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Who would give up free supercharging?

Discussion in 'Model S' started by MRPLUGIN, Sep 29, 2018.

  1. MRPLUGIN

    MRPLUGIN Member

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    As I look at Tesla and all they are looking to achieve, I begin to actually feel guilty about free supercharging. They built me the most advanced electric car out there, built a charging network like no other and continue to update my car with new and better features.

    If Tesla was rolling in cash and still being able to innovate and change the world, that would be a different story. But they are still a growing company and I would rather pay for my charging if it would help them better all things Tesla. So much so that a trip I was going to take in my MS will probably be in my M3 so I have to pay for my charging.

    Some people will thing I am crazy, but that is how I feel. If we can afford the car, we can pay for the energy. At last make it a option for those that may feel the same (if any) I guess;).
     
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  2. Naonak

    Naonak Member

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    The cost of Supercharging is wayyyy too much. If it's not free, it really de-incentivizes wanting to drive a Tesla cross country. It's cheaper in a lot of gas cars to drive than it is to Supercharge, so no, I would not give it up. If I had to pay for Supercharging, I would not drive a Tesla cross country; it's way too expensive.

    If it were more affordable and cheaper than gas cars across the board, then yes. But since it's about the same cost as an average car, no way in hell is it worth the extra time required.
     
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  3. Benjanos

    Benjanos Member

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    This is an interesting thread, can’t wait to see the replies!

    I give MrPlugin 10 points for being virtuous.
     
  4. ucmndd

    ucmndd Active Member

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    The psychological value of free supercharging is many orders of magnitude greater than the actual cost. I really don’t understand why people assign so much value to it.

    The overall impact to Tesla’s bottom line, free or not, is a rounding error.
     
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  5. Uncle Paul

    Uncle Paul Well-Known Member

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    Above all, Tesla most values owner referrals.

    Use all the free supercharging you want, but make an effort to encourage others to buy one for themselves.
     
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  6. Jack Tripper

    Jack Tripper Member

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    I'm sure Tesla will be happy to take your money. Luckily I can refer you to this P100D you'd look great in!
     
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  7. RFernatt

    RFernatt Solar/EV Owner/Enthusiast

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    #7 RFernatt, Sep 29, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2018
    Everyone who has it, should keep and enjoy it of course since it was part of the purchase agreement. A nice perk for early adopters who helped get Tesla where it is today. For all new buyers, though, I think it should die and stay dead. If Tesla wants to throw in some end of quarter supercharging credit sure, but no lifetime free supercharging going forward across the board. If everyone moving forward is helping pay for the network, hopefully it will continue to expand, increase charging speeds, and keep the cost low compared to gas. Besides, Tesla needs a few extra bucks to help deploy solar and Powerpacks at all the SC locations. IMHO, of course. :)
     
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  8. Saimaannorppa

    Saimaannorppa Member

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    They calculated originally, that the mass of M3s (and MYs) will pay for the Supercharging of relatively small amount of MS and MX early adopters. MS and MX early adopters paid for M3 development. No need to feel guilty as it was a fair deal.

    You have many ways to support Tesla if you want. E.g. do service every year at SC, 500$ profit each year to Tesla. Buy OEM accessories, high margin. Buy Model 3, without free supercharging.
     
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  9. tpham07

    tpham07 Active Member

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    #9 tpham07, Sep 29, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2018
    False. Completely false.

    $110 one way in supercharging costs from Florida to California. Roughly 2500 miles of driving. In an average sedan going 30MPG, that is 84 gallons of gas. At $2.65/gallon average, that is over $225 in gas costs.

    Supercharging is literally half the cost of gas.



    Or take a 400 mile roadtrip from LA to San Francisco. evtriplanner says youll use ~120kwh. At CA supercharger rates of 26cents/Kwh that is roughly $32.

    On a car that gets 30MPG, LA to San Francisco would use 14 gallons of gas. At CA average gas prices of $3.60, thats $50.40 in gas costs.

    I see you're in Kansas, its $0.20 a minute to supercharge at 60kw, and $0.10 below 60kw. The average supercharging session of 30 minutes to 80%. $6 assuming a speed above 60kw.

    30 minutes is roughly ~200 miles of range. $6 for 200 miles? in a 30MPG car is around 7 gallons, at $2.65/gallon gas is $18.55.

    no matter how you do the math, supercharging is still cheaper than gas. period.
     
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  10. No2DinosaurFuel

    No2DinosaurFuel Active Member

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    Cheaper yes but if you factor in the wait time, then it gets very expensive.

    I am still waiting on 3 hours of driving in 15 minutes of charging. That charging I would gladly pay for assuming similar today pricing.

    A side note, if you use a Prius, the math comes out closer to supercharging. 50mpg.
     
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  11. dark cloud

    dark cloud Active Member

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    #11 dark cloud, Sep 30, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
    I agree, but what about people like me who buy a used Tesla and get free supercharging for life? Should it not carry with the owner not the car?

    It does bother me that it is actually an incentive for Tesla to stop wanting to fix my older model S, a vehicle that consumes their electricity for free. Normal business practices dictate that if at some point they do't allow me to replace the battery, the car is worthless; it has to be recycled, and therefore eliminate that drain on their resources, and possibly replace it with a new one. At some point in the distant future there will be no cars getting free supercharging.


    You can buy your own supercharger?? :eek: :D
     
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  12. dark cloud

    dark cloud Active Member

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    No, you're missing the point; he doesn't want any points.
     
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  13. georgewyull

    georgewyull Member

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    I agree it should go with the owner rather than the car
     
  14. BradWI

    BradWI Member

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    The truth is the cost of our “free” unlimited supercharging was already factored into the cost of the vehicle. Even when it was part of the referral program, they probably assumed that 99% of people would use a referral and get it so that was considered when setting the price of the vehicle.

    So don’t feel guilty. You already paid for that supercharging. Might as well use it.
     
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  15. dhrivnak

    dhrivnak Active Member

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    I drive a 3 and SuperCharging is quite reasonable. 650 mile trip back from MS $16.20. A 400 mile trip to the beach $9.60 each way. Try that in a Prius!!!!
     
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  16. RFernatt

    RFernatt Solar/EV Owner/Enthusiast

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    #16 RFernatt, Sep 30, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
    Good point, but if the purchase agreement said free for the life of the car then Tesla should honor that. It's the same kind of thing whether an extended warranty transfers to a second owner. It imparts more value if it transfers and therefore the purchaser may have justified a higher price knowing resale value would be greater and it could be a selling point for for the next buyer.

    If it's not spelled out by Tesla such that the original purchaser could have that expectation, then yes, I agree that lifetime free supercharging should end with the original owner. CPOs could also be another story and end the free supercharging cycle right there.

    Going back to the OPs original question though, Tesla could offer a "buyout" of the lifetime free supercharging for say a merch credit and let supportive owners take the deal.
     
  17. Corsair

    Corsair Member

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    Tesla took a page out of Apple’s marketing strategy. Superchargers themselves look space-age, sleek and the logo even illuminates in signature red at night ; contrast that with other DCFCs that look dull & clunky in appearance.

    Factoring it is the only > 100 kW DCFC currently, you have a perk people Tesla owners value highly.
     
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  18. Magellan55

    Magellan55 Member

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    Probably depends how often one uses it. Haven't supercharged yet after 5k miles, and don't see myself doing it more than 2-3 times a year, so I could care less either way. But plenty of others use it a lot, either road warriors or those living in apartments. And some could only justify the cost of a Tesla based on getting free energy for life.
     
  19. bob_p

    bob_p Active Member

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    Supercharging cost is bundled into the price of every car. Tesla offered Supercharging as an extra cost option on some of the early lower priced Model S versions (60?). Tesla should be allocating a portion of each vehicle ($2500) to cover the costs of the Supercharger network, including both hardware and electricity.

    The Free Unlimited Supercharging was originally listed as "free long distance" charging on the Supercharging network. They evidently assumed people would use the chargers only during road trips - and the early chargers were only installed between major cities. Under that assumption, the average energy consumption per vehicle is likely around 400 KWh or roughly $100, based on Tesla's offers of limited free supercharging.

    What broke the model is providing unlimited free supercharging for urban charging, supporting owners that don't have access to overnight charging or a small number of commercial vehicles with high mileage and daily supercharging.

    Tesla should go back to their original intent - offer unlimited free long distance charging, which they should be able to do by geofencing around where a vehicle has been parked overnight (for multiple nights) and only providing free supercharging when the vehicle has moved far enough (75-100 miles?) to indicate a long distance trip - not a local drive. Doing that would constrain the costs back to what Tesla originally projected - likely averaging about $100 per year, something they could cover from the vehicle purchase price.

    From a marketing standpoint, offering free long distance driving is a great feature - something other manufacturers will have difficulty matching. Plus by integrating the supercharging network into Tesla's onboard and smartphone software, they should be able to provide better support, making supercharger usage easier.
     
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  20. cmalinowski

    cmalinowski Member

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    It was "important" to us, but really only psychologically in reality. We would have purchased either way I'm sure. We'll charge at home most of the time. Road trips = super charging. So that will be nice. I agree it's not a huge value over the life of the car... for us. But it is nice to know that we don't have to pay... even if we already did.

    I think they should offer free super charging for life as an option. They know how much they "give away" in the program. Let's say it's $2000 on average, how many people would pay that up front to never have to worry about paying for super charging again? I bet a lot would. And I bet you Tesla would still make money off of it. Most newbs, like me, don't think as much about charging at home because we are used to ICE and having to fuel up at a station. So, we think that "fueling up" a Tesla as something done at a station, even if subconsciously. So, we'd pay it more than likely. People expect to keep these cars for a long time I think. I know we do. A lot of people will pay money up front, even if not economically smart, for the piece of mind of not having to worry about paying ever again in the future. Look at extended warranties.

    Just my thoughts.

    Chris
     
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