Wifi - explanation for poor reception?

[odddiv]

I've searched and read all the threads on people with model 3s and wifi issues, and have never had any success in getting mine to reliably connect, since day one. In fact, I've had a service ticket in for 2 months now over it. Yesterday the mobile tech finally made it out, so i thought I'd document some of what we found.

Background - I work in the consumer electronics industry and do a lot of work specifically with and around wifi and wifi testing. My home currently has 5 hardwired access points. 3 ubiquiti unifi, an Asus RT-AC68U, and an xfinity DOCISS 3.1. The unifi is my primary system, I use the Asus for testing, and comcast refuses to allow you to disable the xfinity. I have a unifi AP ~18 feet from where my car is parked, mounted to the ceiling, with one wall between. The ASUS is about 30 feet away, through 2 walls.

The car, since I took delivery, has been unable to see ANY of my APs. Sitting in the car, using my phone (OnePlus 6T), i can see 12 APs (neighbors + my own) with decent signal level. I could get it to tether to my phone with the phone in the car, with poor signal.

The service tech that came out did some testing and swapped passenger side mirror assemblies (the antenna is in there, if you didn't know. We got it connect to my unifi system (yay!) and I went back in to check the connection out. Unifi was reporting a -48dBm connection - outstanding. Problem solved. The tech said he tested the old assembly and it tested good, but he didn't specify how he tested it, or what good was. But since it was working now, great! While he was reassembling the car, though, I noticed that after placing the mirror assembly cover back on the indicator in the car went from full signal to low. Checking back on the Unifi controller, it was now reporting -62dBm. The car was not moved, nothing changed but the replacement of the cover.

After the tech left, I moved the car to various locations and angles in my driveway and checked signal levels. When backed in (passenger side of car facing house and AP, antenna facing AWAY) i got very poor connection -85dBm, but it was still connecting. When pulling straight in (antenna opposite side of car from AP, angled at ~35 degrees away from AP) it will not connect at all. At an angle in the driveway, with the antenna facing directly towards the AP, I can get the same -62dBm I got when the tech was there.

Really long story, summarized: I don't know what material the mirror assembly cover is made of, but it's blocking ~14dBm of signal at 90 degrees. That is not insignificant. The location of the antenna - front side of the assembly, angled to follow the curve of the assembly - also may play a factor. I didn't get to examine the antenna itself, but the radiation pattern does not look optimal. This may also be caused by the material of the cover - at oblique angles more of the material is between the antenna and AP.

 

[jroydog]

This helps account for some poor reception I've noticed. I back into a spot in front of my house so the access point is behind the mirror. I seem to pick up a lot of networks that I thought were next door but based on your comment, I'm guessing they are probably the houses opposite mine. So then you get out of the car and the mirrors fold and the antenna is now pointing out towards the woods...

Basically, if you are having wifi issues, try pointing the front of the car towards your AP and turn off mirror folding.

 

[bedoig]

I'll admit I came into this thread to say something snarky, but great post. My connection is poor, but acceptable, whereas my wifi cams that are very close have great signal. Good detective work.

 

[mswlogo]

I’ve seen weird issues with WiFi too. I also have an ASUS AC68U and it is mounted on a wall that is shared with the garage. And it’s just sheet rock. Any time I want Range or strong signal I typically use 2.4ghz ( I use separate SSID for 2.4 and 5). But 3.4ghz was very low on the car. 1 bar. Phone or anything else has 5. I switched it to 5ghz (which is typically weaker than 2.4ghz) and the car got 3 bars. So I left it on that and it’s been fine. But it definitely has odd reception capability.

 

[RayK]

Basically, if you are having wifi issues, try pointing the front of the car towards your AP and turn off mirror folding.

TeslaCam & WiFi problems
WiFi extender please help

 

[molder101]

I thought I had wifi (antenna) issues with the car, but it works fine on my wifi at work, so I'm guessing it's some setting on my home wifi.

In the meantime, I simply use 4g at home and get my updates via work wifi ;-)

Moral of the story is... see if it works well at other wifi locations... may be similar to my circumstance.

 

[Thunder7ga]

I found that mine hated the 5ghz band.....so I disabled it on the WAP in the garage so it will only connect at 2.4ghz and the car has been solid ever since. The signal strength and quality of the signal was bouncing all over the place on the 5ghz band....when it shouldn't as the WAP is on the ceiling in the center of the garage.

 

[ngogas]

Mine is the same issues. Connects but signal isn’t strong. But been getting software updates so not worried. It works and does what it needs.

 

[annetoneyo]

In case anyone has issues receiving updates, I encountered this problem recently.

My router is dual band, so I have 2.4 & 5 GHz SSIDs. About a month ago, I connected to the 5 GHz network. After connecting, I stopped receiving SW updates. I couldn't figure out why because I had signal on 5 GHz, but no updates. After a month of no updates, I switched back to 2.4 GHz network, and I immediately received an update. The following day, I received a 2nd update. Moral of the story, use 2.4 GHz instead of the 5 GHz network.

 

[OCR1]

I just checked my connections and here is what I found. I’m using Google Wifi in a three node mesh configuration.

My 2018 Model 3 is connected at 5GHz.

My 2019 Model 3 is connected at 2.4GHz.

Neither Model 3 has received the latest software update, so I don’t know that I can conclude much from this. I’m not sure if there is any way with Google Wifi to tell a specific device to only connect via 2.4GHz. Does anyone know if this can be done?

 

[annetoneyo]

I just checked my connections and here is what I found. I’m using Google Wifi in a three node mesh configuration.

My 2018 Model 3 is connected at 5GHz.

My 2019 Model 3 is connected at 2.4GHz.

Neither Model 3 has received the latest software update, so I don’t know that I can conclude much from this. I’m not sure if there is any way with Google Wifi to tell a specific device to only connect via 2.4GHz. Does anyone know if this can be done?

Do you have two SSIDs for the networks? At my house, I have two SSID. One for the 2.4 and one for the 5 GHz network. I would start by changing the names so that you can tell the car which one to connect to.

Something like: WiFi_Network_24 and WiFi_Network_5. Then you can tell the car to connect to the 2.4 GHz network.

 

[devilmountain]

5+ access points a house sounds excessive and the radios maybe interfering with one another. Just with my own experience here. I don't know your brand of access points or their features. Make sure it doesn't have a defender mode/air marshal turned on or white list your other SSIDs. With so many access points in a confined space change the channel width to 20 Mhz wide. Raise your minimum bitrate to at least 12Mbps.

Just some suggestions for dense environments. I use Open Mesh and Cisco networking equipment. I just installed a small Open Mesh in my garage. Turned the power down to minimum settings so it won't interfere with my other access points in the house.

 

[PhotonicCannon]

I have a 5ghz access point 36 unobstructed inches away from the driver's side mirror... and I only get 3 bars. I have never ever seen all four bars. Also, I have never gotten an update. ( Still running 2019.7)

Perhaps the metal flake in the paint on the mirror cover diffuses and deflects wifi signals.

 

[Petrlol]

I have unifi aps as well, and also have separate ssid for 2.4 and 5ghz. 5ghz shows as better signal but it was flaky. 2.4 shows as 1 bar but is stable.

That being said looking at the strength of the signal inside of the Unifi controller is shows the exact opposite of the cars wifi indicator. 2.4 is a very good connection, where 5.0 is bad, which explains the flakiness.

I have all my channels optimized and the 5ghz works great on my other 23 devices...

 

[odddiv]

I am seriously considering trying to pick up a mirror assembly off ebay or somewhere and bringing it into my lab to do some real testing on it.
Also to note - my car is plain black, no metal flake.
For those that think the 5 APs i have at home are a bit excessive - I can see 83 unique SSIDs from my house. A lot of engineers I've talked to say my situation is an extreme outlier case, but... I live in a neighborhood full of retirees - not in a high density condo full of millennials. As time goes on and more and more people and things get connected to wifi the amount of noise will get exponentially worse. The real world is a mess when it comes to wifi, and when your Tesla is depending on your home wifi for updates... We need solutions.

 

[focher]

5+ access points a house sounds excessive and the radios maybe interfering with one another.

I would assume that anyone with that many APs has experience in setting up an effective wireless network. I have 5 Unifi APs and can guarantee it's optimally configured for my property. Unifi makes it easy by performing RF scans across both 2.4GHz and 5GHz bands, plus using a building floorplan with wall settings to incorporate signal degradation due to signal blocking. You can then either reduce the power settings manually or automatically configuring everything based on those scans.

I think it's as much of a problem that most people just have consumer-grade wireless access points that default to the max power setting, so if you're surrounded by such neighbors then you have to account for all that interference.

 

[jaxtripp]

Do you by chance have a hidden SSID? I have a hidden SSID and had problems connecting to my home WIFI even though my router is less than 25ft from where I park my car. I ended up having to un-hide my SSID, then the car connected immediately. After the car connected, I hid the SSID again and the car still connects to the network without any issues. Hope that helps someone.

 

[Karoliina]

I am experiencing almost the same kind of problem, and even though we have two hard wire AP's (just got another one because of this wifi problem), the car does not find any AP's. My phone (OnePlus 6T) finds a bunch of them, also from the neighbours.
I love driving my car, and don't regret buying it, but have already two problems to talk about in January when I got an appointment at Tesla. The other problem is constant flickering and darkening of the screen when entering the car (I think it might be every time I have preheated the car using my phone).

 

[QS01]

Turn off beam forming.. that can cause all sorts of problems with various devices...

I have an ASUS ac5300 router upstairs in our loft. My 2020 M3 has no problems at all connecting to WiFi when I am in my driveway (ap has to go through 4 walls and the floor between upstairs and downstairs. When parking in the garage, I got through an additional 2 walls before it gets too the car -- and it doesn't matter if I pull in straight or back in.

and I agree with the previous poster, 3 different WiFi systems is a lot - especially for anything on the 2.4 ghz system as there isn't enough channels to go around without having major collisions (there's only 3 channels that you can use simultaneously in 2.4ghz). Combine that with additional APs if your in a neighborhood and 2.4 ghz is a complete mess.

 

[Temiatwork]

Has any of you guys tried using your mobile phone as hotspot from inside the car? This never fails for me downloading all updates.