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Who pays who? Supercharger licenses/leases.

Discussion in 'North America -' started by Missile Toad, May 15, 2017.

  1. Missile Toad

    Missile Toad Member

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    So, assume Tesla approaches a restaurant or a mall (where restaurants are present) with a 10-year agreement to lease/license an 8-stall patch of their existing lot for semi-dedicated EV charging. In nearly all cases, those restaurants will get a bump up in customers as compared to prior years for the reason of having captive Tesla drivers -- not with every stop, but with many. The restaurants get added website exposure; Nav icons; mentions in the charger-tracking sites: Chargerville; Plugshare, etc.

    In contrast, the restaurants have more bathroom visits by non-paying customers; continuous lot maintenance (resurfacing and snow removal); as well as occasional discussions over EV v. ICE priority in the stalls. I can't even begin to calculate if there is some increased insurance costs -- but for now assume Tesla covers any liabilities that come from charger operations. Given these costs are likely outweighed by increased business, and that Tesla pays for all SuperCharger maintenance and electricity, does Tesla pay the land-owner/restaurant for the lease, or does the land-owner/restaurant pay Tesla to be present on their property.

    I believe that in the first 100-200 installs, Tesla probably had to make some payments in their leases, to the land-owners. However, now that it appears that Tesla is here to stay, and is the darling of the stock market, I suspect the land-owners are lining up to get SuperChargers on their property. Your thoughts?
     
  2. kort677

    kort677 Banned

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    every SpC location is structured a bit different, the basics are that tesla supplies everything for charging, the property owner provides the space.
    I am sure that isn't so for 100% of the locations but it doesn't vary too much.
    shopping center owners, business owners and the like are interested in attracting "affluent" tesla owners to their locations, locations on toll roads are there because the toll roads are trying to advance the use of EVs.
    I can only think of a handful of locations that aren't placed for those reasons.
     
  3. David99

    David99 Active Member

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    There are some states that have programs that support building charging stations. I know California has them and I'm sure Tesla will use them to cover part of the cost. I guess Tesla is paying some locations to lease the sparking spots. I assume Hotels don't charge Tesla for the parking spots. They want the extra business. I did talk to a Hotel manager and he said while they hoped to get more business, it turned out very very few Tesla owners actually stay. He sounded disappointed with the deal.

    Big places like HyVee most likely don't get payed for the parking spots. They actually pay for the power and like to get Tesla owners to go in their stores.
     
  4. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    I know for certain that there were some supercharger locations where the franchise owner there (which may not necessarily be the same as the landowner) paid for the electricity (and likely didn't charge for parking). Will have to search for source, but I know this was mentioned even though it's not common.
     
  5. Canuck

    Canuck Well-Known Member

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    I would be very surprised if anyone other than Tesla pays for the power to the superchargers. It would make no sense otherwise unless Tesla plans to pay the fees it receives to the owner of the site, and I highly doubt that's the case.

    As to the parking spaces, one hotel owner in BC said Tesla pays $100 per month per space but that probably varies depending on the site.
     
  6. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    Harrisburg, PA is one where someone else pays for power - or at least so the signs on every parking sign say - paid for by Weis market, the grocery store in the strip mall they're in.
     
  7. Canuck

    Canuck Well-Known Member

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    #7 Canuck, May 15, 2017
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
    Well that's a new one to me. I've never seen a sign at any charger that says who pays for the power, let alone one at a supercharger site. So if it says the power is paid by Weis market, then I wonder what will happen when people get invoiced from Tesla for the power. Also, commercial rates for power are not cheap. I can't see how Weis market can make up anywhere near the costs of the power provided from people shopping at their store who are supercharging.

    I believe you when you say the sign says that, but I don't believe the sign. I'd like to see a picture of it.

    Edit: I found a picture:

    https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/image-jpg.175705/

    It doesn't say Weis pays for the power but "Power supported by Weis." Providing and supporting are two very different things. I have little doubt Tesla pays for the power.
     
  8. Missile Toad

    Missile Toad Member

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    So one of the things I'm thinking is to what extent I want to patronize a business that supports, in what I perceive as a minor way, the SuperCharger? I probably don't want to eat at a business over 1/2 mile away (even dropping off my passengers there means a quick skateboard ride from car-to-restaurant and back for the driver). On the other hand, a quick run before a meal is a great way to burn some calories... unless it is Houston and it is July ... or <your state here> and <your horrible weather> in <worst month>.
     
  9. cpa

    cpa Active Member

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    We do know that a few locations (Mammoth Lakes, Crescent City, Ukiah) have Superchargers on municipal-owned lots. I would doubt that the cities or towns (Mammoth is unincorporated) would charge more than a token rent if anything.

    However, it is common in many commercial lease operations to charge the tenant a fixed rate plus an override if sales exceed a base amount. I know this is common in the grocery store business; I am not sure about other retail establishments. If businesses in the same parking lot as the SC have this sort of arrangement, who knows if Tesla has to pay anything if the override exceeds a certain threshold?

    Then there are locations like the SC at Fred Meyer in Sandy, Bend and K-Falls. I would think that those spots are rent-free for Tesla. Their parking lots are huge, and it is quite likely that many individuals will stop in and spend some coin while waiting.

    I would not believe that additional costs for bathroom supplies and electricity for those of us who do not patronize the establishment are a significant outflow for the businesses close by.
     
  10. pinball_player

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    The Supercharger in Bangor Maine says something (I cannot remember the exact wording), that the local restaurant pays for the power.

    I also find it interesting that the Super Charger there is not inside of a fenced area.
     
  11. jaguar36

    jaguar36 Active Member

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    The Burlington VT charger also is 'Supported' by a local business. I'd guess that they pay Tesla some amount to have it there, probably not related to usage. So they aren't paying for it directly, but are giving Tesla money which could be used for the power bill (or anything else for that matter)
     

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