What settings to get ACC to behave more like a human on the highway?

[NewbieScoobie]

2 big issues:

1) I find that the car brakes both too early and too hard i.e. it slows down much more than required, sooner than required. Is there any way to set it to "eat" more of the distance with the car ahead of me before braking, and/or brake more gradually?

2) I find that the car waits way too long to re-accelerate whether the car in front of me speeds up or moves out of my lane. Is there any way to improve this?

 

[wraithfive]

I have a three step process you can follow to accomplish what you want. Notice I did not say a "simple" three step process. It's actually really challenging, but it's also the only way I know of.

Step 1: Become a software developer with a focus and expertise in AI and/or automotive systems
Step 2: Apply for and successfully obtain a job at Tesla on the FSD/Autopilot engineering team
Step 3: Implement changes in the software to make these things happen.

 

[tzbawss]

I have a three step process you can follow to accomplish what you want. Notice I did not say a "simple" three step process. It's actually really challenging, but it's also the only way I know of.

Step 1: Become a software developer with a focus and expertise in AI and/or automotive systems
Step 2: Apply for a job at Tesla
Step 3: Implement changes in the software to make these things happen.

I am very smart.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

2 big issues:

1) I find that the car brakes both too early and too hard i.e. it slows down much more than required, sooner than required. Is there any way to set it to "eat" more of the distance with the car ahead of me before braking, and/or brake more gradually?

2) I find that the car waits way too long to re-accelerate whether the car in front of me speeds up or moves out of my lane. Is there any way to improve this?

No, there is no way to address these issues through configuration in the car.

It just does that. It's really quite bad. Believe it or not, it's somewhat smoother than it used to be. But still unacceptably rapid application of the brakes and regen, rather than easing it in gradually to minimize jerk, like a human driver would do. Happens all the time.

I just completed a 2600-mile round trip (I've done several long trips before too), and there's no question there is a lot of room for improvement. My wife mostly wanted me to take over, which I often did in situations where I thought the system would need to brake. If any slowing is required, it's often best to disengage the system and do it yourself!

Not a single phantom braking event though!

It's quite mysterious why Tesla hasn't properly addressed this - even in situations where it's likely not a sensor capability issue, it's often unacceptably poor in the jerk component of the deceleration profile (it's usually not the magnitude of the deceleration that matters - it's the rate of change of the acceleration/deceleration (jerk) that your body really feels which is uncomfortable). But then again if you use your windshield washer too much, it will pop up a message saying poor weather is detected and Navigate on Autopilot is unavailable, so clearly they have some software limitations.

 

[wraithfive]

If any slowing is required, it's often best to disengage the system and do it yourself!

Agreed. Especially for things like spotting a traffic jam up ahead. It's actually not bad if it's already close behind another car and just following, but it always wants to drive right up to stopped traffic and then brake HARD at the very last second otherwise.

I stick to my original reply as to the only way OP can make changes to it though.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Agreed. Especially for things like spotting a traffic jam up ahead. It's actually not bad if it's already close behind another car and just following, but it always wants to drive right up to stopped traffic and then brake HARD at the very last second otherwise.

I stick to my original reply as to the only way OP can make changes to it though.

100% agree. That is definitely the best way to address this issue.

 

[NewbieScoobie]

I have a three step process you can follow to accomplish what you want. Notice I did not say a "simple" three step process. It's actually really challenging, but it's also the only way I know of.

Step 1: Become a software developer with a focus and expertise in AI and/or automotive systems
Step 2: Apply for and successfully obtain a job at Tesla on the FSD/Autopilot engineering team
Step 3: Implement changes in the software to make these things happen.

The even simpler (and easy) process is simply to not use TACC.

No, there is no way to address these issues through configuration in the car.

It just does that. It's really quite bad. Believe it or not, it's somewhat smoother than it used to be. But still unacceptably rapid application of the brakes and regen, rather than easing it in gradually to minimize jerk, like a human driver would do. Happens all the time.

I just completed a 2600-mile round trip (I've done several long trips before too), and there's no question there is a lot of room for improvement. My wife mostly wanted me to take over, which I often did in situations where I thought the system would need to brake. If any slowing is required, it's often best to disengage the system and do it yourself!

Not a single phantom braking event though!

It's quite mysterious why Tesla hasn't properly addressed this - even in situations where it's likely not a sensor capability issue, it's often unacceptably poor in the jerk component of the deceleration profile (it's usually not the magnitude of the deceleration that matters - it's the rate of change of the acceleration/deceleration (jerk) that your body really feels which is uncomfortable). But then again if you use your windshield washer too much, it will pop up a message saying poor weather is detected and Navigate on Autopilot is unavailable, so clearly they have some software limitations.

Bizarre how bad it is compared to the ACC on everything from econoboxes to Porsches.

 

[wraithfive]

The even simpler (and easy) process is simply to not use TACC.

Not really. That doesn't give the OP a way to change any of the things they wished to change.

Bizarre how bad it is compared to the ACC on everything from econoboxes to Porsches.

Having used it on several models over the years, I can attest that Tesla's is no worse than most. Subaru eyesight on a 2020 Legacy, a vision based system I will note, has been the best I've ever used. I can only hope that Tesla's switch to vision will improve things.

 

[NewbieScoobie]

Not really. That doesn't give the OP a way to change any of the things they wished to change.

Having used it on several models over the years, I can attest that Tesla's is no worse than most. Subaru eyesight on a 2020 Legacy, a vision based system I will note, has been the best I've ever used. I can only hope that Tesla's switch to vision will improve things.

I am the OP

And yes. It's spectacularly worse than ACC on other cars. Just rented a Jeep Patriot(?) An absolute POS yet the ACC worked great. Sold my Porsche recently. It's ACC was amazing (though Innodrive is terrible). Have an MDX. ACC works great.

 

[animorph]

2 big issues:

1) I find that the car brakes both too early and too hard i.e. it slows down much more than required, sooner than required. Is there any way to set it to "eat" more of the distance with the car ahead of me before braking, and/or brake more gradually?

2) I find that the car waits way too long to re-accelerate whether the car in front of me speeds up or moves out of my lane. Is there any way to improve this?

1) This has varied quite a bit as software revisions are rolled out. Hope for better. Try adjusting the following distance and try Chill mode and see if that has any effect. I'd love to see it glide to a stop using regen, like I'm used to. Unfortunately, not everyone will like it the same way and Tesla doesn't like to create tons of settings options. I've been pretty happy with 2021.4.18.11.

2) This is pretty easy. Just hit the accelerator as much as, and when, you want. The car stays in TACC, so there is no penalty for goosing it along a little early and making it accelerate more quickly. This behavior is also better now compared to previous versions. If only it would learn the driver's preferences.

 

[avs007]

I am the OP

And yes. It's spectacularly worse than ACC on other cars. Just rented a Jeep Patriot(?) An absolute POS yet the ACC worked great. Sold my Porsche recently. It's ACC was amazing (though Innodrive is terrible). Have an MDX. ACC works great.

I have an MDX too... That thing gives me phantom braking a lot. There is one spot where I can reproduce it 100%, as there is a curve with a light pole at the apex of the curve. Thankfully, our vision only model Y does not phantom brake in that location. I don't think i've ever been in a car, where ACC acceleration does not lag. I usually just press the accelerator manually to bring it up to speed, then release the accelerator.

 

[avs007]

Agreed. Especially for things like spotting a traffic jam up ahead. It's actually not bad if it's already close behind another car and just following, but it always wants to drive right up to stopped traffic and then brake HARD at the very last second otherwise.

In my experience, this scenario is a lot worse on radar based ACC. Most every radar based ACC I've seen (including Tesla) has some verbiage saying that it cannot detect stationary objects, and that there is a minimum speed that said objects must be moving before it can be detected. This is because of the resolution of radar, and that it cant really differentiate a fixed object in the street from a fixed object above/side of the street. So in many different radar based cars, I've experienced it completely missed detecting stopped cars, but it will detect very slowly moving cars.

 

[Twiglett]

you think its bad just on basic AP
You should try enabling the traffic light features, it brakes really hard for lights all the time. Then on green creeps away, leaving a huge gap to the car in front. I keep that turned off now.
If FSD drives like this we will all end up carsick.
Assuming FSD ever ships as something other than beta.

 

[avs007]

you think its bad just on basic AP
You should try enabling the traffic light features, it brakes really hard for lights all the time. Then on green creeps away, leaving a huge gap to the car in front. I keep that turned off now.
If FSD drives like this we will all end up carsick.
Assuming FSD ever ships as something other than beta.

Honestly I don't see how they are ever going to achieve true full self driving without cross-view cameras... How is the car supposed to make right turns on busy streets if it has no idea if any cars are approaching from the side?

 

[DaveG_NJ]

Agreed. Especially for things like spotting a traffic jam up ahead. It's actually not bad if it's already close behind another car and just following, but it always wants to drive right up to stopped traffic and then brake HARD at the very last second otherwise.

I stick to my original reply as to the only way OP can make changes to it though.

I'll admit I've become more pessimistic about FSD, more based on actually using NoA than on Elon's delays. Maybe it's solvable over time, but it is no where close to being able to drive well as a human does. As you point out, it fails to take a long view of the road. The human brain can receive and interpret complex, varied, 360º situational inputs far better than the car's computer. The above example is a good one - the car is reactive, and not at all predictive.

I see the same thing on the highway - the car drives happily in the right lane approaching a on-ramp with a string of cars coming round the curve. My human brain can intuit, based on perceived speed, that the cars will merge just as we are astride them, and that the second car in the line is riding the bumper of the car in front of him - he's likely to cross three lanes the first chance he gets. I decide to move over a lane and speed up to get ahead of them before they merge.

In the same situation, the HW3 computer thinks: "Nothing directly in front. Maintain 75 mph".

 

[wraithfive]

I'll admit I've become more pessimistic about FSD, more based on actually using NoA than on Elon's delays. Maybe it's solvable over time, but it is no where close to being able to drive well as a human does. As you point out, it fails to take a long view of the road. The human brain can receive and interpret complex, varied, 360º situational inputs far better than the car's computer. The above example is a good one - the car is reactive, and not at all predictive.

I see the same thing on the highway - the car drives happily in the right lane approaching a on-ramp with a string of cars coming round the curve. My human brain can intuit, based on perceived speed, that the cars will merge just as we are astride them, and that the second car in the line is riding the bumper of the car in front of him - he's likely to cross three lanes the first chance he gets. I decide to move over a lane and speed up to get ahead of them before they merge.

In the same situation, the HW3 computer thinks: "Nothing directly in front. Maintain 75 mph".

This is why I don't think we will get true FSD in the sense we can totally ignore it and do other things, until ALL cars have it and they can communicate with each other and that most everyone is using it and not manual driving. Then all the cars can make optimal plans based on knowledge of what each others destination and short term plans are.

 

[PackMan730]

When I drive my 2017 Lexus Rx350 with the auto cruise control, the car jerks when other cars do a hard stop in front, and speeds up very slowly when they start moving which causes cars behind to get upset and move around to cut me off. If my wife is in the car, I can't use the auto cruise control because she gets motion sickness. I'm assuming the Tesla will do a much better job than the Lexus, right? Or will it be like my Lexus?

 

[Twiglett]

When I drive my 2017 Lexus Rx350 with the auto cruise control, the car jerks when other cars do a hard stop in front, and speeds up very slowly when they start moving which causes cars behind to get upset and move around to cut me off. If my wife is in the car, I can't use the auto cruise control because she gets motion sickness. I'm assuming the Tesla will do a much better job than the Lexus, right? Or will it be like my Lexus?

I find autopilot pretty good on the highway, its mostly confident. Setting a longer follow distance (like 7) really helps smooth it out.
Some people get really annoyed at folks pulling into the gap it leaves when you do that, but I really don't care. Its not that important to me.
I know some folks who get so annoyed that they have it set on 1 or 2, but that just makes the car brake harder so makes it worse not better.

 

[tls]

Not really. That doesn't give the OP a way to change any of the things they wished to change.

Having used it on several models over the years, I can attest that Tesla's is no worse than most. Subaru eyesight on a 2020 Legacy, a vision based system I will note, has been the best I've ever used. I can only hope that Tesla's switch to vision will improve things.

I owned an AP1 Model S for 5 years. It was much, much smoother.

 

[spokey]

No, there is no way to address these issues through configuration in the car.

It just does that. It's really quite bad. Believe it or not, it's somewhat smoother than it used to be. But still unacceptably rapid application of the brakes and regen, rather than easing it in gradually to minimize jerk, like a human driver would do. Happens all the time.

I just completed a 2600-mile round trip (I've done several long trips before too), and there's no question there is a lot of room for improvement. My wife mostly wanted me to take over, which I often did in situations where I thought the system would need to brake. If any slowing is required, it's often best to disengage the system and do it yourself!

Not a single phantom braking event though!

It's quite mysterious why Tesla hasn't properly addressed this - even in situations where it's likely not a sensor capability issue, it's often unacceptably poor in the jerk component of the deceleration profile (it's usually not the magnitude of the deceleration that matters - it's the rate of change of the acceleration/deceleration (jerk) that your body really feels which is uncomfortable). But then again if you use your windshield washer too much, it will pop up a message saying poor weather is detected and Navigate on Autopilot is unavailable, so clearly they have some software limitations.

My wife's camry is about the same. Really annoying. I always figured it was because the car manufactures figured most americans drive that way.