What is the current lead time for Power Wall installation?

[abasile]

Has Tesla given you any time frame for resolving this issue ?

No, they haven't, and I've been trying to get them to do something to resolve it since late last autumn. At least I made progress by getting them to agree to send a technician to my house last week to witness the problem firsthand. The technician encouraged me to wait about a week and then try following up on the issue, so I'll be doing that.

I just spoke with Tesla customer support. They advised that in a grid outage, the PV/inverter won't come back online until the Powerwall capacity drops below 80%. They advised it was an approximate 15 minute polling interval from the Gateway. In my test this weekend, the battery never dropped below 95%. For my next test I will simulate a longer grid outage during the day and let the battery drop below the 80% threshold and see if the PV comes back on-line. Makes sense. Hopefully it actually works that way.

I've heard various conflicting theories from customer support. I don't think anyone is being malicious, but my opinion is that many of the support reps themselves are in the dark about what the software is actually doing.

In my past calls, Powerwall support reps threw out various thresholds like 90%, 80%, and 70%, hence my efforts to keep the charge lower before starting off-grid tests. All that should matter is whether the Powerwalls can accept the output of our solar array. With two Powerwalls and a maximum AC rating of 6.7 kW on our solar, this should not be an issue even above 90% charge.

My limited understanding is that you can configure what % the Powerwall charges and this can be done through the Tesla app.

You can configure the backup reserve percentage, but there is no way to explicitly configure the maximum charge. This is a feature that I requested from Tesla several months ago. With release 1.34.2, the buggiest I've seen in a while, our Powerwalls end up spending more time at "100%" than I'd prefer.

Perhaps then I'll just make a deposit and wait until they contact me and are ready to get into specifics.

Sounds like a good plan. Hopefully, by the time you actually need to sign an installation contract, Tesla will have resolved the issue that some of us are experiencing of not being able to charge from solar during outages.

Don't get me wrong - I think the Powerwall is a great product. I just hope that Tesla starts putting more effort into Powerwall software validation!

 

[MorrisonHiker]

Well certainly it doesn't make sense that the array should be feeding juice in if the batteries are very close to topped out. Also, it would make sense if optimal max battery charging is about 80-90% with the batteries only going to 100% periodically for re-balancing or when preparing for a storm, etc.

I would probably normally keep the batteries around 75-80% anyways since my immediate use would not be to use the batteries for off peak charging.

You don't get to choose the maximum charge limit, just the amount you want reserved for outages. Mine usually charge to 100% on the weekends but on other days of the week, they only charge somewhere between 65% and 90%. While I have the peak period programmed to start at 2 pm M-F, they usually start sending everything back to the grid several hours before that. Today, they've been sending everything back to the grid (except for that being sent to power the house) since 9 am.

 

[miimura]

Well certainly it doesn't make sense that the array should be feeding juice in if the batteries are very close to topped out. Also, it would make sense if optimal max battery charging is about 80-90% with the batteries only going to 100% periodically for re-balancing or when preparing for a storm, etc.

I would probably normally keep the batteries around 75-80% anyways since my immediate use would not be to use the batteries for off peak charging.

Powerwalls routinely go to nominal 100% without issue because that's not really the true 100% SOC. It will go higher in Storm Watch, but that's the only time it goes above the daily cycling SOC level.

 

[cwied]

Well certainly it doesn't make sense that the array should be feeding juice in if the batteries are very close to topped out. Also, it would make sense if optimal max battery charging is about 80-90% with the batteries only going to 100% periodically for re-balancing or when preparing for a storm, etc.

It's actually more than just that. When the grid is down, there is nowhere for the power from the array to go except to the house or the batteries. If the batteries can't consume what the house isn't using, there's a problem. This is why the Powerwalls have to shut the array down if they aren't at an SoC where they can accept all the extra power. I suspect they just assume that they have to be able to consume everything the array can produce right now, so they shift the frequency if they can't accept that under the current conditions.

As far as I know, the Powerwalls have an extra reserve over 100% built in, so it shouldn't be necessary to keep them at a lower SoC. When Stormwatch kicks in, they charge quite a bit after they've reached 100%, so there's definitely more capacity than they regularly use.

 

[Vines]

Another thing to remember when wondering if the PW should be allowing the solar to turn on is this: Powerwalls cannot charge until the batteries are at least 55 degrees or so. If the PW are outside, then they will self consume power to warm themselves until they reach this threshold. Once they do, then the solar can come on.
In addition to this there may be firmware bugs causing additional weirdness with the grid frequency when in backup mode.

 

[voip-ninja]

Another thing to remember when wondering if the PW should be allowing the solar to turn on is this: Powerwalls cannot charge until the batteries are at least 55 degrees or so. If the PW are outside, then they will self consume power to warm themselves until they reach this threshold. Once they do, then the solar can come on.
In addition to this there may be firmware bugs causing additional weirdness with the grid frequency when in backup mode.

Good info. In my case I would have them installed near my inverter, which is in my basement. Lowest temperature down there is generally about 60F. Since it's climate controlled and not exposed to the elements my experience as an engineer tells me they would last longer (although how much I can't say).

Since I can't make immediate use of the energy distribution power saving characteristics (I've got about 12 years left on my 100% net metering arrangement with the local utility) the only purpose the PowerWalls truly serve for me is whole home power backup.

At this point the 30% tax savings are seeming like they just might not be worth the 'still quite large' expense of doing the installation when there are still some issues to iron out.

Perhaps if I had an in-place reservation at the earlier lower price then this would be a no brainer.

Tax credit drops to 26% I believe in 2020. I think I'm going to wait things out. It's possible that Tesla will re-adjust the price or introduce a version 3 of the powerwall later this year or early next that will leave fewer concerns in this area.

 

[abasile]

Another thing to remember when wondering if the PW should be allowing the solar to turn on is this: Powerwalls cannot charge until the batteries are at least 55 degrees or so. If the PW are outside, then they will self consume power to warm themselves until they reach this threshold. Once they do, then the solar can come on.
In addition to this there may be firmware bugs causing additional weirdness with the grid frequency when in backup mode.

At one point, a Tesla rep told me that our Powerwalls weren't charging from solar during outages because of the low ambient temperature (around 10C/50F in that instance). That would be an absolutely unacceptable limitation in cooler climates!

The firmware should be able to do much, much better. If the state of charge isn't too high, the Powerwalls are already charging from solar, and then the grid goes down, they should immediately run their thermal management system if needed, set the frequency at 60 Hz, and resume charging from solar. If the grid has been down overnight, then it would be sensible to run the thermal management system in the morning, at maybe 9 AM, and then lower the frequency to 60 Hz to permit solar charging.

In my case I would have them installed near my inverter, which is in my basement. Lowest temperature down there is generally about 60F.

In that case, you might be totally fine even with the current firmware issues. I may try some more outage tests when the weather warms up, hopefully within the next several days or so.

Tax credit drops to 26% I believe in 2020. I think I'm going to wait things out. It's possible that Tesla will re-adjust the price or introduce a version 3 of the powerwall later this year or early next that will leave fewer concerns in this area.

I wouldn't be in a big hurry to move forward over a tax credit of 30% vs. 26%. You want to be sure the system will meet your requirements before committing to anything. At the same time, if you think you'll end up getting Powerwalls sooner or later, it probably wouldn't hurt to have a refundable reservation in place.

 

[abasile]

At this point the 30% tax savings are seeming like they just might not be worth the 'still quite large' expense of doing the installation when there are still some issues to iron out.

So, I just got off the phone with Tesla, as detailed at #43. They're shooting for having a fix, in the next firmware release, for the frequency issue that for some customers is making it impossible to charge from solar during outages.

If you were to place a Powerwall reservation now, there seems like a good chance that Tesla will have a fix before you have to commit to a contract. We'll see, of course.

 

[Kenne74]

Placed an order 2 weeks ago after sitting on it for months and was contacted this week to start the paperwork process. No idea on a firm timeline and frankly not in a huge hurry as I hate giving money away.

If I had to guess the timeline I figured end of May/June time frame.

FYI this is in Az

 

[KCey]

From start to finish, deposit online to complete install, was 31 days. Much faster than anticipated but very welcomed since PG&E in our area is now threatening extended power outages. We’re in the Central Valley CA.

 

[Atom12]

From start to finish, deposit online to complete install, was 31 days. Much faster than anticipated but very welcomed since PG&E in our area is now threatening extended power outages. We’re in the Central Valley CA.

Hi KCey: Is your solar installation also Tesla?

Thank you!

 

[KCey]

Yes, Tesla. And they were really great. Couldn’t have gone smoother.

 

[KCey]

Hi KCey: Is your solar installation also Tesla?

Thank you!

Solar was installed in 2015, not Tesla. This install was for the Powerwalls only.

 

[pilotSteve]

We have had two Powerall's on order thru an independent (not Tesla) installer for three weeks. Today the installer tell ms that Tesla says ""We received a message from Tesla that Powerwall 2 batteries and equipment is backlogged until at least January 2021, and possibly longer due to a surge in demand and due to lower production as a result of COVID-19. Tesla has begun building another manufacturing line in its Nevada Gigafactory to increase production, which will help increase Tesla's ability to fulfill existing orders and future demand."

Any ideas? I am hesitant to commit to PWs if they have a 6 month lead time.....

 

[cridinger82]

We have had two Powerall's on order thru an independent (not Tesla) installer for three weeks. Today the installer tell ms that Tesla says ""We received a message from Tesla that Powerwall 2 batteries and equipment is backlogged until at least January 2021, and possibly longer due to a surge in demand and due to lower production as a result of COVID-19. Tesla has begun building another manufacturing line in its Nevada Gigafactory to increase production, which will help increase Tesla's ability to fulfill existing orders and future demand."

Any ideas? I am hesitant to commit to PWs if they have a 6 month lead time.....

i was told about a month ago that they had a sufficient amount of powerwalls to meet current demands but in our area were lacking electricians to install the powerwalls due to the increased demand. I've been stuck in permitting limbo for over a month so that may have changed. i would be mighty pissed to have to wait that long. but from what i've heard 3rd party installers do not get allocations first and tesla keeps large allocations aside for "tesla" installs. 3rd parties wait in line.

 

[mspohr]

I waited a year then gave up and installed an Outback Skybox. It's working great. Highly configurable. It handles any kind of batteries. Has inputs for Solar PV strings and a generator. 5 kW and stackable.
Since I'm using this for emergency backup, I used AGM batteries which are much cheaper.

 

[jjrandorin]

We have had two Powerall's on order thru an independent (not Tesla) installer for three weeks. Today the installer tell ms that Tesla says ""We received a message from Tesla that Powerwall 2 batteries and equipment is backlogged until at least January 2021, and possibly longer due to a surge in demand and due to lower production as a result of COVID-19. Tesla has begun building another manufacturing line in its Nevada Gigafactory to increase production, which will help increase Tesla's ability to fulfill existing orders and future demand."

Any ideas? I am hesitant to commit to PWs if they have a 6 month lead time.....

If you got a quote from tesla, I would check with them to see what lead time is through them. My guess is, this is some combination of a slight shortage in supply, plus your third parties backlog of install capacity. I doubt it is as simple as "this third party company can not get powerwalls till 2021", but more like " we are backlogged on installs till nov / december of 2019 already.

 

[BrettS]

this third party company can not get powerwalls till 2021", but more like " we are backlogged on installs till nov / december of 2019 already

So have we gotten to the point where we are just pretending that 2020 doesn’t exist at all now?

 

[mspohr]

So have we gotten to the point where we are just pretending that 2020 doesn’t exist at all now?

2020 is a washout. Better luck next year.

 

[jjrandorin]

So have we gotten to the point where we are just pretending that 2020 doesn’t exist at all now?

Lmao... freudian slip there... 2020 is a dumpster@$!$