When will the Model Y be unveiled?

[11thIndian]

Well, a lot more Model Y news today that any of us where probably expecting. Though no unveiling date.

• Model Y is NOT going to be built on the same platform as the Model 3, a new platform with reduced wiring
• production start optimistically later 2019 or more likely 2020
• Model Y production line will be next generation, more efficient and automated than Model 3.

...and here's Electrek's article on the news-

Tesla Model Y: Elon Musk says electric crossover coming in ‘late 2019 or 2020’ on new platform

Who knows what motivated the change to a new platform- but that unquestionably played a part in the new rollout schedule. But the new production line may mean the production ramp happens faster- so maybe it will kind of balance out.

Still hoping for a April or at the latest Fall 2018 reveal.

 

[Saghost]

Well, a lot more Model Y news today that any of us where probably expecting. Though no unveiling date.

• Model Y is NOT going to be built on the same platform as the Model 3, a new platform with reduced wiring
• production start optimistically later 2019 or more likely 2020
• Model Y production line will be next generation, more efficient and automated than Model 3.

...and here's Electrek's article on the news-

Tesla Model Y: Elon Musk says electric crossover coming in ‘late 2019 or 2020’ on new platform

Who knows what motivated the change to a new platform- but that unquestionably played a part in the new rollout schedule. But the new production line may mean the production ramp happens faster- so maybe it will kind of balance out.

Still hoping for a April or at the latest Fall 2018 reveal.

Huh. No 12V system - or at least no 12V battery?

I'm not sure how that possible to do safely. If something causes the HV contactors to open, isolating the main pack, how do you recover the car?

J1772 requires the car to take action before receiving mains power, so just plugging it in doesn't seem viable - unless Tesla can get enough energy off of the pilot signal safely to run the computer enough to command the EVSE and unlock AC power?

 

[ecarfan]

On the earnings call, Elon did not say that the Model Y would not have a separate battery from the main pack, he only said that the car systems that would normally run on 12V will run on a different, and presumably higher, voltage.

 

[S'toon]

Hmmm. If Model Y is on a new platform, and not the 3, could it be based on another platform in the works? Say, the Tesla pickup?

 

[11thIndian]

Hmmm. If Model Y is on a new platform, and not the 3, could it be based on another platform in the works? Say, the Tesla pickup?

It's possible I suppose, but honestly I'd think that the larger Model X would share more in common with the pickup than the supposedly smaller cSUV form of the Model Y.

 

[Daliman]

He spoke of a gigafactory for the Y. Freemont will be at capacity from S3X. They are going to have to build the factory, it will be next generation and build a next generation platform. Delay due to factory redsign at the same time.

 

[Bangor Bob]

Huh. No 12V system - or at least no 12V battery?

I'm not sure how that possible to do safely. If something causes the HV contactors to open, isolating the main pack, how do you recover the car?

J1772 requires the car to take action before receiving mains power, so just plugging it in doesn't seem viable - unless Tesla can get enough energy off of the pilot signal safely to run the computer enough to command the EVSE and unlock AC power?

48V is the "new" low-power automotive standard, but everyone's afraid to go first. Maybe Tesla will.
Hyundai uses a small segment of their traction battery for the 12V power source, no lead/acid battery.

Getting either 12V or 48V out of a Tesla traction battery while leaving the HV contactors open should be possible - may need to rejigger the pack architecture a little to do it. I'm kinda surprised they didn't do it for the X, and you'd think it would have been an obvious thing to do on the 3 to reduce complexity and part count. (Along with using the drive inverter as the A/C charger...)

 

[ohmman]

Hmmm. If Model Y is on a new platform, and not the 3, could it be based on another platform in the works? Say, the Tesla pickup?

It's going to be the semi platform. The Model Y will support a Class V hitch, towing up to 12k lbs. (sarcasm)

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Well, a lot more Model Y news today that any of us where probably expecting. Though no unveiling date.

• Model Y is NOT going to be built on the same platform as the Model 3, a new platform with reduced wiring
• production start optimistically later 2019 or more likely 2020
• Model Y production line will be next generation, more efficient and automated than Model 3.

...and here's Electrek's article on the news-

Tesla Model Y: Elon Musk says electric crossover coming in ‘late 2019 or 2020’ on new platform

Who knows what motivated the change to a new platform- but that unquestionably played a part in the new rollout schedule. But the new production line may mean the production ramp happens faster- so maybe it will kind of balance out.

Still hoping for a April or at the latest Fall 2018 reveal.

Interesting news. Thanks for sharing.

It is possible they announced this in part to make sure Model Y does not Osborne any Model 3 sales. Late 2019 or 2020 basically puts it one lease cycle removed from current buyers (I guess three years is a fairly normal ownership cycle for premium cars anyway). For the rest of the world - when you add the usual Tesla delays and mandatory 6-12 months of ~California-first deliveries) - this may even mean 2021.

The evolution beyond the 12V battery certainly is understandable and interesting news. I guess they are planning some very simple (physically speaking that is) bus that basically takes power and data to all the components of the car perhaps in a single wire or a pair. Even in architectures such as MOST which are kind of very simple and nice by themselves, you still need CAN and power separate from the optical cable, which in the end leading to not one, but at least half a dozen wires going to each such device. The amount of cable goes up quite fast...

It seems to me Tesla changed their plans on the Model Y, though. It was originally announced as something they'd make on the Model 3 platform, but now it seems to have moved to the next generation. Probably Tesla streamlining the operation to focus on Model 3 and its ramp-up for the next few years.

Personally, I am fairly certain I will buy a new car before 2020-2021. A new secondary car seems very likely or I might even replace the X by then. So that is a significant chunk of time from now to Model Y. Given that Model 3 seems to be turning out a sedan, so not very versatile in that sense, it will certainly give the competition an opportunity here. All the more reason for me to think the Model 3 should have been a sportish hatchback like Model S...

 

[Model 3]

The evolution beyond the 12V battery certainly is understandable and interesting news. I guess they are planning some very simple (physically speaking that is) bus that basically takes power and data to all the components of the car perhaps in a single wire or a pair. Even in architectures such as MOST which are kind of very simple and nice by themselves, you still need CAN and power separate from the optical cable, which in the end leading to not one, but at least half a dozen wires going to each such device. The amount of cable goes up quite fast...

Tesla (TSLA) Q1 2017 Results - Earnings Call Transcript | Seeking Alpha

Elon Reeve Musk - Tesla Motors, Inc.

I think I've given this example before, but it's just one example, but the wiring harness on Model S is about 3 kilometers in length. The wire harness on Model 3 is 1.5 kilometers in length. The wiring harness on Model Y will be 100 meters. And that's a redundant wiring harness.

Martin Viecha - Redburn (Europe) Ltd.

Okay.

Elon Reeve Musk - Tesla Motors, Inc.

It's not really a wiring harness, it's basically a flex harness with a high DataRay bus, so you can put everything on a higher DataRay bus that isn't a CAN bus where your DataRay is massively constrained. And we'll also make changes to the vestigial voltage so not everything's 12 volts, which is a pretty absurd number, really it's wrong for everything.

 

[Saghost]

Tesla (TSLA) Q1 2017 Results - Earnings Call Transcript | Seeking Alpha

Interesting. I don't trust Seeking Alpha for much, but presumably they won't edit a transcript like that one.

Elon didn't say no more 12V in that transcript, though - or no more small battery. Paraphrasing, all I saw in your quote was "there will be some things in the car connected with wiring that isn't high voltage or 12V."

That, and I apparently need to read up on Dataray networks.

 

[Model 3]

I don't trust Seeking Alpha for much, ...

Agreed. But their transcripts seems to be OK.

 

[EinSV]

Agreed. But their transcripts seems to be OK.

Unfortunately in the past the transcripts posted on SA have had significant errors. I wouldn't rely on them for anything important.

 

[Model 3]

Unfortunately in the past the transcripts posted on SA have had significant errors. I wouldn't rely on them for anything important.

Ok? I have not observed this, but thanks for the information.

 

[boaterva]

The only errors (or omissions, perhaps) I've ever seen are where the transcriber can't make some mumble out and it's tagged with the timestamp so you can try to interpret yourself. I'm not aware, either, of actual inaccuracies and I listened to all except the last minute or so of yesterday's call.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

So, previous info was:

- Model Y will have falcon wings (Elon Musk hints at Tesla Model Y with falcon-wing doors)
- Model Y will be based on Model 3 (I believe this was said by Elon/Tesla at some previous date)

I speculated elsewhere that what if Tesla decided against falcon wings and thus scrapped the current-gen (Model 3 based) Model Y and moved to the next-generation instead, without falcon wings.

Personally I would not be surprised to see falcon wings on the Tesla minibus (or concepts like that) but not on other future Tesla cars.

 

[EinSV]

The only errors (or omissions, perhaps) I've ever seen are where the transcriber can't make some mumble out and it's tagged with the timestamp so you can try to interpret yourself. I'm not aware, either, of actual inaccuracies and I listened to all except the last minute or so of yesterday's call.

The errors go far beyond this sort of minor mistake. For example, Seeking Alpha's Q4 earnings call transcript misquoted Elon Musk in at least two places, leading to a series of erroneous articles being published, including one by Motley Fool's Daniel Sparks. The mistakes are so extreme they are either gross incompetence or worse IMO.

To his credit, Mr. Sparks corrected his article after SA's error was pointed out.

2017 Investor Roundtable:General Discussion

2017 Investor Roundtable:General Discussion

I have also observed serious errors on other occasions. If there is anything important I would find a better source or listen to the audio because SA's transcripts are totally unreliable.

 

[boaterva]

Interesting! As I said, I did listen to the call live so I hope I'd recognize any substantial differences. Those transcript issues you cite are pretty bad, I agree.

Anyone have a better transcript source than SA? Seems to be 'the' one out there.

 

[electracity]

Huh. No 12V system - or at least no 12V battery?

I'm not sure how that possible to do safely. If something causes the HV contactors to open, isolating the main pack, how do you recover the car?

J1772 requires the car to take action before receiving mains power, so just plugging it in doesn't seem viable - unless Tesla can get enough energy off of the pilot signal safely to run the computer enough to command the EVSE and unlock AC power?

Use an 48v capacitor on an isolated sub system.

 

[electracity]

Personally I would not be surprised to see falcon wings on the Tesla minibus (or concepts like that) but not on other future Tesla cars.

If Tesla thinks they have solved falcon wing doors I expect they will show up on the Y.

I also expect the Y to look different is details to allow for easy manufacture. For example, the car may not be painted as a whole. Parts like door frame and trunk interiors may have a plastic cover and match the interior rather than show exterior paint. Placing the panels after the interior is constructed last allows for easier robotic assembly.