Will Tesla Continue to Increase Prices? | Tesla Motors Club Podcast #16

Co-hosts:

• Marc @lUtriaNt
• Louis @nebusoft
• Mike @SteelClouds

Producers:

• Adam @ElectricAve84
• James @scrapps
• Joshua @NoGasNoBrakes
• Doug @doug
• Daniel @danny

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[sleepydoc]

I think the answer to this partially lies in the blog post from today discussing the release of the Chevy blazer EV. An article in my local paper also discussed the Chevy Equinox EV & Nissan Ariya In addition to the EV4, Mustang Mach E, Kia EV6. All of these have starting prices in the mid 40s (except the Equinox which is reportedly in the $30k range.)

Many people will scoff and say “pfff! I’d never buy a Chevy!” but the reality is there are a lot of people who will. (If we’re honest, there are a lot of people who would never buy a Tesla, too.) There are also a lot of people who would rather have a Tesla but will happily consider a Chevy, Nissan, VW, Ford, Hyundai or Kia for $15-20k less. Those models will also initially have the benefit of the $7500 credit, further sweetening the deal for people.

Many of these are not yet released, so they’re not an option now but they’re on their way. The landscape is rapidly changing and Tesla can no longer count on being the only game in town. For supporters of EVs this is good news. EVs are becoming mainstream and the EV ecosystem will continue to expand. The competition will also benefit us all.

 

[unlock]

Interesting podcast guys. If you're going to use your podcast to flame a TMC member (which is pretty low) at least have the decency to reach out first to talk about the topic and to hear me out. Perhaps it could have helped you understand the context, instead of cherry picking things to push your narrative. Real mature guys. Real mature.

@IUtriaNt (Mark), to answer your question, no I don't use an iPhone and the gmail that I have is a junk mail account with fictitious info when creating the account. So your assumptions are incorrect. - It's laughable to see you so passionate about something you have no idea about, only to be proven wrong from the member that you were attacking. You sure do make a lot of empty guarantees. How do you expect people to take you seriously when you lack substance and integrity with your content? - You really need to learn how to read everything and to understand the whole context before commenting on things, because all you've done is just brought embarrassment upon yourself. Such a shame. Do you know what holding a double standard means? Maybe look that up...

@nebusoft (Louis), good on you for keeping an open mind. It's nice to see that not all in the cult have lost critical thinking skills. There are some level headed members here and that's a good thing. - You've outlined a couple of good points supporting the view from the other camp; one being stripped away from having the ability to use a feature if you don't opt in (forcefully) to use the in cabin camera. - The majority here with like feathers will flock together in having that, "I don't care about my privacy or anything" mentality. So be it, but it's important for you guys to understand that it's okay to have opposing opinions on this topic. Just because everyone is throwing in the towel to surrender themselves, does not mean that everyone falls into that cattle herd mentality.

@SteelClouds (Mike), I disagree with your comment about not having privacy to begin with, as that seems like an easy cop out that holds no weight due to it simply not being true. I found it pretty surprising to hear such a thing coming from a senior, who many usually look to with respect, while seeking wisdom. It's pretty baffling. - To be clear, there are ways to mitigate the invasion of your privacy, it's just that the majority don't exercise any of the available practices, which makes it seem like it's normal to not care. It's much easier to not give a rats about something and to just go on with your life, of course. However, does that mean that it's wrong to care about your privacy? No. If you truly believe what you believe, then why do you still lock your doors, close your blinds, use a pin for your bank cards and not wear your SS, DOB etc... printed on your T shirt and hat? - According to your logic, privacy is something we never had to begin with. I did not expect that to come from someone like you.

If you guys want to reach out and chat, then so be it, but please stop with the petty act of attacking a TMC member. By doing so you guys are holding a double standard which is wrong in itself.

It's okay to have an opinion and to have a healthy debate, but the way you guys approached this is just plain out wrong. Out of pure dececny if I were one of you three I'd reach out and apologize for what you've done. To be honest, I don't expect much, but just know that your podcast has degraded the integrity of TMC and what it's suppose to be about.

 

[SteelClouds]

I disagree with your comment about not having privacy to begin with, as that seems like an easy cop out that holds no weight due to it simply not being true. I found it pretty surprising to hear such a thing coming from a senior, who many usually look to with respect, while seeking wisdom. It's pretty baffling. -

Lets see if I can do this any justice.. there is a significant difference between "privacy" and "security". Privacy as we know it right now is a very recent invention, maybe 100-150 years according to the experts. We as humans have an instinctual desire for privacy but it's almost always trumped by money, connivence and so on. In other words, we are easily bought. Information privacy as we think of it started around 1900s.. kinda.. My own research for my family history has shown me a wealth of "private" information captured but not easily found at that time. Now it's a simple search on google.

Here is a great quote on privacy, " Privacy maybe actually be an anomaly" ~ Vinton Cerf - Co-Creator of DARPA prototype and Google exec.

I remember filling out as did my parents, warranty cards for various things not understanding at the time ( early 70s) just what we were giving away. And once given away, the genie is out of the bottle. Now it's tracking info from your smart phone, clicks on a browser, personal info from a loan doc, your home loan is a public record and all kinds of info can be gleaned from that. And so on and so on..

So just what are you going to mitigate? You will be the digital equivalent of the Dutch boy at the dike. Or worse, you will be locking the barn door while the entire back of the building is missing. Personal privacy in today's world is a lost cause. You can slow it down and maybe limit the damage but you cannot stop it nor stopper it back up.

You brought up pin codes, locking doors etc.. thats not privacy, thats security. And there is a significant difference between the two.

"The difference between privacy and security comes down to which data is being protected, how it’s being protected, from whom it’s being protected, and who is responsible for that protection. Security is about protecting data from malicious threats, whereas privacy is about using data responsibly"
Source

I'm very active and vocal about security.. that is something i can control and you need to control. But I cannot control who sees my home loan information, for example, so why bother? That is bought and sold all day long. yes, you can check "do not share" and Feel free to live in the world of unicorns and thinking that check mark matters.

I'm not sure if I'm offended being called a "senior" . My wisdom is not and has not generally been considered "mainstream". Because I tend to be very pragmatic about things vs following popular myths. Personal privacy in today's world is a myth. Security in today's world is something of a myth but it stems more from security is hard and most dont want to do the work.. even if it as simple as remembering a password that isnt 123456 or qwerty

 

[unlock]

But I cannot control who sees my home loan information, for example, so why bother? That is bought and sold all day long. yes, you can check "do not share" and Feel free to live in the world of unicorns and thinking that check mark matters.

Thank you for your response Mike. I appreciate it and I do agree with a lot of the points that you've outlined. It's true, a lot of our info is public data/record and there's no getting around that by default, unless of course the entity is structured and set up a certain way. That's for another time...

What you've said about, "But I cannot control who sees my home loan information, for example, so why bother? That is bought and sold all day long. yes, you can check "do not share" and Feel free to live in the world of unicorns and thinking that check mark matters." - ...

1. Those that see your home loan and private info are under strict rules and guidelines. It's not as easy as doing a google search to find sensitive info about someone's home loan in detail. (I'm referring to the actual sensitive info.) If it was that easy, that system in the mortgage world would be a hot mess. - Therefore, there are legitimate reasons to actually care/bother, since the entities dealing with / selling your loan etc... are institutions that are held under strict rules and privacy policies. - Note: This example may not be the best related to the topic at hand. Your mortgage company / banks / major institutions differs quite a bit from Tesla.

2. Regarding your statement: "...yes, you can check "do not share" and Feel free to live in the world of unicorns and thinking that check mark matters." - ... This is EXACTLY my original point and opinion about not trusting the fake elevator button to opt out of not sharing your data with Tesla. - I guess we do agree on something. That's how the ones that care about their personal privacy view the do not share button.

We can talk about privacy and security all day and although we may not agree on everything, I think we would be able to agree more on the topic in general than disagree.

The take away here is that you've described exactly how I feel about the opt out button. I agree that people can feel free to live in a world of unicorns and thinking that check mark matters. - 100% Agree.

It's also clear that many hold such a strong double standard without even realizing it. People like Mark clearly demonstrated that he thrives in self perpetuating himself to believe something that isn't true and to attack a TMC member in the process. Real mature. Bravo. What good does that provide for the community? - Very childish and very unprofessional. Some would call it 'ghetto.' That doesn't paint a good picture for TMC and if I were the owners of TMC I'd question his ability to be a face on the TMC's podcast. If that was one my employees he'd be fired in a heart beat.