Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Which? suggests the MS should be recalled

Lucanesque

Member
Aug 9, 2020
148
87
Brighton, UK
Which? released a report today where they are suggesting several makes and models of cars are recalled - MS is one of those:

"The Tesla Model S looks shiny and new, but those funky pop-out door handles/locks needed fixing by nearly one in five owners"​

Full report here (I say full, it's quite brief!)
 
Oct 25, 2016
60
53
Glasgow, Scotland
There was an interesting aside in the full article in Which Magazine though:

"We discussed Land Rover in more detail back on p15, but Tesla remains the paradox. Near the bottom of our table, Tesla cars sport some of the highest fault rates (40% of owners with cars up to three years old) and longest average garage stays (four to five days) we've seen. And yet Tesla remains the most-loved brand: when questioned on satisfaction and whether people would recommend their car to another buyer, Tesla came out on top, beating Porsche and Lexus. It must be doing something right."
Probably a phenomenon most people here would recognise!

They also raise concerns with the Model 3, saying:

"Admittedly, the faults tended to be minor, but it belies a general low level of quality: paintwork and other exterior trim problems were common, which is unusual. Although not overly frequent, a number of owners also reported problems with the car's rainwater seals. The last thing you expect from your fancy new Tesla is for it to let in water.

Then factor in that 3% of owners we heard from had already seen their car break down. The Model 3 looks destined to go the way of the Model S and Model X."​
 
  • Like
Reactions: ringi

fancealot

Member
Jun 17, 2020
246
162
Doncaster & Leeds
There was an interesting aside in the full article in Which Magazine though:

"We discussed Land Rover in more detail back on p15, but Tesla remains the paradox. Near the bottom of our table, Tesla cars sport some of the highest fault rates (40% of owners with cars up to three years old) and longest average garage stays (four to five days) we've seen. And yet Tesla remains the most-loved brand: when questioned on satisfaction and whether people would recommend their car to another buyer, Tesla came out on top, beating Porsche and Lexus. It must be doing something right."
Probably a phenomenon most people here would recognise!

They also raise concerns with the Model 3, saying:

"Admittedly, the faults tended to be minor, but it belies a general low level of quality: paintwork and other exterior trim problems were common, which is unusual. Although not overly frequent, a number of owners also reported problems with the car's rainwater seals. The last thing you expect from your fancy new Tesla is for it to let in water.

Then factor in that 3% of owners we heard from had already seen their car break down. The Model 3 looks destined to go the way of the Model S and Model X."​
I didn't read the article yet - Hate to read which who keep a lot of the information behind a paywall (another argument for a different post)
I think what most review sites such as which don't remember, Tesla is an infant in the car game compared to major Car companies, others have had several decades plus to get the manufacturing right and are building in essence to order, Tesla are selling more cars than they can build so yes whilst the minor faults are relatively high people love thier cars because they are underneath the shell a good car with modern technology thinking out of the box on design. When tesla can take a breath (and more regional factories are producing cars) the build quality will increase.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ElRey

MadScientist

Member
Apr 23, 2020
259
144
Salisbury, UK
A 3% breakdown rate for the Model 3 is extremely poor - is this accurate?

Edit: looking into this in more detail, it seems that 'breakdown' can be defined in a lot of ways.
 
Last edited:

Adopado

Active Member
Aug 19, 2019
4,282
3,243
Scotland
Interesting sub-headline: "Luxury Cars are the least Reliable". Other than Lexus nobody comes out with flying colours. A common theme on this forum is that legacy car brands have it sorted and that Tesla is the odd man out ... clearly not the case! The Polestar 2 got everyone excited because it's from Volvo but it appears the UKs least reliable car is the Volvo XC90!
 
  • Like
Reactions: gangzoom

Gaz_

Member
Jul 26, 2019
142
45
UK
Interesting sub-headline: "Luxury Cars are the least Reliable". Other than Lexus nobody comes out with flying colours. A common theme on this forum is that legacy car brands have it sorted and that Tesla is the odd man out ... clearly not the case! The Polestar 2 got everyone excited because it's from Volvo but it appears the UKs least reliable car is the Volvo XC90!

It is well known that VAG put the new toys on Audi first, the Audi drivers pay more for them, and have a higher tolerance for failures or them not working right, they then move them down the product line to VW who expect modern but good reliability, then finally down to the budget range of Seat and Skoda where reliability and predictability are always more important than cutting edge.

It's just one of those paradoxes that people spending more money seem to be OK with warranty fixes to get the cool stuff

Edit: Doesn't that mean us Model S/X drivers should get all the cool toys before the 3/Y people? Tesla bucking the trend again :)
 

Neilio

Member
Jul 8, 2020
934
581
Brentford
I didn't read the article yet - Hate to read which who keep a lot of the information behind a paywall (another argument for a different post)
I think what most review sites such as which don't remember, Tesla is an infant in the car game compared to major Car companies, others have had several decades plus to get the manufacturing right and are building in essence to order, Tesla are selling more cars than they can build so yes whilst the minor faults are relatively high people love thier cars because they are underneath the shell a good car with modern technology thinking out of the box on design. When tesla can take a breath (and more regional factories are producing cars) the build quality will increase.
Selling more cars than they can build is a worrying statement. Whichever way you look at it they shouldn’t be doing that. Either manage expectations with realistic delivery times to match your current output or improve your current output. It’s not right that they should continue taking orders that they can’t fulfil and then rushing production to fit. Given we are the ones who have to deal with the end product.

Agree on their infancy being a reasonable excuse but they must show improvement. I thought the mode 3 had better quality then the s/x? Which it should, it’s the third generation of vehicle they have manufactured and it is less complicated then the second generation so their should be less to go wrong.
 

Mr Miserable

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Jul 8, 2019
5,092
9,661
UK
I don't take too much attention to Which? anymore.
Frankly I have never forgiven them for recommending Betamax over VHS as a Best Buy.
It may have been a technically superior system but it was never ever a Best Buy.
Their knowledge of EVs appears to be pretty poor as well - still entrenched in the charging to 100% mentality.
 

Adopado

Active Member
Aug 19, 2019
4,282
3,243
Scotland
I don't take too much attention to Which? anymore.
Frankly I have never forgiven them for recommending Betamax over VHS as a Best Buy.
It may have been a technically superior system but it was never ever a Best Buy.
Their knowledge of EVs appears to be pretty poor as well - still entrenched in the charging to 100% mentality.

To be fair in this case the article is entirely based on stats supplied by real customers so any opinion in there is very clearly backed up by numbers. (And I can't remember them pursuing the Betamax recommendation except in the very very early days of videocassettes ... which was obviously long before I was born :rolleyes:.)
 

fancealot

Member
Jun 17, 2020
246
162
Doncaster & Leeds
Selling more cars than they can build is a worrying statement. Whichever way you look at it they shouldn’t be doing that. Either manage expectations with realistic delivery times to match your current output or improve your current output. It’s not right that they should continue taking orders that they can’t fulfil and then rushing production to fit. Given we are the ones who have to deal with the end product.

Agree on their infancy being a reasonable excuse but they must show improvement. I thought the mode 3 had better quality then the s/x? Which it should, it’s the third generation of vehicle they have manufactured and it is less complicated then the second generation so their should be less to go wrong.
Well a business making money by taking on orders that need a long waiting list to fulfill - isn't that the ideal capitalist model?

Not great for customers, fantastic for share holders!!! And who do big companies bend to the will of? That's right share holders.

Damn I wish i'd bought Tesla stock lol!!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Neilio

Neilio

Member
Jul 8, 2020
934
581
Brentford
Well a business making money by taking on orders that need a long waiting list to fulfill - isn't that the ideal capitalist model?

Not great for customers, fantastic for share holders!!! And who do big companies bend to the will of? That's right share holders.

Damn I wish i'd bought Tesla stock lol!!!
True that! Tesla stock seems to be built better than it's vehicles :D
 

Avendit

Member
Apr 18, 2019
850
564
EDI
To be fair in this case the article is entirely based on stats supplied by real customers so any opinion in there is very clearly backed up by numbers. (And I can't remember them pursuing the Betamax recommendation except in the very very early days of videocassettes ... which was obviously long before I was born :rolleyes:.)
Which? Are very annoying. They decide what 'best' is then everything is measured against that. For cars I think it was an idealised focus - anything else was too big, or to small or under powered or gas guzzling. Group review of small city cars and they all have 'boots too small to be practical', because their definition of practical is packing for a 4 person holiday. For the target market they don't compare with the class, or adjust the target to 'a weeks shopping'.

I was looking at freezers recently and one model was amazing, excellent, efficient etc, and the other was a don't buy due to excessive power usage. Looking at their data tho, the first cost £16/year, the second £40. Yes, it's a chunk more, but it's not breaking the bank, and the first had an initial outlay almost 3x more. It's bad, but it wasn't represented is a very balanced manner.

Sorry. Which? Rant over. Have to say I do still use it slavishly for whitegoods purchases, but do try to understand where they are coming from before accepting their recommendations. What is the focus of the items I'm looking at. Unfortunately for EVs, it's still a 1.6 focus...
 

Adopado

Active Member
Aug 19, 2019
4,282
3,243
Scotland
Which? Are very annoying. They decide what 'best' is then everything is measured against that. For cars I think it was an idealised focus - anything else was too big, or to small or under powered or gas guzzling.

That's a fair point but in this case we are not talking about a traditional Which "review" ... we are looking at a summary of numbers gleaned from actual owners who reported the faults and breakdowns of their vehicles in a detailed survey. These numbers were totted up and it is clear to see that there were huge variations between manufacturers in the number of faults in new cars and then the number of faults that came up in subsequent years. This is hard information rather than opinion. It is clear that many legacy car makers in the "luxury" bracket (often charging more for their vehicles than Tesla) have significant issues to address. The survey only includes a few months of Model 3 production so it would be hard to place too much emphasis on that but Which rightly highlight (as we do ourselves) that Tesla has some work to do to sort out some basic quality issues. As a consumer organisation Which can be helpful in pushing manufacturers, including Tesla, to up their game. They are broadly pushing in the same direction as most of the people who post on this forum ... so that's a good thing I think.
 

Products we're discussing on TMC...

About Us

Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.

Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


SUPPORT TMC
Top