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Why I'm Scared to Leave My Tesla At Home

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,127
7,127
Boise, ID
Nope. Oversized that one due to the location of the 14-50 box. That way I can turn that outlet into a junction box if need be without running additional wiring or install a HPWC if I wanted. Don't worry, the #4 wiring supports 60A so it's not just a breaker. It's truly a 60A circuit and not just a 60A breaker.
So you did actually do that. It's a code violation. You cannot have a 50 amp outlet type on a 60A breaker. Code is very specifically clear on that. It says the overcurrent protection device must be no higher than the rating of the outlet.

It's fine to have the oversized wiring in there right now to prepare to change it to something later, but you can't have that 60A breaker on it right now with that outlet. It needs to be changed to a 50A breaker to match the outlet for now.
 
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Yinn

Active Member
Nov 15, 2016
2,093
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Behind you
So you did actually do that. It's a blatant code violation. You cannot have a 50 amp outlet type on a 60A breaker. Code is very specifically clear on that. It says the overcurrent protection device must be no higher than the rating of the outlet.

My inspector didn't seem to have an issue with it - I did the work but its permitted and inspected. But that's good to know, I can certainly swap the breaker out to maintain code.There's no code that I'm aware of for upsizing wiring. LMK if I'm wrong.
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,127
7,127
Boise, ID
My inspector didn't seem to have an issue with it
Wow, that's kind of shocking. It's section 210.21(B)(1).
Advantages of Wall Connector vs Mobile Connector?

I did the work but its permitted and inspected. But that's good to know, I can certainly swap the breaker out to maintain code.There's no code that I'm aware of for upsizing wiring. LMK if I'm wrong.
Oh yeah, the wiring is totally fine. But it's the rule that the breaker has to not be over the outlet level so that if it starts drawing too much current for some reason, like a partial short in an appliance or something, it needs to be able to cut that off if it's starting to go above the outlet rating.
 

MXLRplus

Active Member
Mar 11, 2020
1,590
2,438
Eastvale, CA
Blame the owner because the parasitic loss is the highest of any EV sold today?

The people who post here are crazy. Myself included. ;)
 
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Yinn

Active Member
Nov 15, 2016
2,093
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Behind you
Wow, that's kind of shocking. It's section 210.21(B)(1).
Advantages of Wall Connector vs Mobile Connector?


Oh yeah, the wiring is totally fine. But it's the rule that the breaker has to not be over the outlet level so that if it starts drawing too much current for some reason, like a partial short in an appliance or something, it needs to be able to cut that off if it's starting to go above the outlet rating.

That makes sense. Not sure why he let it slide. It's a 5min swap so not a big deal to stay compliant and since I have the 60A already I'll just swap it whenever I change the box or replace with a HPWC
 
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DCGOO

Active Member
Nov 24, 2015
1,512
896
Indianapolis, IN
That makes sense. Not sure why he let it slide. It's a 5min swap so not a big deal to stay compliant and since I have the 60A already I'll just swap it whenever I change the box or replace with a HPWC

I did exactly the same thing, except I used #6 wire. Started with 14-50 and 50 amp breaker. Replaced the 50 w a 60 amp breaker and feed two WC on the same circuit (load shared). WC configured for 48 amps. No permit required since I did the work myself.
 

dgatwood

Member
Dec 20, 2017
804
880
Sunnyvale, ca
Can you elaborate please? Is it tripping a GFI/GFCI breaker on the panel? Or is it tripping a GFCI outlet? Or has it done both?

GFCI outlet.


Have you done electrical tests on the circuit to see what comes back? Average draw? Peak? Or a ground fault test? Using an actual tester not the button the switch

That's a good idea. No, I haven't, but it wouldn't he hard to do.


Can you also take a picture of the electrical box and the wires coming out of the box? It sounds like you have an older home based on the 100A. So it's also entirely possible you have a breakage in the wires that's causing a fault.

Actually, the reason for the low amperage is that it's a mobile home, and they wired it for what the 1970s-era wires leading up to the pedestal can handle. The home itself is fairly recent, and IIRC, the grounding rod is as well.

BTW, with the inverter unplugged and cabin overheat protection turned off, my phantom drain is only about a mile per day now. I think I'm just not going to ever turn that back on. :)
 
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Vaillant

Member
Jul 19, 2019
257
271
Sunnyvale, CA
I have a thought. If you set the car to only draw 4 amps, it seems like it would be perfectly safe to use a heavy duty extension cord plugged into a non-GFCI outlet that you plug you charger into. You wouldn’t want to draw 12 amps, and maybe not even 8, but at 4, that can’t pose a risk, right?
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,127
7,127
Boise, ID
I have a thought. If you set the car to only draw 4 amps,
The interface of the car won't let you go lower than 5A.
it seems like it would be perfectly safe to use a heavy duty extension cord plugged into a non-GFCI outlet that you plug you charger into. You wouldn’t want to draw 12 amps, and maybe not even 8, but at 4, that can’t pose a risk, right?
But yes, that should be fine. I would even be fine with 8 or 10 generally.
 

jerry33

(S85-3/2/13 traded in) X LR: F2611##-3/27/20
Mar 8, 2012
19,631
22,278
Texas
Unfortunately, the national electric code requires GFCI for all outdoor outlets, so unless you have an enclosed garage, you don't really have a choice.
Not an issue. Just plug inside the garage and run the cable under the garage door (with a suitable slot cut for the cable in the concrete. This has worked very well for me for over seven years.
Plugged_in.jpg
 
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Yinn

Active Member
Nov 15, 2016
2,093
1,875
Behind you
Not an issue. Just plug inside the garage and run the cable under the garage door (with a suitable slot cut for the cable in the concrete. This has worked very well for me for over seven years. View attachment 579150

I mean it technically works. I do the same thing for my 20ft wall charger. But I’m sure someone smarter than me will cite that this is a violation of some NEC code as well.

Ultimately a GFCI breaker protects against wet shorts. Plugging a wall charger inside and the car outside defeats that protection with essentially a really long extension cord.

I’d argue that its just as if not even more unsafe than using a weatherproof outdoor 14-50 enclosure with a no. GFI breaker.
 

dmurphy

Woof.
Dec 7, 2018
3,478
4,687
New Jersey - Morris County
I mean it technically works. I do the same thing for my 20ft wall charger. But I’m sure someone smarter than me will cite that this is a violation of some NEC code as well.

Ultimately a GFCI breaker protects against wet shorts. Plugging a wall charger inside and the car outside defeats that protection with essentially a really long extension cord.

I’d argue that its just as if not even more unsafe than using a weatherproof outdoor 14-50 enclosure with a no. GFI breaker.

All the more reason I think that those of us stuck parking outdoors really should consider the HPWC. It's just a "cleaner" solution.

What @jerry33 did works, but I don't particular like chiseling into the garage apron; the additional opening for bugs/rodents/debris/etc alone is reason enough for me not to want to do that, let alone any safety concerns.
 

jerry33

(S85-3/2/13 traded in) X LR: F2611##-3/27/20
Mar 8, 2012
19,631
22,278
Texas
I mean it technically works. I do the same thing for my 20ft wall charger. But I’m sure someone smarter than me will cite that this is a violation of some NEC code as well.

Ultimately a GFCI breaker protects against wet shorts. Plugging a wall charger inside and the car outside defeats that protection with essentially a really long extension cord.

I’d argue that its just as if not even more unsafe than using a weatherproof outdoor 14-50 enclosure with a no. GFI breaker.
If you look at the mobile connector, you'll see a control box which will cut power if it senses any issues. Not the same as an extension cord at all.
 

Uncle Paul

Well-Known Member
Nov 1, 2013
6,254
6,775
Canyon Lake,CA
Guys. It is obvious that OP does not want to spend the money necessary to have safe and effective at home charging. Everything seems to be about the money, and he does not want to spend any.

His default will always be back to getting free charging elsewhere, and complaining that his at home options suck.

I know what houses are worth in Sunnyvale, and do not suspect that our Tesla owner is poor.
 
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Yinn

Active Member
Nov 15, 2016
2,093
1,875
Behind you
Guys. It is obvious that OP does not want to spend the money necessary to have safe and effective at home charging. Everything seems to be about the money, and he does not want to spend any.

His default will always be back to getting free charging elsewhere, and complaining that his at home options suck.

I know what houses are worth in Sunnyvale, and do not suspect that our Tesla owner is poor.

I had to look it up. Median home price: $1.5M. What’s the median price of a Tesla? We’ll go used...$50k?

Somewhere someone who’s making ends meet on $35,000 a year is rolling their eyes.
 
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