Which Carbotech Brake Pads

[nj1266]

Hi all,

I am now in the final phase of making my M3P track ready. I have done the wheels and tires, the PPF and tint (to protect paint from track debris and from the hot Buttonwillow sun). I have narrowed my search to Carbotech XP 10 or XP 12. I have a lot of track experience having raced door to door with NASA and SCCA. So which pad should I use? Should I use the same compound front and rear?

I am also going to drain and replace the brake fluid with Castrol SRF. Is that the best brake fluid? Do I need more than one bottle to drain and replace?

Any advise is appreciated.

 

[boyguan]

same pad front and rear. for this car weight i would do the xp12. i have them but have not installed them yet.

 

[MasterC17]

I am running RP2 all around and the fronts overheat. I would recommend XP20 or 24 in the front and 12/RP2 in the rear.

 

[boyguan]

Good thing to know is what track he will be using. BW isnt too heavy on brakes. Only 3 turns and max speed would be like 110-120 which enters into a 60-70 turn.

 

[Mash]

I am running RP2 all around and the fronts overheat. I would recommend XP20 or 24 in the front and 12/RP2 in the rear.

I honestly don't understand the purpose of throwing off brake bias with pads. Normally it was always the last resort when you had to use completely wrong piston area distribution and you had no manual brake bias control.

If you lower a car or put harder springs or add more rear aero - you move more brake torque demand at the back. And if you balance brake rotor size/vents to the level that it's similar front/rear temperature - you really don't want to have pads with different friction response to temperature.

I know that most forums repeat that idea about lower friction pads in the rear, but maybe you have more specific inside in this case?

 

[mcbarnet007]

Good thing to know is what track he will be using. BW isnt too heavy on brakes. Only 3 turns and max speed would be like 110-120 which enters into a 60-70 turn.

I think it's a little more than 3 turns. sunrise (115->70), off-ramp (90->40), cotton corner (100-> 60), bus stop (100->75), phil hill (112-> 75), sweeper(115->75), sunset(120->65).

 

[MasterC17]

I honestly don't understand the purpose of throwing off brake bias with pads. Normally it was always the last resort when you had to use completely wrong piston area distribution and you had no manual brake bias control.

If you lower a car or put harder springs or add more rear aero - you move more brake torque demand at the back. And if you balance brake rotor size/vents to the level that it's similar front/rear temperature - you really don't want to have pads with different friction response to temperature.

I know that most forums repeat that idea about lower friction pads in the rear, but maybe you have more specific inside in this case?

If I were to guess, the thoughts from the forums comes from not wanting to lock up the rear brakes with an aggressive compound and an aggressive foot. Much better to lock up the front than the rear.

It's also worth noting that the rear brake pads are generally going to run cooler than the front brake pads, so due to temperature range and Mu you might actually achieve a better balance with different pads on different axles.

Nonetheless, I've been happy with the Ferodo DS3.12 in the front and the RB XT-970 in the rear. Brake bias seems fine.

 

[Dangerous Fish]

SRF is the best fluid IMO. 1 1/2 bottles is needed to make sure you've flushed the system completely.

I've been using XP10s for several track days now. I also used RB XT-970s for the first few track days and I know of a couple of others using them in their P3Ds at trackdays here.

I'd say the XP10s are fine to a point, but glaze after a while. The XT-970s in comparison wear faster and generate more dust but don't glaze as quickly.

Ultimately, it depends on the type of track you'll be running on. It seems a lot of P3D drivers in the U.S. use endurance pads because they are running on fast tracks with big stopping zones. That's not so common in the UK so I think even XP8s would work here on most tracks.

You may come to the conclusion after trying track pads for a while that a BBK is the way to go. Easier pad swaps, lower running temperatures and more choice of pad compounds are the benefits. Good luck!

 

[Porscheman9]

Hi all,

I am now in the final phase of making my M3P track ready. I have done the wheels and tires, the PPF and tint (to protect paint from track debris and from the hot Buttonwillow sun). I have narrowed my search to Carbotech XP 10 or XP 12. I have a lot of track experience having raced door to door with NASA and SCCA. So which pad should I use? Should I use the same compound front and rear?

I am also going to drain and replace the brake fluid with Castrol SRF. Is that the best brake fluid? Do I need more than one bottle to drain and replace?

Any advise is appreciated.

Track performance for brakes on Tesla 3P-suck out the original fluid and then bleed with SRF. If you suck out OEM fluid, then only about 1/2 bottle should be fine. Also need to remove heat shields from front. need to cut a slit to remove them. Lastly Porsche OEM 997 plastic brake deflectors work great to get cooling to the front rotors. See pic below. Tesla 3 now competitive with Porsche Cayman/Boxster S. 1.5G's on BFG Comp TA A/S Summit Point.

 

[Zcd1]

... Lastly Porsche OEM 997 plastic brake deflectors work great to get cooling to the front rotors. See pic below. Tesla 3 now competitive with Porsche Cayman/Boxster S. 1.5G's on BFG Comp TA A/S Summit Point.

How are those deflectors mounted, and must they be modified in order to fit?

 

[bondo]

I ran xp10's at buttonwillow the other day. No fade but it did stink a little on session 1 and session 2. Once i got out of 'congestion' and i could get in a grove the brakes didnt stink anymore though i suspect they're right on the edge. They also seem decent on the street fwiw if a single pad if youre interested in that setup.

Disclaimer, i just threw on the pads the night before track day so not a whole lot of experience there, #2 i dont know button never been there before so i was thrashing about and definitely not on McBarnets' line.

 

[Dangerous Fish]

I ran xp10's at buttonwillow the other day. No fade but it did stink a little on session 1 and session 2. Once i got out of 'congestion' and i could get in a grove the brakes didnt stink anymore though i suspect they're right on the edge. They also seem decent on the street fwiw if a single pad if youre interested in that setup.

Disclaimer, i just threw on the pads the night before track day so not a whole lot of experience there, #2 i dont know button never been there before so i was thrashing about and definitely not on McBarnets' line.

You didn't bed them in?

 

[bondo]

You didn't bed them in?

Not in the traditional sense.

Running Carbotech's street pads (1521) and per them i wouldnt have to bed the xp10 provided i bedded their street pads.

Bondo

 

[Dangerous Fish]

Not in the traditional sense.

Running Carbotech's street pads (1521) and per them i wouldnt have to bed the xp10 provided i bedded their street pads.

Bondo

You really should put the pads through a proper heat cycle before using them on track. You may well have some transfer from your street pads on the rotors, but the XP10s themselves need a curing for maximum performance and lifespan.

 

[MasterC17]

Track performance for brakes on Tesla 3P-suck out the original fluid and then bleed with SRF. If you suck out OEM fluid, then only about 1/2 bottle should be fine. Also need to remove heat shields from front. need to cut a slit to remove them. Lastly Porsche OEM 997 plastic brake deflectors work great to get cooling to the front rotors. See pic below. Tesla 3 now competitive with Porsche Cayman/Boxster S. 1.5G's on BFG Comp TA A/S Summit Point.

Am also curious how the deflectors are mounted. Do you part numbers?

 

[boyguan]

Do you think you could daily the XP10? I can easily swap them but since this car uses regen so much, brake squeel might not be noticable.

 

[boyguan]

Not in the traditional sense.

Running Carbotech's street pads (1521) and per them i wouldnt have to bed the xp10 provided i bedded their street pads.

Bondo

Could you run this daily? On a traditional car i can swap but since this uses regen, i may not need to during the summer months when i may track more often.

 

[Dangerous Fish]

Do you think you could daily the XP10? I can easily swap them but since this car uses regen so much, brake squeel might not be noticable.

I used them daily for about 500 miles of street driving and several track days and had no squeal issues.

 

[bondo]

Could you run this daily? On a traditional car i can swap but since this uses regen, i may not need to during the summer months when i may track more often.

I think you could... While limited i did have about 10 hours of drive time down to the track and back. I had no issues with them and they stopped fine cold but it was 80 degrees out at night.