Will 10-50P Plug work with Tesla Wall Charger?

[rrolsbe]

I know Tesla sells a UMC2 10-30 adapter for use on a old style cloths dryer outlet. The wiring is two 120V hot wires and one neutral wire (which is tied to ground at the service panel). A 10-50 is wired the same as a 10-30 but typically has two 6AWG wires and one 8AWG wire for the neutral/gnd to handle the higher current. Several people have connected a 14-50P/cord to a Tesla wall charger which would be to hots and a ground. Has anyone attached either a 10-30P or 10-50P? i assume it would work? Thanks in advance for any assistance!

 

[ilyak]

Tesla does not make a NEMA 10-50 adapter, but there are third party ones. The usual warnings regarding using a 4-wire to 3-wire adapter apply, of course. Also be sure that the wiring will actually support a continuous 40A load. With this said, I use a 10-30 to 14-50 adapter from the same supplier without any issues.

 

[rrolsbe]

Thanks for the reply! i guess the real question is will the Tesla Wall charger see the neutral as gnd as does the car supplied UMC2? i can't see any reason why it would not? i guess I could install a 14-50 plug and make an adapter to convert it to a 10-50 or 10-30 plug but I still need to know for sure the neutral will be seen as a ground. Don't want to speed $500+ and be surprised when it does not work on a hot-hot-neutral (hot ground) circuit.

 

[iluvmacs]

Very likely it will be fine. It can't tell if that wire you connected to the neutral/ground bar in the panel is white or green. BUT... in some older houses, neutral wires were shared between circuits, perhaps even including a high-amperage receptacle such as a 10-50. In this case, it would be a pretty bad idea to connect the ground in the HPWC to a current-carrying conductor. This also happens in situations where your circuit is in a subpanel (where the neutral and ground must not be connected together)... this also creates a shared neutral for the run from the subpanel to the main panel. No bueno. Verify that your 10-50 has a dedicated neutral wire going to ground in the main panel. You can always convert the outlet to a 6-50 and "officially" change the wire to a ground wire if you want to really do this the right way (and Tesla even offers a 6-50 adapter if you are using the UMC).

 

[doghousePVD]

I've used 10-50 and 6-50 plugs to a 14-50 outlet to power my mobile connector without problems. Technically a 10-50 is "wrong" since it's a neutral, not a ground, but I had no problems.

I made my own adapters. I have at least half a dozen plugs, all terminating with a 14-50 outlet, so the UMC 14-50 can plug into it. It also allows me to use a 30' 14-50 extension cord, which has been very helpful on several occasions.

Since there is only a single device on any 240 volt circuit per NEC, neutral is effectively a ground anyway. Not "legal", but it works. Just make sure the inspector doesn't see it.

I can't see why the wall charger and the mobile would have different wiring (except gauge).

 

[rrolsbe]

I've used 10-50 and 6-50 plugs to a 14-50 outlet to power my mobile connector without problems. Technically a 10-50 is "wrong" since it's a neutral, not a ground, but I had no problems.

I made my own adapters. I have at least half a dozen plugs, all terminating with a 14-50 outlet, so the UMC 14-50 can plug into it. It also allows me to use a 30' 14-50 extension cord, which has been very helpful on several occasions.

Since there is only a single device on any 240 volt circuit per NEC, neutral is effectively a ground anyway. Not "legal", but it works. Just make sure the inspector doesn't see it.

I can't see why the wall charger and the mobile would have different wiring (except gauge).

Thanks for the info! I agree with your last statement but, from what I have read, the Wall Charger will not work on a 120V circuit. Would not make much sense using a 120V circuit unless is was a 50A 120V circuit (rare) but it would be nice if the Tesla Wall Charger would work on a 120V circuit. Thanks again!!

 

[davewill]

... You can always convert the outlet to a 6-50 and "officially" change the wire to a ground wire if you want to really do this the right way (and Tesla even offers a 6-50 adapter if you are using the UMC).

You could also just remove the receptacle and wire the Wall Connector directly to the modified circuit. It's also worth removing the wall plate and see if there is a separate ground wire already in place. In that case, you could change it out for a 14-50.

 

[ewoodrick]

Remember, that anytime you use an adapter, it will charger at the rate that the plug used in the UMC is set for.

 

[Walt14]

I have used the 10-30 dryer plug and 10-50 range plug to charge my M3.
My charge kit can with the 10-50 pigtail.

There are a few options for going from 10-30 to 10-50

I found this adapter recently: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00STD8CXC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Before I found this I used a dryer plug like this: https://www.amazon.ca/ALEKO-WDC4W30...r+plug&qid=1567735735&s=sports&sr=1-6-catcorr
and with a junction box made an extension cable with a 10-50 receptacle on the other end like this
https://www.amazon.ca/Leviton-279-S...a+outlet&qid=1567735832&s=sports&sr=8-2-fkmr2

 

[233.3]

You could also just remove the receptacle and wire the Wall Connector directly to the modified circuit. It's also worth removing the wall plate and see if there is a separate ground wire already in place. In that case, you could change it out for a 14-50.

This is what I was going to suggest. While you are looking for a ground you could also look at the wire size to see if it will support a 60 amp breaker. If so that would allow you get the most out of a Tesla wall connector.

 

[posity]

You need an adapter that connects between the neutral pin of the 10-50 and the ground pin of the 14-50 or it will not work on a Tesla (Tesla requires a ground connection and the 10-50 does not have one). A special 'cross-wired' adapter is required when connecting to either a 10-50 or 10-30 since neither has a ground connection. I carry one of these in my frunk: AC WORKS® [EV1050MS] Electric Vehicle Charging Adapter for Tesla Use (50A 10-50P Welder to Tesla). I use this 10-50 adapter more than any other: for some reason, 10-50 receptacles are very common at friend's homes here in the Pacific Northwest.

BTW, be very careful to check what size breaker is installed since I find many of these 10-50 receptacles installed with 30A breakers in the home: in that case, you need to manually reduce your charging amps to 24A. Electrical code does allow a smaller breaker to be installed on 50A receptacles, so every EV owner needs to be in the habit of checking the breaker size when connecting to a 6-50, 10-50 or 14-50 'in the wild'. If you find a 40A or 50A breaker, no need to mess with the amps settings on your Tesla, but if you find a 30A breaker, then be sure to reduce the setting on your Tesla screen to 24A (80% of 30A).

 

[doghousePVD]

Thanks for the info! I agree with your last statement but, from what I have read, the Wall Charger will not work on a 120V circuit. Would not make much sense using a 120V circuit unless is was a 50A 120V circuit (rare) but it would be nice if the Tesla Wall Charger would work on a 120V circuit. Thanks again!!

Not sure why anybody would want to run a wall charger on 120V. A 50A 120V circuit (6kw, usable only at 4.8kw) is REALLY rare. Why not just hack a mobile connector?

Your original post said nothing about running on 120V. You may know this, but a 240V line is two 120V hots 180˚ out of phase, usually called single phase.. A single 120V to neutral is properly called split phase.

A wall charger may work (at half capacity) on a 120V line. Without knowing the wiring diagram, I would be just guessing. If you test it, with the neutral connected to one of the hots, it may make a difference which hot is hot. IIRC, the wall connector is just a 3-wire connection (2 hots and ground), not a 4-wire with a neutral, like a 14-50.

 

[rrolsbe]

I know the UMC Gen 2 works with the old style hot hot neutral circuits but has anyone actually wired up any version of the Tesla wall connector with the neutral attached to the ground lug? I am pretty sure it SHOULD work but don't want to speed $500+ for a big pretty paperweight.

Thanks Very Much in Advance!
Regards, Ron

 

[Seth2020]

Have you heard the word of Elon? You will find all the answers you seek my son in this one book....

Installing a Wall Connector

 

[Rocky_H]

I know the UMC Gen 2 works with the old style hot hot neutral circuits but has anyone actually wired up any version of the Tesla wall connector with the neutral attached to the ground lug? I am pretty sure it SHOULD work but don't want to speed $500+ for a big pretty paperweight.

I don't think I can give you a completely confident 100% answer, but yes it should work.

However, the more important question is why did you create a new thread to re-ask this instead of just continuing your own thread you created in September 2019 to ask this question already?
Will 10-50P Plug work with Tesla Wall Charger?

 

[rrolsbe]

Thanks for the replies!

I started a new thread because the title was not correct on the first thread ie.. it is NOT called a Wall charger. I am almost certain someone has tried to connect a Tesla Wall Connector, hopefully with success, to a 10-50 wall receptacle. These were used in some welder applications and many older home garages/workshops were wired for such use; likewise, 10-50 circuits were used on some older kitchen ranges. I read the installation manual for the Gen 3 unit and I did not see an example of this particular wiring configuration ie.. Hot 120, Hot 120, Neutral. Since the neutral is tied to Ground at the service panel for this home-run circuit, it SHOULD look like a ground connection to the Wall Connector. i borrowed a friends Gen 3 unit to check fitment and cable length but did not want to risk connecting it to this power source.

 

[Tessaract]

The neutral from the 10-50 will only "look like a ground" if it is in fact connected to the HPWC ground lug. Since the HPWC does not actually connect to neutral, connecting the 10-50 neutral to the HPWC ground does look like a legit 240V with ground connection to the HPWC. AS LONG AS THE NEUTRAL IS IN FACT GROUNDED AT THE PANEL. It's extremely important that you verify the 10-50 neutral is in fact grounded, and there are no 120V loads or connections on this circuit, otherwise an electrical fault could result in your Tesla becoming electrically hot, with the obvious very bad potential consequences.

 

[mrau]

If it won't work with the Gen 3 wall connector, you can still buy the Gen 2 wall connector from Tesla for $475.

Silver Wall Connector - Gen 2

 

[Rocky_H]

The neutral from the 10-50 will only "look like a ground" if it is in fact connected to the HPWC ground lug. Since the HPWC does not actually connect to neutral, connecting the 10-50 neutral to the HPWC ground does look like a legit 240V with ground connection to the HPWC. AS LONG AS THE NEUTRAL IS IN FACT GROUNDED AT THE PANEL. It's extremely important that you verify the 10-50 neutral is in fact grounded, and there are no 120V loads or connections on this circuit, otherwise an electrical fault could result in your Tesla becoming electrically hot, with the obvious very bad potential consequences.

This is a very helpful explanation. Since 10-50 outlets would be a dedicated single wiring run, this should work perfectly well, with nothing trying to run current on that neutral wire. And as long as it is tied to ground in the panel, it should be staying solidly on 0V and not floating, and the wall connector shouldn't be able to tell any difference.

 

[rrolsbe]

The neutral from the 10-50 will only "look like a ground" if it is in fact connected to the HPWC ground lug. Since the HPWC does not actually connect to neutral, connecting the 10-50 neutral to the HPWC ground does look like a legit 240V with ground connection to the HPWC. AS LONG AS THE NEUTRAL IS IN FACT GROUNDED AT THE PANEL. It's extremely important that you verify the 10-50 neutral is in fact grounded, and there are no 120V loads or connections on this circuit, otherwise an electrical fault could result in your Tesla becoming electrically hot, with the obvious very bad potential consequences.

Very informative reply!

I will be powering the Wall Charger from the same circuit as used by my UMC 2 for the past 20 months. I verified all of the issues you mentioned before using the UMC 2.

Thanks Again