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Will Mercedes jump to level 3 before Tesla? Looks like it.
- Thread starter vapor trail
- Start date
Why are they choosing not to? They have released far worse software into consumer hands that don't seem safe without human supervision. Take Summon, for instance, it creeps at less than 1 mile an hour and still manages to hit things but they still chose to release it. If they had the capability they would release it and sell it for more than 12K.
Liability. Duh.
With summon, you need to have a complete line of site of your car and it’s surroundings at all time and they are very clear you are responsible for your car when under summon.
With level three driving, Tesla assumes responsibility for damages due to a crash while using the software.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Even if it is is 2 minutes of watching and 3 minutes of driving ?
Personally I’d consider 45 mph slow on freeways.
Won’t be driving in those conditions unless I have to.
Hence they can't, it is not a matter of simply choosing not to, it is a matter of capability. They have assessed the system and are not willing to take liability because the system is not to a point they are willing to assume responsibility for the risk.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
.... even with a "L3" < 38 mph car.That’s the kicker! You wouldn’t be driving in those conditions
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Looks like Mercedes is testing in Los Angeles (of course. haha).
They got rear ended on the 710 freeeway.
They got rear ended on the 710 freeeway.
Phantom braking?
Are you sure Mercedes are capable of braking...
Mercedes recalls almost 1m cars over faulty brakes
The German carmaker said the brakes of some older cars may be affected by "advanced corrosion".
www.bbc.com
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Mercedes is right to focus on the Californian market. Cars don't rust here.Are you sure Mercedes are capable of braking...
Mercedes recalls almost 1m cars over faulty brakes
The German carmaker said the brakes of some older cars may be affected by "advanced corrosion".
Mercedes is right to focus on the Californian market. Cars don't rust here.
Unless you live too close to the beach and all the salt air.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
It was implied that the Mercedes was not at fault (that it was accelerating at the time), but I do wonder either way if Mercedes will cover the repair tab for this given it was operating in L3 mode at the time. Basically does the car have to be deemed to be the "at fault" party for Mercedes to cover liability for accidents under L3 mode, or is it in all cases?
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure how California laws work but unless the Mercedes brake-checked the car behind it (highly unlikely if it was using autopilot) then this accident is virtually guaranteed to be 100% the fault of the driver behind.
Someone correct me but with the Tesla if your not in self drive and you just take your foot off the gas the brake comes on immediately. Obviously because your one petal driving. On a regular gas car the brake long only comes on when you hit the brake. So right off the bat I would expect Tesla vs ICE to trigger the brakes more often. With FSD it’s been my experience that the car uses the brakes a lot more - phantom braking example. That plus FSD putting on turn signals, then right on, then on again or going left but with a right turn signal on.
Now this specific incident likely has nothing to do with my comments above. But my point is that Tesla (and EV and other one petal cars) can be confusing and frustrating to regular drivers. Add in FSD and that makes it even more so. I can tell this by how other drivers respond to my FSD and how YouTubes show others responding.
FSD just doesn’t drive like a regular driver in an ICE car. If the driver behind is impatient I can see how more accidents happen this way. It’s not (necessarily) the Mercedes fault but you can see how it’s irregularities could contribute to the likelihood of it happening.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
Ok, you're wrong
(sort of)On most EVs when you take your foot off the accelerator you get slowdown from regen, not the mechanical brakes.
But this also happens on some (but not all) gas cars-- both actual regen on hybrids--- and engine/compression braking on pure gas cars (especially manuals with the clutch left engaged, or even automatics with thinks like sport shifting).
Why would Mercedes cover liability for accidents where they are not at-fault? The at-fault driver’s insurance would cover in that case.
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
No, not really. First, you need to distinguish between braking and deceleration/regenerative braking. Regenerative braking uses the motors as generators to slow the car. Under most conditions, Teslas decelerate, not brake. More importantly, though, they turn on the brake lights when deceleration exceeds a certain threshold. Someone driving a Tesla with one pedal driving will appear the same as any other car to the car behind it.
FSD behaving erratically certainly can confuse other drivers, but that is a completely separate issue.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Sometimes the at-fault driver runs away, as in this case. There are also cases where a car is technically not at fault, but they did something unpredictable that contributed to the accident (and in jurisdictions where there is partial fault this may play a factor).
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Good to see they are testing in real world conditions and not just the 5 minutes test they claimed was demanding. I guess they will be filing CA report showing miles driven, if they haven’t already ?
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