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Wow, I can blow through tires

Discussion in 'Model S' started by fasteddie7, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. fasteddie7

    fasteddie7 Member

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    What on Earth am I doing wrong? I drive around 25,000 miles a year. I have done two "annual" service appointments so far this year, and both times I had to replace my tires. Is this normal? I purchased the good year 19s both times. Should I be buying a different tire or is there no way to avoid this in a 75d? I am not a heavy foot and rarely speed. My commute averages 45mph and that's what I stay at. Any advice?
     
  2. mspohr

    mspohr Active Member

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    With a username of "fasteddie", I don't think you can plausibly claim to "rarely speed" and not have a "heavy foot" :)
    OTOH, my past experience with Goodyear tires on my Porsche has been very poor. I just don't think they make very good tires.
    I've been running the Michelins (and Pirelli winter tires) and have good results with them.
    If you have RWD, they tend to wear out more (on acceleration, not speed).
     
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  3. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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  4. bishoppeak

    bishoppeak Member

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    You clearly have an alignment problem.
     
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  5. fasteddie7

    fasteddie7 Member

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    I get it aligned every service appointment so 2 alignments on one year.
     
  6. fasteddie7

    fasteddie7 Member

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  7. Don85D

    Don85D Member

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    You didn't describe the wear pattern that causes the tires to be declared unsafe and need replacement. Toe-in settings are critical to avoid premature wear. If on the other hand, wear is even across the tread and down to the wear bars just stay away from performance tires. They are very soft and not suited to daily use, in my opinion.

    Find a touring tire with a higher wear rating and keep a set of track wheels and tires for competition (like Solo 2) if that's your thing. We found that it was best for my wife's Miata to have two sets of tires for different purposes.
     
  8. essmd

    essmd Phantom X

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    My Model X ruined 4 Michelin 20's purchased from Tesla after 4K miles, and the service techs said... "that the price for driving a premium EV vehicle"...

    So lessons learned:

    1) Never buy Michelins, which are known to be softer rubber, and despite the weight rating, do not last on heavy EVs. Continentals and Pirellis tend to do better.

    2) Set the suspension lowering at speeds to "Never", since the camber increases as the car lowers, accelerating abnormal wear on the inner tread. Even cross-rotating will result in a "pointy" tire. The range hit is insignificant.

    3) Check the alignment every 5K miles, as for some reason MX's seem to move more than other suspensions, even without bad road conditions

    4) You don't have to buy from Tesla, but all of their tires come with the foam sound-insulating strip (as far as I have seen), but not convinced they actually offer any quieting benefit
     
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  9. fasteddie7

    fasteddie7 Member

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    I'm sure I can make time to drive out two hours to the service center two extra times a year for an software update and alignment. Is this a courtesy or do they charge for the alignment?
     
  10. patrick40363

    patrick40363 Member

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    You are doing nothing wrong. it depends on the roads you drive. I have an 85D and get even wear on all 4 Michelin 19's but they only last 12K miles. I get a new set every year. The cost is minimal as the tire warranty covers a lot of the cost.
     
  11. fasteddie7

    fasteddie7 Member

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    Is the warranty specific to the brand of tire? No one at the sc mentioned anything about a warranty on the Goodyear's that I have purchased from Tesla.
     
  12. LoL Rick

    LoL Rick Like Buttah

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    First, check your tire pressures. They should be in the neighborhood of 41 to 45 psi and I've seen repeated incidents of a Tesla service center setting them at 34. The techs should know better but apparently some of them don't.

    Second, Goodyear does not offer a treadwear warranty on these tires. So you don't have much recourse for this round.

    For tire alternatives, you can look at Goodyear Eagle RS-A2 or Michelin Primacy MXM4 which were the original standard and upgraded OE 19" tires until late '15 or so. The Goodyear does not have a treadwear warranty, but it is priced about $70 per tire below the Michelin and the new foam lined Goodyear version. That is what I have and they're so cheap I don't mind replacing them often. Performance is decent as well. The Michelin has a 55K mile prorated treadwear warranty and is priced about the same as the new foam lined Goodyear, but I believe you do not get that warranty if you buy through Tesla.

    Shop around on some online tire sites like tirerack.com and you'll find some other alternatives. But then you have the issue of whether or not the Tesla service center will install the tires on your car. We've had numerous reports of service center staff refusing to touch aftermarket wheels or non-OE tires. If you go with one of the Goodyear or Michelin tires I mentioned above, they might be ok with putting them on your car even though the tires are not the spec for your model year. That's kind of a gray area and you would have to ask.

    Of course the other alternative is to find another shop to put the tires on. If you do that, you should print out some instructions for them regarding placing the car in jack mode, carefully using the lift points to avoid battery pack damage, using hand tools only to avoid damaging the chrome lug nut caps, and using the proper torque spec of 130 ft-lb. Some places will be fine with special instructions and some won't - use your spidey senses. I've found a very good mom-and-pop shop that is perfectly fine with special instructions, let's me supervise the whole procedure, and even allows shipments from tire rack.
     
  13. patrick40363

    patrick40363 Member

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    tesla doesn't have a tire warranty but the tire manufacture does. Go to you local tire store and they can check. If you have even wear they should take care of you. I go to Americas Tire in CA.
     
  14. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    More information needed. Are the tires worn down across the entire tread evenly, or are they being replaced based on wear to a portion of the tire?

    (The former is the expected end case and only affected by the tire design and the driving pattern and mileage, the latter is indicative of a problem with suspension setup or tire inflation levels, and would be more common for repeated rapid replacement.)

    The RWD cars on 21" rims were known for eating tires quickly even if the suspension setup is correct as well as for toe in problems, but the D cars mostly hold on to 19" rubber pretty well from everything I've read.
     
  15. LoL Rick

    LoL Rick Like Buttah

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    Goodyear does not offer a treadwear warranty on the tires that Tesla uses. After a little more searching I found this page that shows which tires have it. The Eagle family has only a handful of versions on there, and none of them are ours.

    Goodyear Tread Life Limited Warranty | Goodyear Tires
     
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  16. fasteddie7

    fasteddie7 Member

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    2016 refresh September car. Spring suspension. Rear tires wear pretty even front tires wear down with the inside tread on the tire wearing faster. Checked with service center they aligned them twice a year. Do I need to go more often for alignment and is there a cost for Tesla to do that? I keep the tries at 45 psi religiously.
     
  17. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    Unless the car is getting battered by potholes or curbs or the like, it shouldn't need frequent realignments - the alignment isn't something that should change without an incident.

    Maybe you can get the actual alignment results from the Service center for the alignments that have been done, and see what they show - presumably the car is within specs or you would have heard something before, but is it at the nominal or near one limit? has the setup changed between alignments?

    The inside wearing faster would typically be an indication of toe out or high camber, neither of which would be normal for the car as far as I know, but I'm not an expert in Tesla Suspension alignment settings.
     
  18. Zeromus-X

    Zeromus-X Member

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    I've got a 2016 refresh 70 with springs, so sort of close to your build. My Goodyear Eagle Touring tires lasted right at about 33,000 miles before I just changed them out. The fronts were at 3/ and the rears were "very low". I didn't do a single rotation all year. (Oops.)

    If you didn't have a good experience with them you probably want to swap them out anyway, but I can tell you that I drive on some pretty subpar roads at high speeds (Oakland is not exactly known for its roads) and didn't run into issues. When I went tire shopping I found these replacements but without foam for $139/ea. I couldn't possibly justify spending $200+ each on the Primacies or more on the Pirellis when I got that many miles out of these ones. I will also say that I notice literally no difference between these tires with and without foam, but maybe many years of concerts have simply ruined that audio range for me!

    Goodyear doesn't offer tread life guarantees but many places offer it, either bundled or as a separate service. Sam's Club includes it for free I believe, and Discount Tire was around $40 per tire if I wanted it. (I declined - at $160, I could literally buy a replacement tire and get it installed, so it wasn't worth the risk.)
     
  19. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    The effect of the foam is pretty subtle. Another test I read a while back said the overall difference was about 1/3 of a decibal, but with stronger effect on certain frequencies. I like the one I just found from Car and Driver better, though - pretty graphs and all:

    Tested: Do Acoustically Insulated Tires Really Hush Road Noise?

    As you can see, it damps the higher frequency tire rumble pretty well, but doesn't really have much affect on the overall noise level.

    Edit: For reference, a 200 Hz tone, and a labelled frequency sweep:



     
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  20. Zeromus-X

    Zeromus-X Member

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    Oh I'm sure there's a measured difference. I worked as a sound engineer for about ten years. This is both a blessing in that I'm very quickly able to find frequencies resonating oddly, and a curse in that I'm very quickly able to find frequencies resonating oddly. :) To my ears I hear no difference, but those ears are getting older every day.

    Any difference in noise is easily masked in my opinion by other atmospheric noises (wind noise, other vehicle engines/tires) or internal noises (conversation, radio). The non-foam ones are $139 and the foam ones were around $250 each. A third of a decibel isn't worth $111 and the inability to easily have leaks patched, IMO.
     
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