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Will the second row seats fold flat? If so, how?

Zoomit

Active Member
Sep 1, 2015
2,245
4,276
SoCal
The third row can be folded without affecting the 2nd row seats. You just fold it up and leave it in-place. You also have the secondary option of flipping it forward to create a flat bed. I don't think the 3rd row will fold rearward. The seats in the Model S can do it, but they are kid-sized. Adult-sized 3rd row seats don't seem like they'd fit.
You might be right. There doesn't appear to be enough room aft of the 3rd row to fold the seats that direction. But just folding the 3rd seat back forward on to the lower portion will leave an incredibly awkward loading floor (make that volume since there won't be much "floor").
 

fengshui

Member
Nov 9, 2012
427
50
Santa Barbara, CA
You might be right. There doesn't appear to be enough room aft of the 3rd row to fold the seats that direction. But just folding the 3rd seat back forward on to the lower portion will leave an incredibly awkward loading floor (make that volume since there won't be much "floor").

Yeah, there won't be much room, but as least as much as your average minivan or SUV, with the 3rd row seats down and the 2nd row in-use.
 

Zoomit

Active Member
Sep 1, 2015
2,245
4,276
SoCal
I still think there's a distinct possibility of those seats going backwards into the space behind the platform aka the "Shopping Bag" space. I spoke with a Tesla employee at one time who mentioned the "magic carpet" third row. A mere forward folding doesn't qualify as magic or carpet.
The more I think about it, there's no way the 3rd row can fold forward. That mechanism would be a complete b!tch and would need gooseneck hinges that want to be exactly were the rear motor is located.
 

ZachShahan

Active Member
Dec 3, 2014
1,051
5,349
Sarasota, FL / Wroclaw, Poland
Also, I haven't seen anyone post a reasonable explanation on how swivel might actually work (90 degrees for easy exit/baby access, or 180 degrees a la Extant). Although I don't really think it's probable, at least having 90 degree swivel might be nice. The way it could possibly work would be for the outer second row seats to move forward and then up before swiveling (a piston raises it just a few inches). This would get the base and back out of the way from the middle seat so it could do the swivel. It looks possible given the pedestal system images, but I still find it unlikely. Guess we'll just have to wait for the real reveal.

That swivel action would be awesome. I hope that theory is correct.
 

J1mbo

Active Member
Aug 20, 2013
1,607
1,403
UK
Taking a closer look at the seat supports, they do seem to have some mechanism for folding the seat forward:

MOXtqBc.jpg


This may just be for easier rear access, but it does look like the 2nd row seat base is about the same depth as the 3rd row is high.

Something like this:

Front _/¬= Rear
 

jomo25

Active Member
Mar 16, 2012
2,105
226
Scottsdale, AZ
The cutout in the carpet does not seem that long, it seems long enough to move the 2nd row seat right up against the 1st row, but no further.
if the whole thing lowers, then it can move further forward. see how the pedestal is angled? so, the further it moves down, the further it can move forward. it may not be to the point of touching the front seat, but darn close.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think so. It looks like the second row is able to pivot 180 degrees vertically, from L to _|. That's ingenious.
How? there's no room for the seat cushions to rotate. and the pedestal isn't a circular cylinder. it's an oval cylinder.
 

jomo25

Active Member
Mar 16, 2012
2,105
226
Scottsdale, AZ
Three seats can't slip under 2 seats. There's nothing to slip under. The seats will just tilt forward (see my pic earlier #285).

The middle seat slips under the front center console. the S already has this space. (its where I put temp cupholders today). If its similar sized (or even slight larger) then the middle seat can definitely slip under there too.
 

jomo25

Active Member
Mar 16, 2012
2,105
226
Scottsdale, AZ
A lot of you seem to be forgetting to consider child/infant cart seats. Speaking as an adult with children, by far the biggest pain the butt with rear seats is dealing with car seats.

There is additional opportunity for innovation here beyond the swivel out seat idea that would be consistent with what we are seeing (although still highly speculative). For example, it might be possible that the 2nd row seats can tilt forward to face the floor to provide increased cargo room when needed, and if so it could do it without removing the infant car seats (in which case it should probably only be operable from the seat itself so that it would be next to impossible to do it with a baby in the seat).

Second, there are places where 2nd row cup holders could go, but most of the time, I would have child seats in the middle row, and if I needed some extra seats for adults or teenagers, they would sit in the 3rd row. Now hopefully they were able to give the 3rd row enough head room, but I wouldn't count on it. But either way, I'm not removing the infant car seat if I don't have to, so any extra adults or teenagers are going in the back. So cup holders in the back, good. Cup holders in the middle, don't care. Also, there might eventually be a middle seat console that can be used for extra storage and cup holders.

Third, it would be nice if there was a way to improve access for the 3rd row. If the 2nd row seats can tilt forward, that helps, but again you would have to tilt the entire seat because there will most likely be an infant seat there.

So the whole 2nd row not folding thing could be in no small part due to infant seats. You can't recline seats with infant seats in them, nor can you fold them, without removing the infant seat. Perhaps Tesla has integrated cool ways of making life with infant seats better, and that's reflected in the 2nd row design.

All of this is all just my own personal speculation based on what we see so far.

Dealing with children is a huge part of most adult's lives, and if Tesla is trying to cater the X to people with small children, it seems reasonable that finding ways to make hauling children easier would be high on the priority list for whatever magical miracle fairy dust seating they are trying to come up with.

PS: I'm not sold on the submarine idea, because it would likely conflict with the front seats when the front seats are reclined. There are solutions to that, like forcing the front seats to sit back up straight (reasonable considering the level of software integration), but there would likely be other obstacles like child toys on the floor that would make it very problematic.

The tilting will make car seats easier, particularly the infant seats so as to make sure the recline angle of the seat is proper. SO instead having to adjust the carseat or base (to get the level indicator right), you could tilt the whole seat to line it up.
 

sub

Active Member
May 24, 2013
1,484
2,431
Sonora California
I'm sure Tesla had the rear seat co figuration figured out, just as I'm sure they can get doors and a door handle to line up. Toyota figured out how to stow 2 rows of rear seats in my 1994 landcruiser after all.

As for review mirror wiring, why could they not run it inside the glass like a rear window defroster?
 

Blurry_Eyed

MS Sig #267, MX Sig # 761
Dec 29, 2011
588
308
Another theory about the third row. What if the mechanism in the middle of the 3rd row allows the bottom of the seat to fold up vertically and then stow the whole seat into the back part of the trunk? You take off the headrests and then you have a flat spot that allows for taller items to be carried? When I was at the Model X reveal in 2012, the height of that back space was impressive. If you look at the video of the reveal on Tesla's website, you can see how much luggage they packed into the back trunk area. Remember there is no exhaust or fuel tanks back there, so I could potentially see the 3rd row tucking away neatly into the back trunk area for increased carrying capacity.
 

GasDoc

Member
Nov 15, 2012
806
492
SF Bay Area
I'll buy your 3rd row theory. But not your 2nd row one.

I guess we'll find out soon enough. Notice how flat the back of the second row seats are. I think they'll rest on the ground. I just can't see how the second row can submarine below and spoon up against the first row.

Being no hinge on the second row seats so the backs can recline, I think that those are the only two options; rotating and laying flat or lowering and spooning.
 

GasDoc

Member
Nov 15, 2012
806
492
SF Bay Area
BUT...the interior picture shows that there's no way for the seats to rotate flat!?! They can't fold and the for/aft travel of the pedestal is evident. They're not going to rotate back and expose the leather to cargo and they can't rotate forward for a variety of reasons which should be obvious.

There are two options for increasing the cargo volume rear of the 2nd row: 1) translate the seats forward at the sitting height, or 2) partially submarine the seats underneath the front row.

They could rotate counterclockwise such that the leather on the backrest is facing up. Then the third row could fold and extend forward, covering the secnod row, leather to leather, exposing the back and bottom of the third row as the cabin surface.
 

dirkhh

Middle-aged Member
Jul 7, 2013
3,638
126
Portland, OR, USA
They could rotate counterclockwise such that the leather on the backrest is facing up. Then the third row could fold and extend forward, covering the secnod row, leather to leather, exposing the back and bottom of the third row as the cabin surface.
The Origami car. I'd love that.
 

Zoomit

Active Member
Sep 1, 2015
2,245
4,276
SoCal
I mentioned this earlier, but this thread is long and moving fast. The 2nd row looks like it has adjustable (retractable) thigh support. The only reason that would be worthwhile is if those lower seats really needed to be short and low in front (e.g. submersible).
 

Zoomit

Active Member
Sep 1, 2015
2,245
4,276
SoCal
They could rotate counterclockwise such that the leather on the backrest is facing up. Then the third row could fold and extend forward, covering the secnod row, leather to leather, exposing the back and bottom of the third row as the cabin surface.
Nope--the hinge mechanism would be worse than the doors and would need to be where the motor is located. Plus the lower portion of the 2nd row would severely limit the incline of the front row.

3rd row folds aft like a minivan
2nd row submarines like nothing before
 

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