Why do Americans like Pickup trucks?

[Canuck]

I absolutely welcome it... I'm producing ~50% more energy than I consume... let's go Bubba... you're falling WAY WAY behind and that Ferd f-teen-fifty you insist on driving everywhere ain't helping. :wink:

Breaking our fossil fuel addiction isn't a 'noble goal'... it's a moral obligation.

Is that energy alone or do you account for products you consume including packaging, energy and materials to produce your solar panels, roads you travel on, street lights you drive home by, planes you fly in, elevators you ride in, and the list goes on and on. Sorry, I'm not picking on you. You seem like a great guy and an excellent example. I just wonder if every one of the 7.1 billion people on this earth lived like you, whether it would be sustainable? I think most of the people on earth consume much less on an individual basis and still look at the mess we're in.

In my opinion, we're circling the drain anyway. I try to do what is right but I consume far too much, and produce far too many greenhouse gases, than is sustainable for one person out of 7B. Driving my Tesla and Leaf probably just make me feel better about myself than really change anything so I shouldn't be fooling myself. Then saying to China and India you can't use fossil fuels to give you the standard of living we have presents another moral dilemma for me.

I feel really sorry for my kids, but more sorry for their kids, and so on and so on. That's why I do what little I do. But I'm not blind to the future. It's pretty grim despite our best efforts.

Still no reason to give up.

 

[Johan]

Trailers also very definitely have their place, and for many situations a trailer behind an SUV/CUV, etc., certainly does work. Trust me, however: there are many, many times when you are so grateful you're moving just one two-axled frame rather than an articulating 3- or 4-axled one. Ugh. (try backing up in a city, e.g.).

In the Nordic countries this sounds so strange, because here hauling stuff using a trailer is definitely the norm, and everyone (at least most men) learn to drive with a trailer, go in reverse with the trailer attached, while for you in Alaska and the rest of the US and Canada where trucks have been cheaply available for the reasons outlined earlier in this thread that is seems alien to you that most people would master this.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

In the Nordic countries this sounds so strange, because here hauling stuff using a trailer is definitely the norm, and everyone (at least most men) learn to drive with a trailer, go in reverse with the trailer attached, while for you in Alaska and the rest of the US and Canada where trucks have been cheaply available for the reasons outlined earlier in this thread that is seems alien to you that most people would master this.

+1

I do not own a Pickup truck.

Nor have I ever used one.

If I need to move stuff I rent one of these trailers at my local Statoil gas station.

I do not rent at OK Q8 since that corporation is partly owned by Kuweit (Q8), but I couldn't find a picture of the Statoil version...

 

[Canuck]

+1

View attachment 80434

I do not own a Pickup truck.

Nor have I ever used one.

If I need to move stuff I rent one of these trailers at my local Statoil gas station.

I do not rent at OK Q8 since that corporation is partly owned by Kuweit (Q8), but I couldn't find a picture of the Statoil version...

You're not towing very much if you're towing with that vehicle. If you are towing anything heavy, I sure wouldn't want to be behind you on the road. Being proud of towing with cars makes no sense to me. Trying to take that up one of our mountain passes is a recipe for disaster and even around town it's not worth risking lives.

In the Nordic countries this sounds so strange, because here hauling stuff using a trailer is definitely the norm, and everyone (at least most men) learn to drive with a trailer, go in reverse with the trailer attached, while for you in Alaska and the rest of the US and Canada where trucks have been cheaply available for the reasons outlined earlier in this thread that is seems alien to you that most people would master this.

It's not alien to me. My wife could back our 19' trailer into the smallest of camping sites. I highly doubt more people can drive in reverse with trailers in the Nordic countries than people in Canada/US.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

.../ So be careful about judging "Bubba" as he will also be judging you.

The last 18 years I’ve flown commercially once (Stockholm–Malmö one way. About 550 km.)

The last 18 years I was a vegan for ~5 years. I now eat meat. But only poultry (almost only chicken), seafood and game.

I have always had a rather modest dwelling.

I’ve only owned one car – the one I drive today. I bought it used, and it’s the previous version of the VW Passat wagon with manual transmission that can be propelled by methane (above). In Sweden ~60% of all methane is produced locally from recycled organic waste from households, farms and food processing industries and such. If I remember correctly, according to one study (that I of course currently am unable to find) almost 70% of all traffic on Swedish roads could be propelled by methane from recycled organic waste if all that waste was indeed recycled. Unfortunately that’s of course not the case. And, and the importance of the following cannot be stressed enough: There is ABSOLUTELY NO FRACKING ANYWHERE IN SWEDEN. As far as I’m aware there’s no fracking in any Scandinavian country!

But I’m actually thinking about getting a monthly ~$850 equivalent, ~7 year car payment to get a 85D…

The car I own was the fourth most sold in Sweden in 2014.

These held places 1 to 3:

1. Volvo V70

2. VW Golf Sporscombi

3. Volvo V60

You’d be surprised about the amount of stuff you can fit in one of these station wagon suckers!

And all of them can pull a trailer...


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You're not towing very much if you're towing with that vehicle. If you are towing anything heavy, I sure wouldn't want to be behind you on the road. Being proud of towing with cars makes no sense to me. Trying to take that up one of our mountain passes is a recipe for disaster and even around town it's not worth risking lives.

I've never once towed anything up a mountain pass. Where I live there are none of those.

If I need to move more stuff than can safely fit in one of those trailers, then there are of course other solutions (!)

 

[ZsoZso]

As a journalist that covers the light truck segment, I think there are several reasons. I think there is a romanticized agrarian, individualist ethos that is captured in the modern imagination by the pickup truck. A lot of people like a "do anything" vehicle. And although the prospect of a full BEV pickup maybe isn't realistic yet, huge strides have been made to make pickups more fuel efficient.

I have seen some home-conversion EV pickup-truck at a local show in Toronto, there are also these sites:
EV Fleet, Inc. | Electric Pickup Trucks for Fleets
[EV Tradin' post] - Electric Trucks for Sale

Plus the rather small Leaf-based conversion:
World's First Nissan Leaf Electric Pickup Truck, For Shop Use Only (Video)

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

You're not towing very much if you're towing with that vehicle. If you are towing anything heavy, I sure wouldn't want to be behind you on the road. Being proud of towing with cars makes no sense to me. Trying to take that up one of our mountain passes is a recipe for disaster and even around town it's not worth risking lives. [My underline.].

Specifications for that trailer:

- Total weight (trailer+cargo): 1000 kg

- Max cargo: 410 kg

- Internal measurements:

Length: 360 cm

Width: 159 cm

Hight: 190 cm

Why would that be "risking lives" driving in a town? As I understand it, the VW Golf pictured can tow 1400 kg...

 

[Canuck]

Specifications for that trailer:

- Total weight (trailer+cargo): 1000 kg

- Max cargo: 410 kg

- Internal measurements:

Length: 360 cm

Width: 159 cm

Hight: 190 cm

Why would that be "risking lives" driving in a town? As I understand it, the VW Golf pictured can tow 1400 kg...

Because it's single axle and the towball limit is probably no more than 80kg for that car. If you don't distribute the load evenly (and 410kg isn't much stuff compared to the space it can hold, and we all know no one overloads trailers) it's just plain not safe. Just looking at the picture makes me cringe. It's not level at all and the weight on the towball is clearly not balanced. Even evening out the load won't fix that -- it's probably an empty trailer -- and you can't raise the hitch on that car. It's clearly mismatched.

 

[eye.surgeon]

One of the biggest hurdles Tesla needs to overcome to increase acceptance of electric vehicles is the smug, how dare you not share my world view, superiority complex of some owners. It's a major turn-off to electrics for many people because they don't want to be lumped in with that crowd. It's only a small minority here but they're quite vocal.

 

[nwdiver]

One of the biggest hurdles Tesla needs to overcome to increase acceptance of electric vehicles is the smug, how dare you not share my world view, superiority complex of some owners. It's a major turn-off to electrics for many people because they don't want to be lumped in with that crowd. It's only a small minority here but they're quite vocal.

Can you rephrase that into a recommended action? Do you think we should ignore the addiction and hope it solves itself?

Nothing 'smug' about accepting physics...

The first step to solving a problem is admitting that there IS a problem.

Burning >1 gallon of refined petroleum to transport <4 people ~30 miles?!?! That's a BIG problem... That's not 'smug'.... that's MATH.

 

[reddy]

Standard fare. When you don't like something paint it as phallic, or sexist, or alien, or whatever.

If you don't like 'em, don't buy 'em. No need to project your issues upon those that do like them.

Don't be so fast to dismiss this. Why do you think 'truck nuts' exist ? The 'common knowledge' that truck lift is inversely proportional to phallic size is certainly out there.

 

[brianman]

Don't be so fast to dismiss this.

Painting and categorizing people based on one or more dimensions of their lifestyle or personality is almost always counterproductive and, frankly, just as childish as namecalling. It's a waste of air and opportunity.

 

[igotzzoom]

Fully-electric pickups will one day become mainstream, but as I've said before, pickups bring with them many more complicating factors than do passenger cars, mostly having to do with energy consumption under load, and consequently, the need for a larger battery. Among consumer vehicles, I expect it will be one of the last to make the transition to full BEV. Between now and then, I expect to see more hybridization, engine downsizing, auto stop-start, higher ratio (i.e. 10-speed) transmissions, and probably more light-duty diesels.

 

[GSP]

A car with a trailer is fine for light household tasks. Back in the 1950's and '60's that was a popular solution in the U.S. Pickups were reserved for work duty.

Nowadays the typical suburbanite has bigger jobs.

Like taking his boat out to the lake:

Or, taking horses to the state fair:

Or, going camping (sometimes 24/7/365):

Or, hauling some light farm machinery:

Or, maybe some hay:

Or, maybe just showing off:

Not good for carbon emissions, I know. Let's hope Elon gets his bad-ass solar powered electric pickup that can out tow these belching behemoths on the market soon.

GSP

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

Can you rephrase that into a recommended action? Do you think we should ignore the addiction and hope it solves itself?

Nothing 'smug' about accepting physics...

The first step to solving a problem is admitting that there IS a problem.

Burning >1 gallon of refined petroleum to transport <4 people ~30 miles?!?! That's a BIG problem... That's not 'smug'.... that's MATH.

+1

One of the biggest hurdles Tesla needs to overcome to increase acceptance of electric vehicles is the smug, how dare you not share my world view, superiority complex of some owners. It's a major turn-off to electrics for many people because they don't want to be lumped in with that crowd. It's only a small minority here but they're quite vocal.

I can’t speak for anyone else. So I’ll just speak for myself.

You’re apparently an eye surgeon so you’re probably quite capable intellectually.

I for example base my world view on this scientific fact:

Source: :: Sea-level Rise :: CSIRO ::

That’s a mean sea-level rise of ~9 inches since ~1880…

Here is another person (Elon Musk) with a very similar view:

Watch from 2:29-2:54 (35 seconds).

Posted to YouTube ~June 2013.

So Elon and I are apparently “smug” and both him and I have a “superiority complex”…

Right…

May I ask what you base your world view on?

 

[nwdiver]

A car with a trailer is fine for light household tasks. Back in the 1950's and '60's that was a popular solution in the U.S. Pickups were reserved for work duty.

Nowadays the typical suburbanite has bigger jobs.

Not good for carbon emissions, I know. Let's hope Elon gets his bad-ass solar powered electric pickup that can out tow these belching behemoths on the market soon.

GSP

yep....

Yes... we still need diesel powered vehicles (for now)... BUT; they need to be used sparingly and responsibly.

I don't think anyone here has an issue with trucks being used for 'truck stuff'... just an issue with trucks being used for 'car stuff'.... which most of them are.... most of the time... ~70% of the vehicles in the parking lot where I work are trucks used for commuting.... that's a problem.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

Because it's single axle and the towball limit is probably no more than 80kg for that car. If you don't distribute the load evenly (and 410kg isn't much stuff compared to the space it can hold, and we all know no one overloads trailers) it's just plain not safe. Just looking at the picture makes me cringe. It's not level at all and the weight on the towball is clearly not balanced. Even evening out the load won't fix that -- it's probably an empty trailer -- and you can't raise the hitch on that car. It's clearly mismatched.

I haven’t really done the math for all of this.

I think it’s a bit difficult to draw too many conclusions from that picture. The trailer is on gravel and the Golf is on grass. And maybe there’s some optical illusion at play.

But I guess it’s possible that the Swedish regulatory authorities don’t really know what they’re doing… They usually do though.


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And:

One of the biggest hurdles Tesla needs to overcome to increase acceptance of electric vehicles is the smug, how dare you not share my world view, superiority complex of some owners. It's a major turn-off to electrics for many people because they don't want to be lumped in with that crowd. /...

Source?

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

Painting and categorizing people based on one or more dimensions of their lifestyle or personality is almost always counterproductive and, frankly, just as childish as namecalling. It's a waste of air and opportunity.

Comedy on TMC is sometimes difficult. And I guess anything concerning mostly white middle-aged men is often somewhat sensitive.

Personally though I think it's hilarious. :wink:

 

[James Anders]

Same reason why in America there are Home Depots and Lowe's stores within 20 minutes of most people.

Same reason why many American's go to flea markets and garage sales.

There are many more cultural and lifestyle reasons.

 

[reddy]

Painting and categorizing people based on one or more dimensions of their lifestyle or personality is almost always counterproductive and, frankly, just as childish as namecalling. It's a waste of air and opportunity.

Brian,

Sorry, but you're missing a big factor in how marketing is done in the USA. Your car IS a fashion statement, and it DOES say something about you.

I can can recommend several psychology texts to you if you want to understand more.

And, while you seem to be particularly sensitive about bringing it up, failure to acknowledge the subconscious basis for our fashion choices is a deficiency in your analysis.