What's your predicted loyalty to Tesla whenever replacing current car?

[OrbiterTI4]

Zero. We have a VW ID.4 on order for this summer (will probably do a 3 yr lease since I believe they will greatly boost features available after this initial rollout) to compare to our Tesla experiences, and my coworker who bought a MY earlier this spring is also wanting to see how our experiences line up.

 

[BigNick]

Unknown at this point.

There are arguments for and against all choices. When I'm ready to pull the trigger on a new car, I'll have to check based on what is actually available. As of right now, there are no new Model S cars available and there may not be for several months.

EA is way behind Tesla in terms of its charging network buildout which limits long-distance travel for non-Tesla EVs - Tesla has enjoyed nearly a decade head start.

But Tesla's stonewalling and other mistreatment of customers is a huge minus. So is the under-delivery on promises, going all the way back to "691 HP", "85 kWh", etc. When I buy a gallon of gasoline, I expect a full gallon. Not 120 ounces or some approximation of a gallon. Same thing for HP and kWh.

 

[TessP100D]

My 2020 Performance is my second Model 3 (first totaled). It will almost certainly be my last Tesla.

As they have transitioned to a much larger company, customer service is in the toilet. Unfortunately I have had to deal with issues and Telsa has been less than stellar to deal with.

Second reason is that as I'm getting more miles on these cars, I'm becoming more annoyed with build quality. The squeaks and rattles get worse daily. Things get looser. The rattly sound when I close the door gets more annoying.

But I feel like the biggest reason related to Tesla only is that Tesla seems to have given up on improving the car. I feel like the huge "double fire" Christmas update that was more like a dumpster fire took all the wind out of their sails. And I feel like they are concentrating on FSD which to me is now a fool's errand. Clearly they are finally coming to grips with how difficult L3/L4/L5 really is. And the harder they work on it seemingly the more resources are diverted from the "features addition" team. When I bought my first Model 3 at the end of 2018, until the end of 2020, the amount of features added was staggering. Video players, video games, more streaming services, acceleration boosts, smart summon, Joe Mode, TeslaCam, and on and on. Really, there was huge value to that. Since Christmas 2020? NOTHING.

Finally, there is the competition to discuss. There is still nothing like the performance of a Model 3 dual motor for the cost. There just isn't. But now, there are way more compelling EV's out there. I like the looks of the Mustang a LOT. The Etron GT is drop dead gorgeous. The Taycan Cross Tourismo; an EV wagon? Sign me UP! The Merc EQS looks like it will absolutely PANTS a Model S in every way except outright performance, and seemingly for similar cost. The iD4 is a compelling lower cost entry as well. And the Huyndai Ioniq 5. God damn that thing looks like an 80's Lancia rally car reincarnated 40 years later. WOOF. And don't get me started on the Rivian R1T. If that thing becomes real, I might leg hump it. LOL. The Polestar looks pretty tasty too.

So yeah, this will almost certainly be my last Tesla. Sadly, because I really root for them. I'm so glad to see they are succeeding, but I feel like the house of cards that is FSD is slowly draining all the life out of the company. I really wish, honestly, that they had never gone down that route. They have hitched their wagon to that horse but I don't think they ever needed to. We would have bought the cars anyway with just EAP. I did, and I was super happy! While people on here really think it's cool I think of those half a million cars they sold last year, less than 100k of the owners probably cared about FSD. Is there data on the take rate?

Anyway, rambling rant over. I'll keep driving my Model 3 for now but I'm already mentally shopping it's replacement. The kids will miss the YouTube and the Farts, and I'll miss the Supercharging network on longer drives. But that's not enough to keep me around.

Thank you for your post.

 

[vapor trail]

Interesting replies all around. Getting sense most of us are heading toward future choices with eyes wide open. I've been a huge fan of Tesla. A shift in the right direction in how they handle customers on the service end would go a long way to maintain repeat customers on the sales floor. I hopefully have many years left with current ride to see how things play out (I really wish they'd engineer a permanent fix for the half shaft issue!). I expect the competition within the EV market to be quite fierce whenever it comes time to trade in my car (right now that Porsche Taycan Turismo has my attention). Time will tell!

 

[pabla]

After owning two Model S' one 2014 and one 2021 (current car) I will not be returning to the brand. I place a huge emphasis on how the company treats its customers and from my past experiences and others Tesla has some really poor business practices. On top of that their cars feel slapped together with cheap parts and seeing how older gen owners are experiences mass issues with MCU and battery issues it makes me wonder if my 2021 will be the same in a few years.

I can give Tesla props for their value proposition, on paper it looks like they sell some of the best cars (not just EVs) but in practice the car does not live up to all the hype. I have no hate towards the brand but once you've owned one for a long period of time you begin to see past the honeymoon stages of ownership and being to realize the big issues within the brand.

 

[SmartElectric]

My wife says her 2013 Model S is the best car ever, and she said that yesterday, not a few years ago.
Aside: I do all the maintenance (what little is needed).

My Cybertruck reservation will either replace her S (unlikely she will part with it) or my Smart Electric.
If there was another EV option that was bullet proof, paintless, scratch proof, 800 km range, 3s to 100 km/h with 14000 lbs towing in the large vehicle space, I'd like to know.

But yeah, sticking with Tesla. Mercedes have been clueless on EV's. I've owned two different generations of Smart ED, it shows how ridiculously poor Daimler engineering can be, they can't even get the simple things right, car door has to be opened to "wake up" the car, ie, it doesn't support charging during off peak late at night without physical intervention. I wish Ford well, the Mach-e looks like a hit.

 

[Ofarlig]

I am not brand loyal but right now there are few compelling options for me. Either the tech sucks, the range/charging speed sucks or the performance sucks and any combination of all three. Having a hard time finding an EV where I could actually go on a ski trip without having to sit there rolling my thumbs for an extra 40 minutes while charging compared to the new 3 or S… Would be okay with a Polestar 2 or something similar if it wasn’t for the range and charging speeds.

Had the S before, now with a 3 and was going to switch back to the S now with the refresh. Landed on getting another 3 instead for now even though I prefer the S, the S is too big atm and I cannot be bothered finding a new parking spot in a garage where the S will fit.

 

[Hank42]

10 years on my S. Will buy another when needed so long as they have a replacement that meets my requirements. None of this "single screen" baloney. Sure hope the 2030 model S still ahs 2 screens!(or HUD!)

 

[Needsdecaf]

I will add this:

I have a friend who is also a forum member here. He has owned multiple EV's not a Tesla, and also owned 5 Teslas. Two Model S's, one lemoned Model X, the Model X replacement, and a Model 3 Performance.

He sold his M3P for a Taycan and when his wife's lease was up on her X, they moved on from that as well to a PHEV SUV. I believe her quote was "I'm done paying for the experiment" or something similar.

This is coming from someone who has a huge solar array, 4 plus power walls, and still has a Chevy Bolt. If someone with that much Tesla history and buy in can simply walk away, you know Tesla is not doing what they need to do in order to retain customers.

 

[dortor4ev]

I'm more of a fan of EV's than I am of Tesla - I'm willing to follow who ever makes a great EV - and frankly since 2013 Tesla's have never been great - but they were good enough when they were the only EV - I welcome choice & competition - but based on Tesla's history I doubt they will rise to the occasion - the only reason they are still around is not a Testimate to their abilities, but rather an indictment of the existing industries incompetence - we'll see where we're at in 5-7 years…

but I look forward to a wide range of non-Tesla EV's - it always had to be this way for EV's to succeed it was never going to be a single vendor strategy of EV's were to become main stream.

 

[demundus]

have one tesla, always wanted another until they continued to screw over their owner base in favor of selling more cars. At this point im not sure i want to be an early adopter of another EV, so ill likely return to ICE. especially considering i barely drive anywhere anymore. The service and sales experience on our Cayenne was top notch, and we've maybe filled the tank 10 times in 2 years.

 

[mvotb]

Zero

 

[Wol747]

As one who has watched Tesla since before the roadster, approve of Musk's 3-stage plan to develop an affordable EV and lead the way to renewable transport and bought a Model S last year I suppose you could call me a fan.
However, Tesla is now thought of as a tech, not car company. The tech part as regards the BMS, charging structure and so on is world leading but the accessory part (infotainment, display etc are pretty poor). The emphasis on games and farts is embarassing. And along the way customer service seems to have been relegated to the lowest priority.
A friend of mine who bought a new Mercedes hybrid a fortnight ago found it immovable the next week: it's been in the dealer's shop since then while they work out what's wrong with it, so Tesla isn't alone.
I agree with others that the obsession with FSD is killing the idea that cars are for transport from A to B NOW, not automatically in ten years time. It will be a shame if the original market instigator just lets others catch up and surpass the marque.

 

[dgatwood]

It depends on what happens in the intervening time. My 2017 Model X is reaching the end of its main warranty, with a good bit left on the drivetrain warranty. So far, I've needed a new window regulator (plus another regulator and window because of a break-in, but that doesn't count), a door actuator (same door), and recalls, plus bad software issues with the MCU (MCU 1 is kind of a disaster), new tires, and a misassembled fitting that caused the coolant system to fail early on, but otherwise, it has been mechanically fine.

So basically other than them screwing up the assembly a bit, it has been pretty much average reliability-wise compared with other cars. I love the power. I love the AutoPilot capabilities. I hate the price of the X, and if the Y hadn't been well over two years away at the time, I would have waited. I definitely can't see myself buying another X, but I might consider a Y or a Cybertruck.

But the big question is whether the AutoPilot functionality is industry-leading at the time, on par with what everybody else offers, or falling behind. If city street driving is robust and the car can basically drive itself by the time I decide to upgrade, and if nobody else is similarly far along or farther, then another Tesla would be a no-brainer. If things are still basically stuck where they are, or if other cars are comparable, it's a toss-up. If other companies have pulled way ahead, it would mostly be a matter of what the non-Tesla HVDC charging picture looks like by then.

 

[DaveG_NJ]

Depends on timing. If I had to replace it today, I'd probably go with the Mach-E (certainly over the ID.4 based on Sandy Munro's reviews). I've owned three Audis and I'd never go near the four circles of hell again.

But it's likely to be a different world in a few years. No telling what will be available.

 

[Newscutter]

I forgot to mention that there's another factor that weighs on me-- particularly this week:

When I bought my car, I did so mainly because I thought it was a "Model T" moment; a chance to be among the first to experience something revolutionary and vote with my dollars to ensure it took hold, for variety of reasons and enjoy "pioneering" and introducing people to this new-fangled bizarre thing. The ownership community was enthusiastic but still humble since Superchargers and Autopilot were in their infancy and not available yet-- especially in my area. I started a blog, I wrote for Teslarati now and then, and I did a few videos-- Not nearly enough, apparently, as I left a lot of money on the table... but I'm a video editor by trade and doing video in my off-hours was/is not an appealing use of my R&R time! But I digress... The people I met were eager to learn about the cars and the we received a lot of joy by sharing our experiences with others and being approachable.

Since then, the ownership community has been hijacked (IMO) by the YouTuber/fanbois who pimped their referral codes to strangers, refused to EVER concede on ANY point that was negative about the cars/company and would shout down even the most documented and valid criticism. They were rewarded and enriched for this, with their "Adsence dollars" and free referral Roadsters (allegedly "coming soon"). The smugness, condescending attitudes and outright GLOATING about things like the current gas pipeline news combined with a really cult-like fanaticism over FSD/Robotaxis and other cringe-inducing behaviors like the backseat "Lavish lifestyle" dude arrested this week.... Get a grip, people... have you ZERO self-awareness?? This is your aspirational pitch to grow the brand??

And don't forget all the TSLA v TSLAQ fighting that gets all nutty with "FUD" accusations thrown about like they're the deepest insult on your character when you simply relayed a fact or experience. I've been accounted on both sides as an enemy at various times, causing me much frustration as I value my personal integrity.

ANYWAY:
I am, frankly, very embarrassed to be associated-- even by proxy-- with many of my fellow Tesla owners as a result. Reputation of the community is a HUGE part of how car purchases are made as we easily become self-identified with that community and judged by our purchase decisions; what will people assume based on what you drive? How will you be treated in traffic or parking lots?
Teslas now come with a lot more unwanted baggage than they did in 2014.

Fortunately, this toxicity does not appear to be common in my area, based on my interactions as local FB group admin. I do have to debunk a few myths now and then and/or reinforce some objectivity and humility with (typically) newer owners still in their honeymoon phase... but I hope by doing so I can revert the tone back to what it was before. I wish others would do the same.

We're the veterans. We're supposed to be voice of reason/rationality/perspective in the face of ignorant or irrational exuberance.
I wish there were more viable alternatives to spark greater humility and a broadening of the demographics through competitive pressure, though that does risk binary us/them rivalries.... so maybe it'd be worse?

I guess I'm just dismayed that 7 years later the best replacement for my car remains: my car... and seeing my fellow owners online has become more and more like an awkward family Thanksgiving that I wish I had a better excuse for not attending.

 

[cduzz]

I've got an early 2016 90d that I got 2 years ago (from tesla). I use it mostly for city driving, sometimes for medium distance driving (100 miles each way) and very occasionally for long distance road trips.

My car's been of tolerable reliability; some door issues, a headlight and tail lamp filled with water, I think the air suspension has a leak somewhere because the suspension pump runs on a bit too often, the MCU crashed constantly until I took the car out of power saving mode (now it occasionally is wonky).

I love the car; I love that it goes when I hit the accelerator, it has plenty of room, and is quite comfortable. I dislike how big it is, and the groaning and creaking when the steering is all the way in one or the other direction is .. concerning. It's also hard to see out of, hard to get into and out of, and my wife thinks it is claustrophobic (metal roof). Musk is a goon, Tesla is sketchy, the earlier S platform is basically a public beta test.

So -- my use is entirely within the realm of *any* other EV that can go 200 miles in a day. For now, I wouldn't consider anything but a Tesla entirely because of the supercharger network.

Play this game:

• Load a better route planner
• plan any trip between where you are and where you might want to go.
• change the car from a tesla to a non-tesla and have it re-run the trip

Observe that any EV not able to use the supercharger network likely has a much worse route than that's able to use the supercharger network, and will possibly take much longer on that trip.

So, I'm not really interested in owning a glorious city car. I'm okay with some compromises in making road trips, but there are limits. As such, I'm pretty sure that my next car will be a Tesla. Or an ICE.

 

[Ofarlig]

Play this game:

• Load a better route planner
• plan any trip between where you are and where you might want to go.
• change the car from a tesla to a non-tesla and have it re-run the trip

I did exactly this as I was looking at getting a Polestar 2 to try something different. Let’s just say that the Tesla doesn’t require me to stop more often than I normally would but the Polestar definitely would. All of a sudden I needed a lot more stops and longer stops in general which to me would become a hassle. When I am going to or from the mountains to go skiing I don’t want to have an extra stop of 40 minutes to just roll my thumbs on.

 

[cduzz]

I did exactly this as I was looking at getting a Polestar 2 to try something different. Let’s just say that the Tesla doesn’t require me to stop more often than I normally would but the Polestar definitely would. All of a sudden I needed a lot more stops and longer stops in general which to me would become a hassle. When I am going to or from the mountains to go skiing I don’t want to have an extra stop of 40 minutes to just roll my thumbs on.

I find all these "it takes X minutes to charge to 90% in this car and Y minutes to charge to 90% in that car" odd.

I use a car to get from one place to another. Tell me how long it takes to do that; I'm not interested in the specifics of how that happens (IE I don't give a hoot about charge time as a singular metric).

On a semi-related note, I had to take my wife's car to pour some stinky fluid into the stink-hole in the back of the car. The whole process was barbaric. I had to put a plastic card into the dispenser kiosk, then stand there holding the dispenser wand the whole time. I had to drive 5 minutes out of my way to go to one of these ghettos of stink dispensing. The filth was nauseating. The whole process reminded me of peeing in an alley behind the bar.

The car is pretty terrible too; you hit the accelerator and the car thinks for a while then some solenoids flap around and some fluid shunts around while some insane explosion device re-calibrates itself to the new power demand. It must have taken a 1/2 a second between when I hit the accelerator before the thing decided to actually accelerate. And the noise, it was like listening to 1,000 math teachers clearing their throats at once.

 

[JimmyB]

@cduzz, both your posts above articulate my sentiments exactly (except for the roof part - I love my pano roof). I considered the ID4, Mach E etc but the ABRP game underscored that, at least for now, Tesla was the only option.

Haven just driven 1,100 miles from DC to SW FL, and about to do the same in the other direction, unless someone else has a charging / range breakthrough in the next 12 months my next car will almost certainly be an early P100D with FUSC - if I can find one. I knew about the reduced charging speed when I bought my car, and if you can start a long trip at 100% it’s manageable, but I sure would like to be able to supercharge just that little bit quicker.