Wifi Router chatter

[d21mike]

Thank you!! I have been at my wits end with this WiFi coverage issue since I got my car. Sounds like I have a lot of research to do! I am so pessimistic that I'll ever get anything to work, at this point. I know there has to be a solution. My issue is caused by where the router/modem is and where my garage is. The house is a one story but with a basement (a little less than 8000 sq ft. area, of course not counting garage) so that is the problem. I am just glad there are so many technical advances lately, I am probably going to find a solution that will work for me but it's been pretty frustrating. So, thank you for your advice. I will definitely check the Google WiFi out!

Since I recommended Google Wifi. Let me caution you that they want to be your main router to get all the features which could be a problem for you if you want to keep using the Comcast Router (gateway). If you are pretty much tied into Comcast with the Gateway and TV Service etc. you should either go with their Pods or get a Mesh Network that can run in bridge mode behind your gateway. Like a separate network. And then maybe disable Wifi on the Gateway since it would not be needed. You also mentioned the New Gateway has better coverage. I strongly recommend a Mesh Network. A single Wifi Router no matter how good will not cover you 8000 sq ft area.

 

[CBPfromTN]

Since I recommended Google Wifi. Let me caution you that they want to be your main router to get all the features which could be a problem for you if you want to keep using the Comcast Router (gateway). If you are pretty much tied into Comcast with the Gateway and TV Service etc. you should either go with their Pods or get a Mesh Network that can run in bridge mode behind your gateway. Like a separate network. And then maybe disable Wifi on the Gateway since it would not be needed. You also mentioned the New Gateway has better coverage. I strongly recommend a Mesh Network. A single Wifi Router no matter how good will not cover you 8000 sq ft area.

OK, I am not quite sure what you just said but I take it I need a "mesh network" and I don't know what the rest of what you said means. I did just order the Google WiFi and was reading on one of the reviews that someone did what you said about disabling WiFi on the gateway. I read that on the review earlier and had no clue how to do THAT. We don't need the WiFi signal in the entire area of the house but I do want to get the WiFi signal from the Comcast/Xfinity gateway in my husband's office to the garage where my car is. The other areas where we might use WiFi but don't necessarily need it (like most of the basement) aren't as important because we can use 4G. I decided to at least try the Google WiFi. I ordered a package of three from Amazon and it will be delivered tomorrow.
Do you have any suggestions how to disable the WiFi on the Comcast/Xfinity gateway by chance? The reviews on Amazon are so numerous, I am sure there are lots of people who subscribe to Comcast/Xfinity who have been able to successfully use the Google WiFi but I am sure they are all a lot smarter with this kind of thing than I wish I were. If it doesn't work GREAT, I will return them and I guess at that point I'll just have to wait on Xfinity to get their XFI gateway and PODS available to us who need them.
Also, would the Eero and Orbi WiFi systems going to work pretty much the same way the Google WiFi works and be easier to work with my Comcast/Xfinity gateway? If all the same, I hope the Google WiFi will work.
Thanks for taking the time to read all I wrote. Sorry for the lengthy message but appreciate any suggestions or hints. THANKS!

 

[CBPfromTN]

For CBPfromTN,

I have ordered a 3 pack of the XFi pods from Comcast/Xfinity they are due to arrive tomorrow... 4/20/2018

I currently have the Comcast/Xfinity Cisco DPC3941 cable modem router.
The XFi pods are supposed to be compatible with that modem and 2 others supplied by Comcast/Xfinity.

The "need" for the new XFi modem is only for extremely fast networks... Gigabit?
We certainly do not need that speed for updating our cars.

They also have an Xfi app for your iPhone which makes management of the network fairly straightforward.
I have used it. It makes the network management fairly easy.

I will let everyone know how I like it and how well it works in a few days.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I received 2018.14.2 last night. It installed in roughly 36 minutes.
My car is Model X 3/18 build and it has AP 2.5
I have not driven extensively with the new software.
It does seem a little different in that it does not seem to bounce back and forth
from the center to the outside of the lane as frequently as the earlier release... 2018.10.6

Shawn

Thank you so much, Shawn! I can't believe you're getting the PODS from Comcast already. How did you find out they were available in your area? I asked yesterday because a Comcast technician told my son who also lives in the Nashville area that HE needed the XFI PODS for his house so I assumed they must be available here but when I called Comcast to find out if my local Xfinity store had them in stock, even though the Filipino person I was speaking to assured me they WERE, I asked him to call my local store just to ask them in case they were "out of stock." Well, good thing I did because he came back and told me that they couldn't be purchased at the local store that I would have to order them online. Well, I went online and signed into my Comcast/Xfinity account and none of this is available to me in my area, currently. So...no one can tell me when we will get the XFI PODS but as I was reading about the new XFI system, it did say that you have to have the XFI Gateway in order to use the XFI PODS so I assumed I would need both.
I don't know if any of the people I speak to at Comcast/Xfinity know what they're talking about tho. The technician telling my son he needs the PODS but they aren't even available is weird.
Anyway, please do let us know how it works when you get it! I've gone ahead and ordered Google WiFi and spent about $300 so it better work and work GREAT or it's going back. Should be delivered tomorrow. We'll see. (I only ordered the Google WiFi because I have no idea when I'll EVER be able to get the XFI PODS....Now that I have ordered the Google WiFi, I am sure the XFI PODS will be available next week, but ONLY if the Google WiFi works for me

 

[d21mike]

OK, I am not quite sure what you just said but I take it I need a "mesh network" and I don't know what the rest of what you said means. I did just order the Google WiFi and was reading on one of the reviews that someone did what you said about disabling WiFi on the gateway. I read that on the review earlier and had no clue how to do THAT. We don't need the WiFi signal in the entire area of the house but I do want to get the WiFi signal from the Comcast/Xfinity gateway in my husband's office to the garage where my car is. The other areas where we might use WiFi but don't necessarily need it (like most of the basement) aren't as important because we can use 4G. I decided to at least try the Google WiFi. I ordered a package of three from Amazon and it will be delivered tomorrow.
Do you have any suggestions how to disable the WiFi on the Comcast/Xfinity gateway by chance? The reviews on Amazon are so numerous, I am sure there are lots of people who subscribe to Comcast/Xfinity who have been able to successfully use the Google WiFi but I am sure they are all a lot smarter with this kind of thing than I wish I were. If it doesn't work GREAT, I will return them and I guess at that point I'll just have to wait on Xfinity to get their XFI gateway and PODS available to us who need them.
Also, would the Eero and Orbi WiFi systems going to work pretty much the same way the Google WiFi works and be easier to work with my Comcast/Xfinity gateway? If all the same, I hope the Google WiFi will work.
Thanks for taking the time to read all I wrote. Sorry for the lengthy message but appreciate any suggestions or hints. THANKS!

The important thing to remember is you want to only have 1 router. A router is what routes internet traffic for all of your home devices to/from the internet. For Cable systems you need a Cable Modem and a Router. With a Gateway you have a combo Router/Modem (in a single device) which means if you add your Google Wifi Router you will then have 2 Routers. The best approach in this situation is to either put your Gateway Router/Modem in Bridge Modem which will disable the router portion and simply use it as a Modem. Or replace the Gateway Router/Modem with just a modem. If there is no problem with putting the Gateway Router in Bridge Mode then that should be fine. If you continue to have issues with this then maybe buying your own Modem and replacing the Gateway Router/Modem would be an option. A good option if you are paying monthly for the Gateway. You could discuss this with Comcast Customer Service to get advice on your setup.

Once the Gateway Router is in Bridge Mode then just connect one of the Google Wifi Devices (using ethernet cable included) to the Gateway and install as normal. After the first Google Wifi Device is working properly then you just install the next two. The install App will guide you to the best location to place the other two. You need a Google ID Login to set this up. I believe on the iPhone you use the Google Home App. If needed you can buy additional Google Wifi Device(s) to get more coverage. But try with 3 to start with.

Knowing customers want to use there own Routers Comcast was nice enough to write up this web page explaining how to do it. If you have a problem then contact Comcast Customer Service and reference this page and explain what you are trying to do. Putting it in Bridge Mode should also disable wifi on the Gateway. Your Google Wifi Mesh will have a single SSID for all three devices to share which will also include both 2.4ghz and 5ghz radio's.

Turn Bridge Mode On and Off on Your Wireless Gateway

=============================================================

Also on that page you will see this: I do not have Comcast but my understanding is that this features allows your home to be a public wifi hotspot for other Comcast customers. My understanding is it does not take away from your bandwidth. Not sure I would leave it active. You may want to review it.

Note: Enabling Bridge Mode does not disable the Xfinity WiFi Home Hotspot feature. If your Wireless Gateway has been enabled with the Xfinity WiFi Home Hotspot feature, and you wish to disable the Home Hotspot feature, you can learn more about turning your Xfinity WiFi Home Hotspot on or off.

 

[CBPfromTN]

The important thing to remember is you want to only have 1 router. A router is what routes internet traffic for all of your home devices to/from the internet. For Cable systems you need a Cable Modem and a Router. With a Gateway you have a combo Router/Modem (in a single device) which means if you add your Google Wifi Router you will then have 2 Routers. The best approach in this situation is to either put your Gateway Router/Modem in Bridge Modem which will disable the router portion and simply use it as a Modem. Or replace the Gateway Router/Modem with just a modem. If there is no problem with putting the Gateway Router in Bridge Mode then that should be fine. If you continue to have issues with this then maybe buying your own Modem and replacing the Gateway Router/Modem would be an option. A good option if you are paying monthly for the Gateway. You could discuss this with Comcast Customer Service to get advice on your setup.

Once the Gateway Router is in Bridge Mode then just connect one of the Google Wifi Devices (using ethernet cable included) to the Gateway and install as normal. After the first Google Wifi Device is working properly then you just install the next two. The install App will guide you to the best location to place the other two. You need a Google ID Login to set this up. I believe on the iPhone you use the Google Home App. If needed you can buy additional Google Wifi Device(s) to get more coverage. But try with 3 to start with.

Knowing customers want to use there own Routers Comcast was nice enough to write up this web page explaining how to do it. If you have a problem then contact Comcast Customer Service and reference this page and explain what you are trying to do. Putting it in Bridge Mode should also disable wifi on the Gateway. Your Google Wifi Mesh will have a single SSID for all three devices to share which will also include both 2.4ghz and 5ghz radio's.

Turn Bridge Mode On and Off on Your Wireless Gateway

=============================================================

Also on that page you will see this: I do not have Comcast but my understanding is that this features allows your home to be a public wifi hotspot for other Comcast customers. My understanding is it does not take away from your bandwidth. Not sure I would leave it active. You may want to review it.

Note: Enabling Bridge Mode does not disable the Xfinity WiFi Home Hotspot feature. If your Wireless Gateway has been enabled with the Xfinity WiFi Home Hotspot feature, and you wish to disable the Home Hotspot feature, you can learn more about turning your Xfinity WiFi Home Hotspot on or off.

Wow. You should be a teacher. Everything you have said makes sense and I do believe I can do this. I have someone who's been working with me from Comcast/Xfinity Tier 3 helping me with various issues I have been having for about 5 months now in regard to my TiVo equipment which I have finally given up on after no problems for three years for these particular TiVo units but I haven't been able to get "On Demand" since November. Anyway, they are going to activate my new Comcast X1 equipment tomorrow when I finish installing the X1 equipment and I may see if they can assist me in the disabling of WiFi on the gateway. I believe I have this!
Thank you and I will keep you posted. You have been SO helpful! Thank you!

 

[DoctorG]

I also have Eero, what about the guest network works better than the normal network for the car? I have the guest network enabled as well, but my cars are hooked to the normal network. Wondering if I should change it.

Yes as chillaban notes some DLNA media devices we have are apparently causing frequent disconnects. If your Tesla isn’t disconnecting from WiFi you don’t need to bother with the guest network trick.

 

[ShawnA]

Hi CBPfromTN,

I first learned about the xFi pods from withing the xFi app.
I read the "only available in limited markets" but that was 1/2 year ago...
I went to the Xfinity store without calling (was an excuse to drive the X) and they did not have them.
They instructed me to order online. I did that Wednesday April 18 and they are due by UPS today (April 20).

All of the Access Points and equipment mentioned here are good
I don't think you can go wrong.
It will be a matter of getting through the agony of setup and moving on.

Good luck with your new equipment!

Shawn

 

[ShawnA]

Update,

I did receive the xFi pods (set of 3) as expected.
The setup was easy and quick.
Yesterday my wife's Model S received the 2018.14.2 update.
It received the map files overnight through the xFi pods and is ready to go...

The xFi pods are nice, easy to set up, and work well.
They are NOT enterprise quality or power equipment...
If you need to stretch your wifi coverage a few rooms
to the garage they will work well for you.

Shawn

 

[whitex]

Before I was also trouble shooting this compatibility issue and had tried several brands' routers. Besides playing with guest networks, DLNA, UPnP, non 11N, and 20Mhz, I've also tried different IP ranges, and I ever settled on a specific IP range where the car would stay connected for a longer time but very shortly after some new devices easily broke the equilibrium. I couldn't root cause it. I ended up sticking a small access point (TP-LINK RE305, $15 used on eBay) to the wall, dedicating it to the car.

Yep, in addition to home charging (NEMA 14-50 and/or HPWC) Tesla should add a dedicated wifi router to its recommended accessories list. HEY! They should sell a Tesla branded one which they test with! Maybe even have one which doesn't require a wired connection but optionally uses you regular home wifi network as a WAN connection. Win-win for everyone, Tesla gets a high speed connection to the cars, saves on LTE usage, and customers get a reliable wifi just for their car(s).

PS) yes, I said wifi router, not just an access point since a NAT separated private network is required.

 

[Kant.Ing]

I didn't try D-Link routers for compatibility. But they look awesome! D-Link AC3200 Review: If Tesla Designed A Router, This Might Be It

Yep, in addition to home charging (NEMA 14-50 and/or HPWC) Tesla should add a dedicated wifi router to its recommended accessories list. HEY! They should sell a Tesla branded one which they test with! Maybe even have one which doesn't require a wired connection but optionally uses you regular home wifi network as a WAN connection. Win-win for everyone, Tesla gets a high speed connection to the cars, saves on LTE usage, and customers get a reliable wifi just for their car(s).

PS) yes, I said wifi router, not just an access point since a NAT separated private network is required.

 

[whitex]

I didn't try D-Link routers for compatibility. But they look awesome! D-Link AC3200 Review: If Tesla Designed A Router, This Might Be It

I don't think so. Lamborghini could go for such a router, though even their latest cars are much less jagged, but with nice smooth curves. For Tesla, think one of these with a red Tesla skin (or use one of the originals, or wrap it in the color of your car).

 

[bmah]

I don't think so. Lamborghini could go for such a router, though even their latest cars are much less jagged, but with nice smooth curves. For Tesla, think one of these with a red Tesla skin (or use one of the originals, or wrap it in the color of your car).

For Tesla, the AP body would be made out of aluminum (do WiFi signals even go through aluminum?). Better hope you don't drop or dent it because you'll be waiting six months for replacement body parts, if your insurance doesn't total it outright.

So out of curiosity what's the difference between the UAP-nanoHD and the UAP-AC-LITE? (I own three of the UAP-AC-LITE.)

Bruce.

 

[whitex]

For Tesla, the AP body would be made out of aluminum (do WiFi signals even go through aluminum?).

Radio signals do not travel through aluminium well - hence aluminium foil hats

So out of curiosity what's the difference between the UAP-nanoHD and the UAP-AC-LITE? (I own three of the UAP-AC-LITE.)

1. nano-HD just came out (still hard to find it anywhere in stock, some people sell it above MSRP). AC-LITE you can pick up below MSRP.
2. nanoHD implements 802.11ac Wave2 MU-MIMO (ability to simultaneously stream, with beam-forming, to up to 4 devices), while AC-LITE can only talk to a single device at a time (802.11ac Wave 1 standard).
3. nanoHD has higher max transmit power available
4. nano-HD has more processing power available (recommended and max users is almost 2x). I would also speculate that the guest separation would not impact the max perf as much (guest network requires the AP effectively do some fire-walling, so it does use more resources).
5. 5GHz radio is 4x4 MIMO on the nano-HD and only 2x2 on the AC-LITE, so half the max transmit rate. 2.4GHz MIMO is 2x2 on both
6. nano-HD has skins and a low profile ceiling mount (which I bet I could mount in a wall too) - both not yet available

If buying new, I would go for nano-HD over AC-LITE, but I wouldn't spend the money to upgrade unless I had noticed lack of performance. For home use internet access, 3 AC-LITE's probably give you all the coverage and speed you need (unless you throw large parties for 40+ people and provide a guest WiFi to all of them), or regularly do some large file transfers to/from internal home storage server.

 

[bmah]

If buying new, I would go for nano-HD over AC-LITE, but I wouldn't spend the money to upgrade unless I had noticed lack of performance. For home use internet access, 3 AC-LITE's probably give you all the coverage and speed you need (unless you throw large parties for 40+ people and provide a guest WiFi to all of them), or regularly do some large file transfers to/from internal home storage server.

Sounds good...I can save my pennies for some other toys then.

Thanks,

Bruce.

 

[whitex]

Quick update in case if it helps anyone. 5GHz band steering definitely doesn't play well with latest firmwares on the old MCU's. We have one old MCU and one new MCU, and had a dual bank 2.4GHz/5Ghz separated network just for the cars with the AP right above the cars, so 99% signal strength even for non-beam-forming, 802.11G-only old MCU. I noticed recently that the old MCU started not being able to stay connected again (continuous re-connect loop). I turned off the 5G completely and if fixed the issue (and the new new MCU of course dropped to 2.4GHz). Turned it back on, problem shows up immediately. Turned it off and problem gone. It seems the old MCU does something to indicate to the AP that it is 5GHz capable, so given the very high signal strength band steering resets the WiFi connection so that the car can connect to 5GHz. I'm betting they are sharing code with new MCU which has 5GHz support.

So, if you are connecting your old MCU car to a dual-band wifi network, turn off band steering (unfortunately this is often a global setting for all networks on a particular AP), or disable the 5GHz band.

PS> On Ubiquity Unify hardware, you have to reboot the AP after disabling the 5GHz band because it seems it caches some information from the old MCU capabilities from its 2.4GHz sessions.

 

[Cosmacelf]

I just don’t use band steering in my Ubiquiti set ups. I have a single SSID that spans both bands. I just set the power on the 2.4 GHz band to low or medium on most of the APs, however the garage one I have to set to high power since I use it when roaming around the yard at some distance.

So my old MCU car only connects at 2.4 ghz at 54 mbps. But so what, that works fine.

 

[Pale_Rider]

Quick update in case if it helps anyone. 5GHz band steering definitely doesn't play well with latest firmwares on the old MCU's. We have one old MCU and one new MCU, and had a dual bank 2.4GHz/5Ghz separated network just for the cars with the AP right above the cars, so 99% signal strength even for non-beam-forming, 802.11G-only old MCU. I noticed recently that the old MCU started not being able to stay connected again (continuous re-connect loop). I turned off the 5G completely and if fixed the issue (and the new new MCU of course dropped to 2.4GHz). Turned it back on, problem shows up immediately. Turned it off and problem gone. It seems the old MCU does something to indicate to the AP that it is 5GHz capable, so given the very high signal strength band steering resets the WiFi connection so that the car can connect to 5GHz. I'm betting they are sharing code with new MCU which has 5GHz support.

So, if you are connecting your old MCU car to a dual-band wifi network, turn off band steering (unfortunately this is often a global setting for all networks on a particular AP), or disable the 5GHz band.

PS> On Ubiquity Unify hardware, you have to reboot the AP after disabling the 5GHz band because it seems it caches some information from the old MCU capabilities from its 2.4GHz sessions.

Thanks, this problem had just popped up again for me too. I’ll give this a try.

 

[whitex]

I just don’t use band steering in my Ubiquiti set ups. I have a single SSID that spans both bands. I just set the power on the 2.4 GHz band to low or medium on most of the APs, however the garage one I have to set to high power since I use it when roaming around the yard at some distance.

So my old MCU car only connects at 2.4 ghz at 54 mbps. But so what, that works fine.

I use band steering to force phones to move to 5GHz. Without it, they pick up 2GHz first when approaching the house and they stay on it. I could try to set it to low, but then the old MCU car would not connect at all if parked in the driveway instead of in the garage.

 

[Cosmacelf]

I use band steering to force phones to move to 5GHz. Without it, they pick up 2GHz first when approaching the house and they stay on it. I could try to set it to low, but then the old MCU car would not connect at all if parked in the driveway instead of in the garage.

What kind of phones do you have? I find that all my iPhones get over to the 5 Ghz band, while the Androids (Galaxy-S8 and Galaxy-S7) stay on the 2.4 Ghz band. To some degree, does it matter a lot? It isn't as if you often do bandwidth intensive tasks on your phone.

 

[whitex]

What kind of phones do you have? I find that all my iPhones get over to the 5 Ghz band, while the Androids (Galaxy-S8 and Galaxy-S7) stay on the 2.4 Ghz band. To some degree, does it matter a lot? It isn't as if you often do bandwidth intensive tasks on your phone.

Different phones, though the biggest culprate and worst wifi reception is an iPhone X (two of then, both are horrible for WiFi). Had to add an access point to the house for them because they didn't work on 5G where other Android and older iPhones did just fine.

2.4GHz is really crowded where I live, hence the desire to stay on 5GHz. Secondary reason, max bandwidth is lower on 2.4G (about 30Mbps).