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Where to put jack stands on Model S?

Discussion in 'Model S: Interior & Exterior' started by SteveW25561, Aug 23, 2013.

  1. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    #1 SteveW25561, Aug 23, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2013
    I'm doing some reading to understand how to lift the MS for wheel changes, Alloy Gator installation, etc. I'm comfortable working with one wheel up at a time on a jack to change tires, but if I wanted to paint the calipers, etc, it would be fastest to get the car up on jack stands and work on all 4.

    I have read about and can see the 4 lift points near the wheels, however, how do you get jack stands onto those pads when I think the jack itself takes up at least 1/2 of the pad? With the width of a typical jack stand, I don't see how you can fit the stand next to the jack's lifting pad and still have it align to the MS's approved lifting point. There isn't any other place under the MS that I can see to lift from. I did see an MS on 4 jack stands at the shop where I was getting tint done, but neglected to look at where they put the jack stands.

    I'm about to order a 3 ton jack (Amazon.com: Powerzone 380044 3 Ton Aluminum and Steel Garage Jack: Automotive) and from what I can tell, the contact pad on the jack would take up around 1/2 of the Tesla lift point.

    Suggestions?

    Edit: I just found these: Jackpoint jackstands. They look really interesting, but pricey at $300/pair. http://www.jackpointjackstands.com/ What do people think of these?
     
  2. JohnnyMac

    JohnnyMac Member

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    Those jack stands look pretty good. I had this same issue for tire rotations. Bought a second floor jack and use both on one side at a time to rotate the tires front to rear. Works well.
     
  3. consolidated

    consolidated Member

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    I used to have a set of Jackpoints but for other cars. They work great and are a good solution to cars with limited jack points that have to be shared with a stand. They're very heavy duty.
     
  4. kevincwelch

    kevincwelch Active Member

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    Serious question: How safe is it to change a tire using only the jack lift to support the car? I was thinking of getting this one. (Same as OP.)
     
  5. SCW-Greg

    SCW-Greg Active Member

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    Get a hockey puck, seriously, and use those as your contact point with the car. They work great.

    I just had my rear two tires replaced (picked up a nail and couldn't repair the tire), at America's Tire. They used two similar floor jacks like this on both rear tires at the same time. I asked the guy if he should chock the front wheels, he said since the floor is perfectly level, the car isn't going anywhere. Remember the E brakes are on the rear wheels.

    I don't think it was the safest way to handle the car, but it was stable while they changed everything out.
     
  6. JohnQ

    JohnQ Active Member

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    My two cents as a non-expert:
    Loosen lug nuts with wheels on the pavement. Jack vehicle with a hydraulic jack (like you linked to) using a piece of wood between the pad and the jack point on the car. Finish loosening lug nuts, change wheels and tighten lug nuts without applying too much force. Lower vehicle. Torque bolts to spec.

    I use a breaker bar to do the initial loosening, and an impact wrench to completely remove and then reinstall the lug nuts. Torque wrench for final tightening. My compressor doesn't put out a ton of air so even at 90 psi the impact wrench can't loosen the lugs when fully torqued.
     
  7. Dreamin

    Dreamin Member

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  8. kevincwelch

    kevincwelch Active Member

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    Have any of you purchased the Powerzone floor jack yet? I'm wondering if this is "low profile" enough to fit under the Model S. Can you raise the suspension to "very high" and then put the car into jack mode to assist with clearance? Or is this not necessary?
     
  9. howardc64

    howardc64 Member

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    #9 howardc64, Dec 15, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2013
    Sorry to resurrect an older thread... I've done all my own auto maintenance (big and small, Euro and Japanese) in the last 10 years. Like to be able to do basic things like tire rotation and inspections on my wife's MS85 as well. Won't be going anywhere near the high voltage power supply and batteries for now though :)

    On jacking up this car... My understanding is the jackpoint is pretty small. How do you guys jack it up using that jack point and then place a jack stand? I only have 1 jack so can't do the trick of using 2 jacks on one side to rotate the tires. Do you guys run a length of 2x4 (to spread the load) on the jackpoint to jack it up, put the stand near by? BTW, I use a hockey puck as jack pad, works great. I also don't have air suspension so no "jackless" trick to get it up on stand for me.

    I've seen the jackpointstands which would work... hoping to find an option to use my standard equipment before investing in those. Pricy :)

    On a side note, DIY auto maintenance these days often require 1) factory service manuals 2) factory knock off computer diagnostic tool (I've got tools for Volvo, VW and Toyota). I'm assuming neither exist for consumers for this car at this time? And maybe never exist unless the volume gets super high :(
     
  10. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    Here's some more info that I've gathered on these jackstands.

    You can see the Tesla jack point is small, and the battery pack protrudes lower to the ground just a few mm beyond the jack point (indicated in the following diagram at the top). The wider yellow circle is the size of the jackpointjackstand's central riser, and within it, the smaller orange circle represents the metal pin that seats in the middle of the riser to prevent the car from slipping off the stands:

    unnamed.jpg

    Here's a picture of the needed STANDARD profile jackpointjackstand plate:

    standard pad3.jpg
    that black rubber surface is what contacts the MS jackpoint, and the metal pin interfaces with the hole in the middle of the jackpoint as an added aid prevent the car from slipping off.

    Finally, here's a diagram in profile how I think the whole thing looks when viewed from the front of the car, looking down along the long axis of the car. The 'critical height' accounts for the battery pack sitting a little lower than the jack point -- this is why we need the STANDARD pad as the low profile pad will make the plate hit the battery. I've exaggerated the battery pack depth but the horizontal sizes representing the jackpoint and the jackpointjackstand plate are to scale.

    Jackpoint clearance.001.jpg

    One thing to note: I think we'd need to position the jackpointjackstand plate just a little off center from the jackpoint to avoid the battery pack (just about 0.3-0.5 cm from center, towards the outside of the car) to avoid any possible interface with the battery pack, but that might just be me being worried. That said, the owner at jackpointjackstands stated he could drill the center pin a little off center to avoid this problem, but you'd then need to be sure you always have the plate oriented the right way. I think I'll order the stock pad and try it out before committing to a customized plate.

    John, the owner, was very receptive, and was willing to work with me on this -- if the whole thing didn't work out, he was willing to take it back. In the end, I didn't order since I already changed the tires over, but having the car up on stands for this and other work would be better and safer than using the jack alone.

    I will be putting an order in but since I'm in Canada, it's a bit of a hassle for shipping (and return if necessary) since I ship stuff to a receiving depot just across the border in WA. Thus, I'll likely wait until I need to change the tires over again. If others go ahead, please report back your experience: I put all of this up to help us grok how this all might work. As far as I know, there are no other usable jackstand options for MS owners who don't have a commercial lift.
     
    • Informative x 1
  11. kevincwelch

    kevincwelch Active Member

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    #11 kevincwelch, Dec 15, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2013
    Thanks for the post.

    Would solve a few things if they made the diameter of the seat cap 2.5 inches instead.
     
  12. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    #12 SteveW25561, Dec 15, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2013
    He does make custom milled jackpads -- for $90. It would delay the delivery, but I can see the advantage. Maybe if we get a few people together we can convince him to make a 2.5" set cap, but then again, it appears to me the 3" will work fine.

    I just emailed to ask for a discount code. Let's see what he says...

    BTW I was able to use the Powerzone jack I mentioned originally without issue, plus wheel chocks. I think it's best practice to use wheel chocks and jack stands, though and not the jack since it can potentially roll.

    - Steve

     
  13. dratifk

    dratifk Sorry Sold my *****

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    Thats Fantastic info. Thank you very much. We have 3-4 people interested maybe we can pursue a group buy. I don't think there is anything out there as good as this product. I've never used jack stands and have never felt safe changing tires.
     
  14. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    I'd be interested.
     
  15. kevincwelch

    kevincwelch Active Member

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    I'm definitely interested in 2 stands, possibly 4 with a 2.5 inch seat. If others think the 3 inch is really fine, then I guess I'm fine with it too.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Agree re: chocks.

    What's the diameter of the pad on the Powerzone jack?
     
  16. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    BTW, I've emailed the owner to ask for a TMC discount code. The base price is $299 for 2 stands, BTW.

    The Powerzone jack has a 4.5" diameter lift pad. I was able to make that work perfectly fine with my MS -- just had be be sure it didn't strike the battery, thus it was also placed off-center. Therefore, I think the 3" jackpointjackstand seat will be just fine, and it leaves the flexibility and security of a 3" surface for any other car you might need to use it on. Mind you, I've not tried it yet.


    .
     
  17. kevincwelch

    kevincwelch Active Member

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    Modified your image a bit. The three inch seat looks like it will be ok.

    jack-modified.jpg
     
  18. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    Oh, I definitely can make it graphically work: in fact I made a little Powerpoint using grouped objects to allow me slide the target crosshair around and it looks like the 3" will still work even if centered. I posted the screenshot of it offset to show we can still have enough margin to not hit the battery pack.

    It will just take one of us to try it in the real world -- I'm now waiting to hear back from John if he'll do a group discount.

    - Steve

     
  19. spaghetti

    spaghetti Member

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    This is a fantastic thread - thanks Steve! I would be interested in a group buy.
     
  20. kevincwelch

    kevincwelch Active Member

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    Maybe this thread should be merged with the other.
     

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