

Kip'r;
He used 80.5, and was into his "sub-0 miles" range. Range mode leaves about 5kWh for battery storage needs etc., but you can use some of it if you don't mind heavy nagging! "Plug in NOW!" :scared: :wink:

tomn;
Yes, heating up cool/cold outside air is the key; even if its Relative Humidity is high at ambient temps, warming it gives lots of drying capacity (low RH). It would be interesting to put a hygrometer near the vents in cool wet weather to see how far down the RH goes.