WP - Utilities thrilled and worried

[malcolm]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/11/22/AR2010112200017.html

Last year, Americans spent $325 billion on gasoline, and utilities would love even a small piece of that market.

Nationwide, utilities have enough power plants and equipment to power hundreds of thousands of electric cars. Problems could crop up long before that many are sold, though, because of a phenomenon carmakers and utilities call "clustering."
Electric vehicle clusters are expected in neighborhoods where:
- Generous subsidies are offered by states and localities
- Weather is mild, because batteries tend to perform better in warmer climates
- High-income and environmentally conscious commuters live
...The "nightmare" scenario, according to Austin Energy's Rabago: People come home from work on a hot afternoon, turn on the air conditioner and the plasma television, blend some frozen cocktail, start cooking dinner on an electric stove -and plug their car into a home charging station.

Er, so why not plug the car in after you finish cooking? Or the timer switches it on later that night?
It seems to me that if people buy electric cars, then that suggests that they are open to the concept of optimising recharging both for the anticipated mileage of the following day and via cheap rate electricity. You don't have to or need to fill the "tank" as fast as possible each evening. Pricing structures could be introduced to encourage more grid-friendly recharging behaviour.

 

[vfx]

The "nightmare" scenario, according to Austin Energy's Rabago: People come home from work on a hot afternoon, turn on the air conditioner and the plasma television, blend some frozen cocktail, start cooking dinner on an electric stove -and plug their car into a home charging station.

I don't remember any complaints when plasmas came out.

A pretty balanced article though.

 

[ChargeIt!]

Right. It's FUD (the on-peak simultaneous charging argument).

BUT .... utilities (together with local permitting authorities) must also figure out how to cost-effectively encourage that off-peak usage. And I mean COST EFFECTIVELY ! It is *NOT* cost effective to require a second meter (or dual meter adapter) if it costs the homeowner (or apartment renter via the landlord) a ton of $$$, because
-- an new panel needs to be installed;
-- a service upgrade (100A to 200A for example) is required because of some unfavorable "simultaenous use" of all appliances (what they want to sell as a "load analysis");
-- the new meter or monthly charges associated with it rob you of the off-peak rate energy cost savings.

I am seeing/hearing of too many situations where the panel upgrade (or other cost expenditures) is not really "needed", because the homeowner/EV aspirant understands about the added load and is willing to compromise with a time-shifting strategy. Panel upgrades and other related costs can run into the Thousands of $$.

Utilities must find a more cost effective solution by combining the use of smart meters and (many) EVSE's built-in energy use reporting. Unfortunately the utilities are in almost all cases ignoring the EVSE's features because they are not "revenue grade" (not good enough for them).

Or ... why not use smart meters to distinguish load types ? Avoids that whole second-meter stuff. I know there's some of that in progress. But let's hurry up already ... And standardize methods across the thousands of utility companies across the USA.

Or ... cut the customer some slack. Yes there will be some abusing the privilege ... but simply assume (or estimate or extrapolate) the new add-on usage (from the EV) over historical billings is the EV and gets billed favorably.

Or ... install the second meter (subtractive billing) for free or at minimal cost to the customer.

If the utilities agree to make it easier (read: cost effective) they will gain those new "customers" (EVs) in a hurry.

 

[roblab]

Having charged a RAV4EV for years (my only claim to fame), I am really really tired of having to haul around a charger. One of the smartest things Tesla has done is to make the motor controller also the charge controller, as if it were a regen charger. They continue to tell me that I will be able to plug into my 14-50 outlet in the garage, or at any RV park, or my brother's house, or, well, golly, where can you find electricity???. I DO NOT plan to advertise my EV to the county or city, OR to the Electric Company, but they can still sell me any electricity I don't make off my roof arrays. (yes, I have battery storage, too.) Let's see, No charger, No permits, No electrician's fees, Hmmm. I must be some kind of pinko commie, right? (Yeah, that shows my age, too.)

 

[SByer]

Oh, I'm there with you. The EC does not know I have an EV, and it does not need to know. I replaced a couple of things with more efficient alternatives (e.g., a 300w halogen floor lamp with a 75w fluorescent torchiere) and based on usage, those simple bits of efficiency more than make up for what the Roadster uses. It really doesn't take a whole lot.

 

[TEG]

http://www.lilithnews.com/2010/11/electric-cars-brownouts.html

 

[vfx]

Having charged a RAV4EV for years (my only claim to fame), I am really really tired of having to haul around a charger....

All Rav4 owners who want to keep their cars need to mount their chargers in the car or on the tire rack. Might as well do it now to take advantage of all the J connectors that are coming.

 

[rolosrevenge]

There are several intelligent charging strategies that can solve this problem and actually increase utility system flexibility to help handle the problems of lots of wind power on the system. I have been doing my PhD research on this and have several papers accepted, soon to be published, that show that with a little control this "nightmare" scenario will never happen. This control will also translate into lower electricity rates for charging your EV so everybody wins. I would post the papers here but I signed away the copyright to the IEEE. I will post a link though when they become available online.

 

[JRP3]

The previous homeowner had a single day/night meter installed and put the hot water heater on a timer. Between 11PM and 6AM all power is at a reduced rate. I'm not sure why it would need to be more complicated than that. The only problem is that my EV uses so little power I barely notice the difference no matter when I charge, but I'm never drawing more than 20 amps at 240 volts so it's not much of a strain on the grid.

 

[malcolm]

I don't remember any complaints when plasmas came out.

Tesla have been thinking along the same lines: http://www.teslamotors.com/forum/forums/how-we-see-it-%E2%80%93-tesla-evs-and-grid

The energy demanded by most plug-in vehicles during charging (about 2 kilowatts) is the same amount drawn by four to five plasma-screen televisions. In just the U.S., 115 million households own televisions, and more than half own two or three -- yet you never hear about consumers and utilities panicking about TVs disrupting the grid.

Analysts predict that only 500,000 EVs will be produced around the world every year, starting in 2015. Continuing with the television comparison, the half million cars added every year to the world’s supply will use about as much power as 2 million plasma TV sets. To put this in context, about 28 million televisions are sold annually in the U.S. alone.

 

[Jaff]

Good stuff Rolo!

When you get your paper completed, you should send it to the radicals at lillith news ( http://www.lilithnews.com/2010/11/electric-cars-brownouts.html )...I think it is important to correct websites that post FUD when possible and it sounds like you're certainly qualified to do so. :smile:

There are several intelligent charging strategies that can solve this problem and actually increase utility system flexibility to help handle the problems of lots of wind power on the system. I have been doing my PhD research on this and have several papers accepted, soon to be published, that show that with a little control this "nightmare" scenario will never happen. This control will also translate into lower electricity rates for charging your EV so everybody wins. I would post the papers here but I signed away the copyright to the IEEE. I will post a link though when they become available online.