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Window damaged trim because of cold weather, Tesla won't replace under warranty

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That's just not a valid excuse to me. Tesla shouldn't strive to be the same as other cars. I think it's a fixable problem, even if it's not in my car but in newer ones they manufacture. Maybe they're working on it. But a handful of people here seem to think they shouldn't bother.

It has been explained in other comments that Tesla has specifically addressed cold weather issues in the past, whether this is changing up the locking procedure with regard to the charge port, or with the direction of air-flow during preheating. Others have suggested to use silicone lubricant to keep the window from sticking, and have pointed out that this has been used for years to combat similar cold weather issues on other vehicles.

I, personally, don't see this as any different than someone expecting Tesla to add cold weather rated washer fluid to the vehicle. I certainly wouldn't be blaming Tesla if my washer fluid froze to my windshield, I'd be kicking myself for forgetting to add the proper fluid before winter.
 
So, to reiterate:

In colder/icier weather, if you even SUSPECT that the windows won't move down when opening the door, be sure to use the "Vent" function first, to make sure. If any window fails to drop, don't open that door until you've fixed the issue.
 
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I don't think you can consider frameless windows a design flaw.

They may not be a "flaw" (although I think they are), but I think they are the single worst design "choice" Tesla made in the design of Model S! They are first of all, unnecessary, and serve no purpose that I can see. The car is not a convertible or coupe, so why try to make it look like one? And second, they complicate the design of the window lift mechanism and the door latches, necessitating this set of actions to raise or lower the window each time the door is opened or closed. Hence, unnecessarily extra wear and tear on the mechanisms and lower long-term reliability. They don't seal as well, adding to the air leaks and noise. And finally, you get into these winter situations that require extra steps and extra care before you can safely open the door of the car and drive off.
A conventional window frame would have been a much smarter choice and would have avoided all these issues. I am amazed and disappointed that this poor choice was repeated on Model X and Model 3 after what they should have learned from model S.
 
I had a very annoying back and forth yesterday with Tesla due to my chrome also being damaged. Somehow the door was able to open but when closed the window was 1/4" above the frame. It appears that the "fix" Tesla implemented last year to slightly lower the window in cold temperature did not activate. Anyway, this is their response:

"Good afternoon, Our website has helpful tips for cold weather - you will want to reference this using the following link: Winter Driving Tips . As this is expected behavior in cold weather, it is not a defect and we would need to quote you on the replacement of the chrome if you wish to have this changed out?"

Interesting that their "tips" don't acknowledge the possibility that you might have to defrost or scrape the door windows before unlatching the door....
 
They may not be a "flaw" (although I think they are), but I think they are the single worst design "choice" Tesla made in the design of Model S! They are first of all, unnecessary, and serve no purpose that I can see. The car is not a convertible or coupe, so why try to make it look like one? And second, they complicate the design of the window lift mechanism and the door latches, necessitating this set of actions to raise or lower the window each time the door is opened or closed. Hence, unnecessarily extra wear and tear on the mechanisms and lower long-term reliability. They don't seal as well, adding to the air leaks and noise. And finally, you get into these winter situations that require extra steps and extra care before you can safely open the door of the car and drive off.
A conventional window frame would have been a much smarter choice and would have avoided all these issues. I am amazed and disappointed that this poor choice was repeated on Model X and Model 3 after what they should have learned from model S.

There is a rather distinct difference between disagreeing with Tesla's design choice, and concluding that their design choice is responsible for damage to the car...requiring repair on their dime. That was more the spirit of my initial comment.

I agree that frameless windows are a mostly aesthetic consideration rather than a practical one.
 
They may not be a "flaw" (although I think they are), but I think they are the single worst design "choice" Tesla made in the design of Model S! They are first of all, unnecessary, and serve no purpose that I can see. The car is not a convertible or coupe, so why try to make it look like one? And second, they complicate the design of the window lift mechanism and the door latches, necessitating this set of actions to raise or lower the window each time the door is opened or closed. Hence, unnecessarily extra wear and tear on the mechanisms and lower long-term reliability. They don't seal as well, adding to the air leaks and noise. And finally, you get into these winter situations that require extra steps and extra care before you can safely open the door of the car and drive off.
A conventional window frame would have been a much smarter choice and would have avoided all these issues. I am amazed and disappointed that this poor choice was repeated on Model X and Model 3 after what they should have learned from model S.

Just imagine if the chrome were built into the door frame instead, - you'd need to have extra seams... and then can you imagine also the number of complaints about chrome not lining up? GAWD! The horror...
 
every frameless window car i've ever owned didn't have to roll down the windows to open the door. it was a design "feature" Tesla decided on to reduce wind drag. most frameless windows "leak" after a while. my assumption is Tesla chose this design to prevent that.

My Porsche 911 Targa frameless windows never had a leak or wind-noise, or even freeze shut with normal ice buildup. Only once in five years did they have to be "re-programmed" when the car's 12volt battery was replaced, that's about it. Compared to the Model 3, the Porsche's rubber seals felt very robust, with a pre-formed/indented "channel" for the window glass to engage into and make a positive seal. whereas the Model 3 glass just "sits" against the rubber seal, which I think could lead to leaks and wind noise issues.
 
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every frameless window car i've ever owned didn't have to roll down the windows to open the door. it was a design "feature" Tesla decided on to reduce wind drag. most frameless windows "leak" after a while. my assumption is Tesla chose this design to prevent that.
Had a Boxster with frameless window that automatically lowered before opening the door. That said I never had anything around the window break on the Porsche in the Swiss winter.
 
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So, to reiterate:

In colder/icier weather, if you even SUSPECT that the windows won't move down when opening the door, be sure to use the "Vent" function first, to make sure. If any window fails to drop, don't open that door until you've fixed the issue.


So now I have to walkthru the process to everyone like my wife and kids and whoever else would open a door when using the car. Seems ridiculous.

All I'm saying is Tesla should be more proactive with new owners about the issue. I now know about the lube for rubber seals because of the incident, they should make owners aware before the issue happens...maybe a message on the screen before the winter hits.
 
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It would be one thing if the door straight up didn't open, but why does it let you open/close it and damage it? How is that not a design flaw? Surely a car that can drive itself can detect that the window didn't go down. There's no way this is a completely unsolvable problem.
Would you really want to be completely locked out of your car because the window was frozen? And once the door is open, there’s nothing it could do to stop you from closing it.

Maybe a giant flashing red light on the screen and a warning noise to notify you that the window isn’t down far enough would be a good idea.
 
There is a rather distinct difference between disagreeing with Tesla's design choice, and concluding that their design choice is responsible for damage to the car...requiring repair on their dime. That was more the spirit of my initial comment.

I agree that frameless windows are a mostly aesthetic consideration rather than a practical one.

I sure hope that Tesla is not foolish enough to use this type of design on the pickup truck or on the semi-truck. Truckers won't put up with this sort of nonsense!
 
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Very disappointed as newcomer to this board to see the tone of attacking each other. I'm looking for the definitive, constructive wiki-like collection of wisdom about how to make this car lovable in winter.

I'm new to M3 + winter in Montreal, and for the last two weeks in still mild early winter conditions I've not been able to get into my car more than once out of 6 times without extended trouble. I've got silicone applied now but it's going to be freeze-thaw all winter (climate change), so I'm terrified. I do not have a garage. Many car owners here (downtown Montreal) rely on street parking, and EV owners can use the public chargers, which is what I've done so far. But it takes 50km of range just to heat the car enough (after desnowing/de-icing) to get the door open, and I know that's not going to work when it starts getting colder. I can't get into the trunk either because the gap around that is completely full of ice, and we haven't even had an ice storm yet. One is coming in two days. My scrapers and any other tools or substances cannot be stored inside the car if I may have no way inside. I hoped to use this car for outdoor adventure activities, but cannot yet see how this will work without anxiety.
I take to heart that many seem to have figured it out. And I know all cars are trouble in winter, so I don't much care about blame for design. What I care about is having better information and more ideas, and all in one place. And it surely isn't the superficial advice on Tesla's "winter driving tips" page!
In addition, software could clearly help a bit. Right now I cannot set the air optimally onto the windows from the app using recirc. This could be changed with a "open door"-optimal pre-heating mode, separate from a "defrost windscreen"-optimal mode, etc.
 
Very disappointed as newcomer to this board to see the tone of attacking each other. I'm looking for the definitive, constructive wiki-like collection of wisdom about how to make this car lovable in winter.

I'm new to M3 + winter in Montreal, and for the last two weeks in still mild early winter conditions I've not been able to get into my car more than once out of 6 times without extended trouble. I've got silicone applied now but it's going to be freeze-thaw all winter (climate change), so I'm terrified. I do not have a garage. Many car owners here (downtown Montreal) rely on street parking, and EV owners can use the public chargers, which is what I've done so far. But it takes 50km of range just to heat the car enough (after desnowing/de-icing) to get the door open, and I know that's not going to work when it starts getting colder. I can't get into the trunk either because the gap around that is completely full of ice, and we haven't even had an ice storm yet. One is coming in two days. My scrapers and any other tools or substances cannot be stored inside the car if I may have no way inside. I hoped to use this car for outdoor adventure activities, but cannot yet see how this will work without anxiety.
I take to heart that many seem to have figured it out. And I know all cars are trouble in winter, so I don't much care about blame for design. What I care about is having better information and more ideas, and all in one place. And it surely isn't the superficial advice on Tesla's "winter driving tips" page!
In addition, software could clearly help a bit. Right now I cannot set the air optimally onto the windows from the app using recirc. This could be changed with a "open door"-optimal pre-heating mode, separate from a "defrost windscreen"-optimal mode, etc.

I'd have that looked into. It's been just below freezing or around in Ontario for the past week and a bit and I only had issues maybe once in the morning.

I park outside all winter and typically have maybe a handful of incidents. Usually pushing down on the window (I know not recommended) or using a plastic credit car to clear the window works and I don't have to thaw for 30 minutes.

I've never had the door not open just not be able to close is all. (It's possible one door didn't open once due to me not generally using the rear doors but I've never been stuck out of the car).
 
To add to those ideas so far, I'd like to:
- put wipers in service mode from the app (for when I forget), or just set them do do that always when I park
- have more heating options on the app
- maybe app control for leaving the windows slightly lower when close, to avoid OPs original problem.

But posting these here isn't the right place...

Okay, now I keep track of apparent bugs and also feature requests here:
Issues · Christopher Barrington-Leigh / Tesla bugs · GitLab

Also, I've started a wiki, where good ideas can be curated, rather than dispersed in posts.
Advice for winter · Wiki · Christopher Barrington-Leigh / Tesla bugs · GitLab

If these community tools already exist somewhere, I'll happily go there.
Anyone can join to contribute, by signing up for gitlab, or sending me contributions.
Ideally, the wiki at least would represent distilled advice from this forum, for instance.
 
every frameless window car i've ever owned didn't have to roll down the windows to open the door. it was a design "feature" Tesla decided on to reduce wind drag. .
My former 04 350Z had frameless doors and opened the windows slightly upon open and raised them slightly after closing.

It did spend some in an area where it would snow (for maybe a few days or weeks out of the whole year) but I had no snow tires so the car would be parked during such weather.
 
My scrapers and any other tools or substances cannot be stored inside the car if I may have no way inside.

Just getting over the worst winter dump here in Ontario, and although a lot of icy snow collected above the rear trunk door, I was still able to unlock and fairly easily open the rear trunk lid to access my ice scraper stored there. My recommendation: store your snow brush/scrapers in the trunk of your Model 3 instead of in the passenger compartment of the car.
 
My issue is that the outer seal was not iced at all. The inner lower seal was iced and stuck to the window. I had to insert a credit card almost all the way to scrape the ice and break the connection. Why is so much water infiltrating the seals?.
 
Very disappointed as newcomer to this board to see the tone of attacking each other. I'm looking for the definitive, constructive wiki-like collection of wisdom about how to make this car lovable in winter.

I'm new to M3 + winter in Montreal, and for the last two weeks in still mild early winter conditions I've not been able to get into my car more than once out of 6 times without extended trouble. I've got silicone applied now but it's going to be freeze-thaw all winter (climate change), so I'm terrified. I do not have a garage. Many car owners here (downtown Montreal) rely on street parking, and EV owners can use the public chargers, which is what I've done so far. But it takes 50km of range just to heat the car enough (after desnowing/de-icing) to get the door open, and I know that's not going to work when it starts getting colder. I can't get into the trunk either because the gap around that is completely full of ice, and we haven't even had an ice storm yet. One is coming in two days. My scrapers and any other tools or substances cannot be stored inside the car if I may have no way inside. I hoped to use this car for outdoor adventure activities, but cannot yet see how this will work without anxiety.
I take to heart that many seem to have figured it out. And I know all cars are trouble in winter, so I don't much care about blame for design. What I care about is having better information and more ideas, and all in one place. And it surely isn't the superficial advice on Tesla's "winter driving tips" page!
In addition, software could clearly help a bit. Right now I cannot set the air optimally onto the windows from the app using recirc. This could be changed with a "open door"-optimal pre-heating mode, separate from a "defrost windscreen"-optimal mode, etc.
I live in Montreal, and had my Model 3 all last winter (delivered Nov 2018) and I park on the street and use public chargers. I had two instances of frozen windows before I applied silicon lubricant to the seals and after that I did not have any issues. I never had an issue gettting into the Trunk or Frunk. YMMV.

Honestly last winter with the model 3 wasn't that big a deal.
 
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