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Why is using gas not looked at as a grid usage?

Discussion in 'Energy, Environment, and Policy' started by h2ofun, Jan 3, 2021.

  1. getakey

    getakey Member

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    Not trying to go down that rabbit hole, but there was an analysis done by Tesla several years ago. I believe the report was entitled "From Well to Wheel" which showed the entire supply chain for an EV compared to ICE. You might want to look it up.
     
    • Like x 1
  2. Ampster

    Ampster Active Member

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    The direction I am moving in is to reduce or eliminate my gas usage as I have done with gasoline. Then, with the help of batteries, self consume as much of my solar as possible. On a limited basis I am able to convenience charge my EVs from solar during the day, but the bulk of their consumption does come from the grid. My only expense for grid power is the Minimum Delivery Charges and some Non Bypassable Charges.

    I do think you might want to inform your opinion after reading the article @getakey linked to. Then do some reading about some recent efforts by JB Straubel to recycle used Lithium batteries.
     
  3. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    It depends on how you define grid. Most people think of it as the electric grid.

    Also, don't confuse "off-grid" with "green" energy. You can be off-grid and run generators and heaters with fossil fuels. That's off-grid but not green.
     
    • Like x 2
  4. h2ofun

    h2ofun Active Member

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    Your neighbor was just plain dumb and rude! I ran my generator a few hours a day, and sure did not run it at night. With that said, I did get some thing defrosting, but, to run it all night, and gas, .....
     
  5. h2ofun

    h2ofun Active Member

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    Guess what, I only eat vanilla, surprised ? :)
     
  6. h2ofun

    h2ofun Active Member

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    Lets see. I have a 1990 mazda with 118K miles. I drive like 1000 miles a year. Could me buying a EV save me money in my lifetime?
     
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  7. h2ofun

    h2ofun Active Member

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    I agree, but when I see the but I have a zero true up cost, implying no overall energy cost. Bottom line life is a journey, and who dies with the most toys, wins. :)
     
  8. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    What does this mean?
    "when I see the but I have a zero true up cost"

    "who dies with the most toys, wins" That's the problem with capitalism. The environment loses.
     
  9. charlesj

    charlesj Active Member

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    Consumer Reports supports this. :)
     
  10. charlesj

    charlesj Active Member

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    Plain or add chocolate syrup and strawberries?;)
     
  11. jjrandorin

    jjrandorin Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums

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    I said this in the other thread, but this also is not a "tesla energy" thread, it is a "energy, environment and policy" thread. A discussion on "why dont people consider gas to be pulling from "the grid" has nothing to do with tesla energy, and is a general energy discussion.
     
  12. h2ofun

    h2ofun Active Member

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    Plain only :)
     
  13. jjrandorin

    jjrandorin Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums

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    (moderator note: moved thread to energy section as it is a discussion on general energy topic. Left 3 day re direct so post can be found by those browsing original location for 3 days)
     
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  14. DHevey

    DHevey Member

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    I had the benefit of designing my home. The electrical service is separated into two 200 amp panels, both fed by the grid, but one with 22 kW of PV and five Powerwalls. For all intents and purposes, the PV panel is "off grid", feeding all essential circuits, including master bedroom heat pump, refrigerator, lights, dryer.....everything important. My hot water heater is electric and has a supplemental solar thermal heating system under my metal roof (And under my thin film solar panels). For this panel, I am off-grid 99% of the time, but I leave the grid connected so that I can sell back excess. There are several days a year where I switch over to the grid because we have had multiple days in a row of rain, little production and normal consumption.

    The other, on-grid panel services my pool pumps, several other heat pumps, and other, non essential circuits. In the end, I produce about 75% of my electrical consumption. I have natural gas service for cook top stove and gas fireplaces, all of which I could do without if we had an extended outage.
     
  15. Ampster

    Ampster Active Member

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    We are in a transition. Natural gas was a popular form of ilumination in cities before Edison invented the light bulb. It is still an efficient form of heat. It has become more efficient with combined cycle power plants and it is cleaner than coal. It may be cleaner than burning gasoline in vehicles. In California the new building codes favor the use of electricity in the form of heat pumps to water and
     
  16. charlesj

    charlesj Active Member

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    You lucky guy.;) How much more do you have to heat that hot water you are getting from water company? :D

    I just couldn't help myself.
     
    • Funny x 1
  17. nwdiver

    nwdiver Well-Known Member

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    My incoming water is ~283K.... far too cold for me to shower with but I supposed that is 'hot' relatively speaking. ;)
     
  18. charlesj

    charlesj Active Member

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    Yes, it is. :D
     
  19. David_Cary

    David_Cary Active Member

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    Being off grid is probably not really the green solution. Lots of extra panels and then large batteries that have to be produced. It is still a goal to strive for but not with huge overproduction and huge batteries.
    That being said, I built to keep the heat needs very low as I know winter - particularly cloudy winter days - is the biggest challenge.
    I have gotten close to net zero energy - not quite the same as off-grid - only EVs, heat pumps etc and our family used 16.7 MWH and generated 12.7 MWH. I could have done NG heat and December/Jan would still be tough because of the EVs.
    Not sure I can get away with 66 degrees in the winter but we aren't much higher.
    Don't forget to drive a little slower in the winter....
    My best play to be off-grid would be to use public or super charging. I have a free L2 in walking distance ... but alas, my $500 a year in grid maintenance and electricity wouldn't pay for batteries - and the time lost walking back and forth to the L2.
     
  20. h2ofun

    h2ofun Active Member

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    So far wife lets me keep mini splits at 64. I just wear long underwear during the day, and a nice electric blanket at night. Until I get into teh spring and see how use vs production is, will see if next year I can kick to 66 and still end up with a zero or negative true up
     

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