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Why not go all the way and offer 60/65/70/75/80/85/90, $3k each?

Discussion in 'Model S' started by tonglaji, Jun 10, 2016.

  1. tonglaji

    tonglaji Member

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    With the software capability to limit batteries as such, offering a wide range of battery options cost Tesla nothing, but allow them to fully address the market from 60 to the top end, even with the upcoming 100. This way more people could spend money on options, which are generally more profitable, and they can unlock the battery incrementally at their choosing. In the end, when the car is turned in, Tesla can still recoup the remaining unlock battery on the CPO sales.

    Speaking of options, ludicrous mode available on all 80 and up could potentially generate a lot cash at $5000 each.
     
  2. mikeash

    mikeash Active Member

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    Too many choices can make customers unhappy, because they're afraid of choosing the wrong thing, and can complicate the decision process to the extent that people abandon their purchase altogether. I like the idea, but this may be too much flexibility.
     
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  3. TexasEV

    TexasEV Active Member

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    Too complicated and not necessary.
     
  4. xav-

    xav- Member

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    Tesla is not guaranteed to recoup its money at resell. They will recoup their money if bump in resale value is higher than their cost of battery upgrade now. There is no guarantee for that, especially for people who will hold their car for the long term.

    Another drawback for tesla is that would suggest 90 buyers to downgrade. Why not try the lower range first and upgrade later if absolutely necessary?

    Not saying I disagree with you all the way (especially with stuff like ludicrous!), but I think batteries being so expensive this has a cost. E.g putting a 90kw battery in a 60 without a significant price increase would involve a lot of losses.

    It's interesting because everyone calls the strategy that tesla does with the new 60 brilliant yet 3 days ago when this was all rumored on Reddit and here I remember seeing a lot of posts stating that "would not make sense for tesla", and that it "was not going to happen" etc :)
     
  5. tonglaji

    tonglaji Member

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    I was not suggesting putting one battery in all cars. the 75kwh battery can be used for all models up to 75. Then the 90 can be used on the higher tier, with the ludicrous mode only available on the higher tier like today.
     
  6. freeewilly

    freeewilly Member

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    Too complicated, just reading your title gives me a headache.
     
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  7. FlatSix911

    FlatSix911 918 Hybrid

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    From a marketing standpoint, just stick with 3 simple options ... 60/75/90 in 15kW increments :cool:
     
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  8. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    And 105. Okay.... 100 if you can't get 105. But 105 would really be good. :)
     
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  9. SW2Fiddler

    SW2Fiddler Bannd Member

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    Sixty. Seventy. Ninety.
    And soon, Eleventy.
    60 - 70 - 90 - 110
     
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  10. KJD

    KJD Member

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    I would rather have only 3 choices.
    60 - 90 -120.
     
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  11. esk8mw

    esk8mw Active Member

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    Once the GF is up and humming, producing vast amounts of cheaper batteries, they should introduce a 150. I can't count the number of people in middle America who feel EVs are not viable until the range matches/exceeds ICE (i.e., like 400 miles). The first 3 questions I am always asked, no matter what, is what's the range, where do I charge and what happens when the battery runs out.

    It's not that 400 miles of range are actually needed, it's that this is needed for some people to get over the mental hurdle. Once EV adoption is widespread then people can be eased back to the ranges we all live with currently, once they realize 2-300 is perfectly fine.
     
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  12. Moneesh

    Moneesh Member

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    My 90 entered entered production this week, I wonder if during the 4 week gestation period, if it will come out as an 100 or 110.
     
  13. SW2Fiddler

    SW2Fiddler Bannd Member

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    Sounds like Schrödinger's Pack.

    (and congrats on your car!)
     
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  14. iridium

    iridium Member

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    I'd actually like to have the option to rent range. A 60 is perfectly fine for most of the year, but it would be great to pay to unlock the 75 range for a week or two for road trips.
     
  15. STbreaker

    STbreaker Member

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    Primarily, I just think it would expose how little difference there is between those specs. The base downgrade from 70 to 60 only resulted in about 20 fewer miles of range. Obviously they have the ability to do what you proposed, but I think it would:
    1) infuriate the potential customer base. People are OK with the 60 limited 75 because it allows them to come in at a cheaper price point, but going beyond that just makes it look like a microtransaction money grab. They going to be adding $3K for every 15-20 miles of range?
    2) Frustrate owner advisors. Obviously they are really friendly because they want to get you to commit but imagine all the texts, emails, calls, etc. they would get about 65 vs 70 vs 75. With this direct buy concept, I already had enough stupid sounding questions to keep mine busy and range was not one of them.
    3) Create issues at Tesla. Currently they seem to be having some difficulty sorting out who is a 70 vs 75. Imagine if you had all those options

    4) Maybe most importantly, it would overload this forum. Now the options are far enough apart that most people can make the decision on their own. With all those options there might be a new thread every 10 minutes with people asking what they should get.
     
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  16. Superloud

    Superloud Member

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    $3000 / 5kWh = 600 $ / kWh

    (this is the same rate tesla charges after purchase to go from 60 to 75 kWh : $9000 / 15 = 600)

    It's just so expensive. If that's the real cost of the battery, then a 60kWh battery costs 600 X 60 = $36000

    It's funny to think, if the model 3 comes out with a 60 battery, at a base price of $35k, the battery will cost more than the price of the car! ;-)

    What I'm trying to say is, these incremental battery increase options just seem like a horrible value. Tesla shouldn't charge so much IMO
     
  17. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    You're missing the point. First... Telsa is not making money. So... You can't claim that on whole they're overcharging unless you feel that bankruptcy is the best way to promote the ev industry.

    But yes...the incremental cost of the added capacity is high. It's obviously because they're undercharging the buyers of the lower capacity cars. They're doing it to get them in the door, hoping they'll upgrade and to fill out production volume.

    If you think about it, the cost difference between a 70k 60D and a 140k P90D is probably $3000 worth of battery and another 3000 worth of motor inverter and then a few bucks for the higher end frippery. I'd guess that the incremental cost difference is less than 10k. If the cost of production compared to selling price is a measure of value, the folks getting the 60s are getting a fantastic deal.
     
  18. Superloud

    Superloud Member

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    That is not a good argument at all. Just because tesla may be losing money as a whole, due to heavy investment in stuff like the gigafactory, is no reason for buyers to be willing to pay too much for a product. Tesla still sells a model S sedan for more money than it costs them to build it.

    I'm simply saying I think their price is too steep when paying for pure range. Of all the options you can click on when you build your tesla, that's IMO one of the, if not the poorest value return for your money. Which is why I believe Elon once said himself that nobody should get the range upgrade unless they *need* the range (I think he was talking about going from a 85 to a 90)
     
  19. weak_pig

    weak_pig Member

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    Why not implement 1kW increments from 60, 61, 62, til 90? :cool:
     
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  20. Shawn Snider

    Shawn Snider Member

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    I want my Badge to say EleventyD
     
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