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I wouldn’t put much faith in that number for specific vehicle performance calculations. It’s not precise. We don’t know what discharge rate is used for the rating or if it has been rounded. If it said 50.0 @ 0.2C, I’d pay attention.
A similar example is the Bolt EV. It’s battery pack has a sticker that says 57 kWh. Yet GM markets the car as 60 and people get 60 out of it.
A similar example is the Bolt EV. It’s battery pack has a sticker that says 57 kWh. Yet GM markets the car as 60 and people get 60 out of it.
The only thing I don't get is at the 10:41 mark in the video he shows that the onboard navigation estimates that 92% of the battery will be used to travel 171 miles...which puts total estimated range at ~186 miles. Agree with his comments that using the heater can significantly impact range...so that may explain why he got < 200mi in his "real world test"...but assuming he tested all the other cars in the same manner it's surprising to see how much the Tesla's range was impacted. The other odd thing is the Monroney sticker showed that it was a Standard Range Plus w/ 240mi range but the total cost was only $35k + $1k paint + $1.2k destination = $37.2k? My SR+ was $35k + $2k SR+ upgrade + $1.2k destination = $38.2k. FWIW my SR+ lifetime average is 213 Wh/mi (3k miles).
Alex said he does't like standard regenerative braking on Tesla and disabled it. He prefer coasting like on a regular ICE car. On a Tesla 3, applying brake will not try to apply stronger regeneration before using physical brake. That mean if you don't set regen option on "Standard" setting, you will end up using physical brake more often and loose potential energy regeneration on the car. I think this is his one of his mistake. I think that was removed when Customer report stated that Tesla M3 was not braking enough in emergency braking. Tesla made an update and simply set brake pedal to activate physical brake galiper right away to shave some precious seconds. I like that idea.
We do have a SR+ and a Volt at home. The Volt will try to regen first when pressing brake pedal before failing back on physical brake. That mean using D (Regular coasting) rather than L (High regen) on the Volt will not have that much impact compared to the Tesla M3.
However, in an emergency stop situation, the Tesla M3 might brake faster since no computer need to balance regen VS physical, it just apply physical brake right away when you press brake. So to improve battery, Tesla owner should stick to the the highest regen option available.
pdx_m3s
Active Member
If you know charging rate (volts times current) and charge duration, you can easily solve for battery pack size. I come up with ~50kWh each time
PhilRogers
Member
Here is my thread with real world highway Wh/m readings(spelling should be ignored).
First Tesla M3 SR+ road trip
City driving is typically 10% better, unless(as mentioned) it is shorter than 10miles, where the AC eats up the driving efficiency benefits.
198 highway miles with 2 adults, 2 kids and luggage took the battery from 99% to 17%.
Great post. (Yes, I'm just now reading it!) That still would come close to the advertised 240 mile range had you taken it to zero? I'm not seeing that kind of efficiency. Even driving conservatively, in perfect conditions, flat terrain (Illinois), and no significant use of air, I ALWAYS get almost exactly 2 miles per percentage point on the display. If I leave for work at 80%, and drive 30 miles, I arrive at 65%. Again, that's 2 miles per percentage point, which would reflect a true range of only 200 miles. I really worry there is something wrong with my car. But every time I've raised that question on this forum I've gotten flamed.
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
Judging from your profile picture, you have the 19" performance wheels? The EPA hasn't officially rated the SR+ with bigger tires, but judging by Troy Teslike's range table, that will knock 20 miles off the rated range right off the bat. And then the rest could be down to your average speed. At 70-75 MPH with 19" wheels, you'd be achieving the EPA dynamo test performance by getting ~200 miles of range: Teslike.com
PhilRogers
Member
This is unbelievably helpful! Of all the posts I've read this best explains what I'm seeing. Just one question---do you know what Teslike bases its table on? In other words, who did the tests?
Thanks a million. This is a huge help!
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
The table is a little outdated now, but it's based on the dynamo data from the EPA rating tests. I believe the actual raw data is on page 25 of this PDF for the SR+ https://iaspub.epa.gov/otaqpub/display_file.jsp?docid=46584&flag=1
PhilRogers
Member
Fascinating. The bottom line is that everything seems to be functioning normally.
I recently drove from my home near Chicago to St. Louis. The car had me stop twice en route---to throw in a little charge here, then a little charge there, before I arrived at the destination. I have never actually driven the car from a 100% charge down to near zero to see waht real-world range I get. All I really have to base things on are daily use.
Your replies are the best I have ever received. A lot of people on this forum simply yelled at me and told me to read the manual, asked how I drove, asked if I used the heater, asked me the elevation I was driving at, asked me the temperature, and then yelled at me again. Thank you so much for your kindness. I'm really loving my car but I really want to understand it as well.
I feel exactly the same about AoA.
I feel exactly the same about AoA.
I have had my Model 3 for just over a year now. In general it is excellent, except that the battery capacity seems very low; by my calculations it is only around 44kWh (for example, a typical journey of 76.4mi @ 227 Wh/mi used 39% battery). I have measured the battery size a number of times, on a range of journeys, and always get a similar figure.
This seems very low to me, given that I was expecting a size of around 54kWh. I also don't know how I could ever get close to the WLTP range, even under the most benign of conditions. I have asked Tesla about this, but they say my battery is normal. Surely there must be some threshold below which a battery is deemed not to be to specification? A 20% loss of capacity (even allowing for some unusable battery) is surely unacceptable?
Has anyone else had a similar experience?
This seems very low to me, given that I was expecting a size of around 54kWh. I also don't know how I could ever get close to the WLTP range, even under the most benign of conditions. I have asked Tesla about this, but they say my battery is normal. Surely there must be some threshold below which a battery is deemed not to be to specification? A 20% loss of capacity (even allowing for some unusable battery) is surely unacceptable?
Has anyone else had a similar experience?
Fernand
Active Member
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
Y'all are some terribly inefficient drivers, then: What's your SR/+ single-charge distance record?
After almost 2 years with my 2019 SR+ (EPA range of 240), my lifetime average is 225 Wh/mi. 54 kWh / 0.225 kWh/mi= 240 miles.
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You probably never use your heater. When i drive during negative degrees battery freezes. And I am happy to get 330 Wh/mile efficiency. On pa turnpike speed limit is 70mph, everyone drives 80-90. At these speeds and cold temps its impossible to go below 300
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
Nope. I keep my cabin at 69 F, with both front seat heaters on in most cases. I usually run ~250-280 Wh/mi in the winter, but closer to 200 Wh/mi in the summer, so my lifetime average ends up at 225 Wh/mi.
I think speed and acceleration are the biggest factors; most highways around here are 55 MPH, so I'm usually going 60-65 MPH. And I'm on Autopilot 95% of the time.
I'm averaging about 245 Wh/mi, although I do a fair bit of motorway driving.
The point though, is that I expect the energy usage to vary depending on climate and driving conditions, hence I wouldn't expect to reach the EPA ratings. The problem is that the battery size, as measured by my Model 3 displays, is only 44kWh. If I had a 54kWh battery, as I expected, then I could still get a pretty good range from the car even at 245Wh/mi. As it is, my range is pretty dreadful.
Are other people having issues with low measured battery size? Or is it just me? In which case, I could safely assume there is a problem with the car that needs fixing.....
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
How exactly are you using the display to calculate battery capacity?
The BMS is only ever an estimate, and it can become uncalibrated rather quickly. Besides tapping into the canbus, the only surefire way I know to calculate capacity is driving.
Charge to 90%, drive to 70%. Check your trip meter and record miles and Wh/mi. Multiply miles by kWh/mi and divide by 0.2.
For e.g. if you go from 90% to 70% and drove 36 miles with an efficiency of 245 Wh/mi. 36 mi / 0.245 kWh/mi = 8.82 kWh. 8.82 kWh / 0.2 = 44.1 kWh. That would confirm your other observations.
Continue driving, calculating capacity this way at any milestone you like. 90-40% for 50% of the whole battery, 90-10% for 80% of the whole battery. The further you can go, the more accurate your estimate will be. I've never calculated less than 51 kWh as a full pack capacity for my 2019 SR+ using this method.
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