With driver watching a movie, Tesla on autopilot crashes into state trooper's cruiser - Aug 2020

[Dan D.]

I bet if you take a poll of every Tesla driver (excluding those who read the TMC AI forum) you're going to find a majority who vastly overestimate the capability of the "auto.." features.

None of these people expected to crash. People damaging their car on Smart Summon didn't expect the car would hit their garage, trees, curbs. It was stupid to watch a movie while driving... so why did they do it?

They trust the product, despite the disclaimers that everything has. My toaster is within 6" of other things and the cupboards are likely closer than the manufacturer specifies, and the crumb tray hasn't been cleaned in ages but no fires yet. I'm stupidly trusting they were exaggerating the risk. AP/FSD and some other Tesla features are NOT exaggerating the risk, the risks are real, but most typical people likely can't understand that.

 

[Dewg]

None of these people expected to crash. People damaging their car on Smart Summon didn't expect the car would hit their garage, trees, curbs. It was stupid to watch a movie while driving... so why did they do it?

So true - there is a psychology to it for humans. A situation that overrides our logical processes. For example - people will pick their noses in their cars, as if the glass windows all around the car somehow prevent people from seeing them. Or is it that they feel the inside of their car is personal/private space that no one has the right/ability to peer into? Some people who are very mild mannered in public, will act aggressively in their car because they think they are anonymous and there will likely be no repercussions for their act. How many videos are there of people who look down and start texting on their phones, and then crash into other cars while doing it... They know it's not a good idea to do so, but they think "it can't/won't happen to me". Sadly, it does.

 

[Barklikeadog]

I believe it requires driver inattention.

Then why did it apparently fail?

 

[Daniel in SD]

Then why did it apparently fail?

Because it doesn't work 100% of the time? Sort of like every other safety feature on a car.

 

[Barklikeadog]

Because it doesn't work 100% of the time? Sort of like every other safety feature on a car.

What % do the airbags or seatbelts work as designed?

 

[Daniel in SD]

What % do the airbags or seatbelts work as designed?

What are airbags and seatbelts designed to do? Prevent injury and death.
Airbags and seatbelts do not work optimally for every collision. Say deploying with more force would have saved a life in a specific collision. Is that a failure of the design even if fixing it would result in more people dying in other collisions? Of course not, all these systems are compromises.

 

[COS Blue]

Does Automatic Emergency braking require driver attention?

I believe it requires driver inattention.

Or a shadow in the road

 

[EVNow]

What % do the airbags or seatbelts work as designed?

Seriously we have forgotten about the huge airbag recall ?

Takata Recall Spotlight | NHTSA

Check for Takata airbags safety recalls, get your airbag repaired and stay informed by signing up for airbag recall alerts.

www.nhtsa.gov

 

[Bouba]

If we take this moron’s case and exam it..he must of had some experience of autopilot before he decided to watch a movie...so his experience must have been good enough to give him confidence...even if his threshold for danger is low.
So...I would call that a win for autopilot

 

[Bikeman]

If we take this moron’s case and exam it..he must of had some experience of autopilot before he decided to watch a movie...so his experience must have been good enough to give him confidence...even if his threshold for danger is low.
So...I would call that a win for autopilot

The Moron part is correct, for sure. But a win for autopilot? That's not even a stretch. It isn't a win for anyone. Just more bad press for Tesla, and a cop could have lost their life. AP might have driven him around for a while OK, but when it really counted, failed spectacularly when it couldn't recognize a stopped police car with flashing lights.

 

[terranx]

I bet if you take a poll of every Tesla driver (excluding those who read the TMC AI forum) you're going to find a majority who vastly overestimate the capability of the "auto.." features.

None of these people expected to crash. People damaging their car on Smart Summon didn't expect the car would hit their garage, trees, curbs. It was stupid to watch a movie while driving... so why did they do it?

They trust the product, despite the disclaimers that everything has. My toaster is within 6" of other things and the cupboards are likely closer than the manufacturer specifies, and the crumb tray hasn't been cleaned in ages but no fires yet. I'm stupidly trusting they were exaggerating the risk. AP/FSD and some other Tesla features are NOT exaggerating the risk, the risks are real, but most typical people likely can't understand that.

I mean that’s probably part of the problem. Most products we use in our day to day lives generally do have rather exaggerated warnings and when a certain usecase truly can be particularly dangerous, they usually make it very difficult or impossible to use. I do eat raw cookie dough, I eat sunny side up eggs and rare steaks, I do stick qtips in my ears, etc. Autopilot on the other hand gives you a one time warning, tells you it’s only intended for use on limited access highways, and then let’s you do whatever you want. Sure we can argue that’s ultimately the responsibility of the driver, but fact is for several decades now we’ve all been conditioned to accept most warnings as legal CYA measures that have little bearing on how you actually use/consume a product.

 

[Bouba]

I mean that’s probably part of the problem. Most products we use in our day to day lives generally do have rather exaggerated warnings and when a certain usecase truly can be particularly dangerous, they usually make it very difficult or impossible to use. I do eat raw cookie dough, I eat sunny side up eggs and rare steaks, I do stick qtips in my ears, etc. Autopilot on the other hand gives you a one time warning, tells you it’s only intended for use on limited access highways, and then let’s you do whatever you want. Sure we can argue that’s ultimately the responsibility of the driver, but fact is for several decades now we’ve all been conditioned to accept most warnings as legal CYA measures that have little bearing on how you actually use/consume a product.

That’s a fair point...the amount of warnings on consumer goods has been rising ever since that woman sued McDonalds because the filling of their Hot Apple Pies was hot....I think my last car had a warning not to drink the battery acid.
However driving is covered by one all encompassing law...the driver is responsible. A bit like the boxing rule of protect yourself at all times

 

[OncomingStorm]

That’s a fair point...the amount of warnings on consumer goods has been rising ever since that woman sued McDonalds because the filling of their Hot Apple Pies was hot....I think my last car had a warning not to drink the battery acid.
However driving is covered by one all encompassing law...the driver is responsible. A bit like the boxing rule of protect yourself at all times

side note, the McDonalds thing.... it was an elderly lady who suffered 3rd degree burns on her crotch from nearly boiling coffee... she incurred 80k in medical bills and because of some technicality had to sue in order to get her medical bills covered by insurance. McDonalds slandered the crap out of her in an attempt to discourage people from suing them even tho they ultimately admitted fault. might be wrong a some of the details but thats the gist... gotta love our corperate culture that makes it ok for a cooperation to slander a nice old lady lol but i digress...

 

[MABMAB]

Man, you all are being completely being played worrying over the video.
AUGUST 2020

old news, brought forth by whom?

 

[Bouba]

side note, the McDonalds thing.... it was an elderly lady who suffered 3rd degree burns on her crotch from nearly boiling coffee... she incurred 80k in medical bills and because of some technicality had to sue in order to get her medical bills covered by insurance. McDonalds slandered the crap out of her in an attempt to discourage people from suing them even tho they ultimately admitted fault. might be wrong a some of the details but thats the gist... gotta love our corperate culture that makes it ok for a cooperation to slander a nice old lady lol but i digress...

Man Sues Over Apple Pie: A British...

Man Sues Over Apple Pie: A British man who alleged he was scarred for life by a McDonald's apple pie that squirted blistering hot filling onto his arm said Thursday that he is suing the fast-food chain.

www.latimes.com

I agree that some of my facts were slightly wrong

 

[serendipitous]

I think it's clear that AP fosters a false sense of confidence and allows drivers to pay less attention and get away with it 99% of the time - and things like this are the 1%. My curiosity is whether, overall, the increase in people being willing to pay less attention is offset by that 99% vs 1% success rate... In other words, people drive distracted in other cars and have accidents all the time, too - so is the overall tradeoff still positive if 10% more people drive distracted, but the AP car is actually 50% safer than an average human driver (who might also be distracted or look at their phone). Tesla's stats imply that this is the case, but there are obviously huge statistical flaws in how they draw their conclusions. But my suspicion is that the conclusion is still true.

 

[COS Blue]

Man, you all are being completely being played worrying over the video.
AUGUST 2020

old news, brought forth by whom?

It was in the news because they just released the dashcam footage (from the trooper, I guess).

New dashcam video shows a Tesla on autopilot crash into a North Carolina state trooper's cruiser in 2020.

 

[Barklikeadog]

What are airbags and seatbelts designed to do? Prevent injury and death.
Airbags and seatbelts do not work optimally for every collision. Say deploying with more force would have saved a life in a specific collision. Is that a failure of the design even if fixing it would result in more people dying in other collisions? Of course not, all these systems are compromises.
View attachment 767608

I don't see that Warning in the owner's manual, I see 7 other ones, though.

Automatic Emergency Braking​

Model 3 is designed to determine the distance from a detected object traveling in front of it. When a frontal collision is considered unavoidable, Automatic Emergency Braking is designed to apply the brakes to reduce the vehicle's speed and therefore, the severity of the impact.

Warning
Never depend on Automatic Emergency Braking to avoid or reduce the impact of a collision

 

[S&B's M3]

Interesting info on Devainder Goli... If they are one in the same, not sure I want to be treated by him...

https://health.usnews.com/doctors/devainder-goli-209909

 

[Huskyf]

It's a two years old story ! 2020